Public Relations

[Beta]

Thought we could use a thread to discuss some of the interesting public discussion going on and to make sure we are all on the same page.

One quote from nbarclay struck me - where he said "Vox now stands alone." This is exactly what we want them to believe. RP and Lego will not publicly support us - but privately and in-game they will.

GoW's support will be known soon enough. NeuD will stay on the side-lines publicly - or still aligned against us. In reality - everyone is pulling for us. But GS does not know that.

So do not dispute any of this. Let them think we are a lunatic fringe nation which has taken on the whole world. It may lead them to under-react somewhat. They probably have no idea of our finances.

And Witt's idea to keep us on the continent was brilliant. It has worked like a charm.

There is some great reading out there.

[Konquest02]

It may not show, but I think our public relations are doing pretty good right now...! Let's try to keep them as is!

[Wittlich]

I concur with Konquest

[Beta]

Yes - I agree. GS is in a good fight with themselves right now.

I so much wanted tp post this, but thought better of it. So I thought I would post it here for your reading pleasure:

"I think that the people of the Storm have been stuck in the flood plains of South Estonia for a millenia too long. The effects of continual in-breeding are clearly evident.

Liberating and educating them should help their people."

[Beta]

OK guys - I just had to write this. The GS comments were just getting to be too much. But I want your OK before I post it.

History 101 - A message to GS

OK. This moral high-ground that GS is claiming is just getting too nauseating. Take off your rose-colored glasses my friends, and lets look at some history.

Let's go back to the early days. You were over a barrel and we both knew it. We had bronze and iron working, and contact with the continent. You had none of these. In the spirit of co-operation - and I acknolwdge the other tensions which existed - we made the early trade which gave parity to the military situation. And don't mention chariots, as with mountains and jungles from coast to coast - we both knew you could not get at us.

We then signed the trade pact, and we shared technology - by whatever means we obtained it. And we provided contact with the continental civs. We did not hold our early advantage over you; we saw it as an investment.

So let's review this trade arrangement, and who got what out of it. Here are the facts.
---------------------
Vox to GS:
---------------------

bronze working
iron working
warrior code
mysticism
mathematics
horseback riding
philosophy
monotheism

total - 71 research points

other -

75 gold - Lux situation
contact with GoW
contact with NeuD
contact with RP

--------------------
GS to Vox
--------------------

the wheel
alphabet
writing
literature
code of laws
republic

total - 65 research points

other-

8 gold - part of previous trade (HB Riding)
20 gold - Vox map making (still owing)


I have excluded the recent currency and construction trade - because as you will recall, we had indicated to you that we would provide these. And in fact we could have if necessary.

And you still owe us the 20 for the map-making deal - as you gave in to GoW's demand for a no-trade clause over our trade agreement, forcing us to pay for it, and then not sharing in the costs. We have asked for these funds on three separate occasions. If you would care to forward them to a neutral 3rd party, I am sure they would pass them on to us.

So, now that our starting position advantage of contact with the continent is gone, and your starting position advantage of terrain has taken hold, this treaty no longer works for you. And spare me the talk about cancelling it with advance notice . You have already modified it once without notice - I recall that we had little choice. And we have heard the snippets back from various sources about how we are no longer much of a research and trading partner - and therefore no longer needed. You were planning on dropping us from the trade deal. Spare me the denials on this one.

And there was the land situation. This was a treaty reached early on, when tensions were still high. GS has more or less readily acknowledged that the split of land is not fair - but that this is the way it is going to be. You will recall the chat, Nathan. Their advantage of geographic starting position gave them the right, in their view, to claim the majority share of the land on Estonia.

And there are the observers. Most of the observers, including all of ours, are situated near the border areas. However, GS claimed the right to have one 6 tiles inside our territory, on a mountain, and with the ability to oversee everything which moved between North and South Estonia. We have a city south of this observer. Vox was not given any reciprocal advantage of this nature. You can imagine how insulting this was to have 'big brother' watching over you.

Then there was the Lux situation. Yes - 150 gold from the Luxian treasury was provided to Vox. And yes - you guessed it - Gathering Storm - so worried about the upset of balance of power on our continent from a barely breathing civ- demanded and was given 75 of it. They did nothing; nor contributed anything to Lux's survival. They did insist that Lux could not keep any troops in the city and kept an observer to make sure that didn't happen.

I admit - from my own personal perspective - that the one strategic and moral error that Vox has made was in eliminating Lux. That is a long complex story which will come out in due time. The blood is clearly on our hands.

Then there was our attempt to settle Bob. And GS has mentioned in this thread how they were so supportive of our efforts and how could we forget that. Well guys, writing about is fine - its a bit like a strat forum post. But you see when NeuD and GoW support each other - they show up with swordsmen and horsemen. At no time did GS ever offer any substantive support of any kind - either militarily or monetary.

Shiber has also mentioned these 'errors' that our team has made. Well - yes - we are a small team - none of us are builder/infrastructure specialists. But we have learned quickly. That was one of the purposes of the game, was it not. And we did not start with the expertise that GS did. We admit that. But if we had not put our efforts into building the road that we did, or putting a city in the far south to claim the land - I suspect we wouldn't even have that territory to work with. So, unless you were playing this game from our perspective, you might want to hold your comments about what was right or wrong for Vox to have done.

As I wrap up, I admit that the GS observer warrior did not move to our road. He was taken out where he has stood - in Voxian territory - for all these years.

In conclusion, if you want to know why this war is occurring, read the history from someone else's book, not your own. And get off the moral high-ground. You have no right to be there either.

Saying that, I fully acknowledge that we will all have different perspectives on what has transpired. What is key - as Churchill said - is that history is written by the victors.

And two final points.

This is a game. Let's remember that.

And finally - if you have any comments or complaints - please talk to an Immortal. There is one coming soon to a neighborhood near you.

[Eli]

Looks good.

[Konquest02]

Your avatar is great, Eli... I doubt that it will imrove our public relations (at least with GS). Great shot nevertheless!

[Konquest02]

A bit OT, after this I'll stop!
Speaking of avatars, while browsing the culture filp formula thread, I fell on this avatar:

http://apolyton.net/forums/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=17388

Have fun!

[Beta]

Good one!

[HarryH]

I am a little concerned about telling everyone everything. In some ways I would like to save all this for the history books after the game, but maybe its not a bad thing to do it now. It will sure make for some interesting discussion. It's pretty hard to tell what the political fallout will be.

One thing that has bugged me about the Lux-gold-to-GS deal is that they demanded (yes, demanded) the gold even though no techs were involved and they did not consider our costs of loaning the city. In the end we got very little and they got 75 gold for free.

[Wittlich]

I like your letter Beta. I say post it.

[Beta]

Thanks for the support guys. I have tweaked it a bit - and added a paragraph specifically directed at some of the personal attacks, and posted it. Let em chew on that for a bit.

I find Sir Ralph particularly annoying. I had a run in with him earlier - yes - when Eli made that load boo-boo earlier on - I find him both condescending and self-righteous. I find it kind of humorous that he quit the Inter-siteDG because he didn't like the way things were running. And Theseus went on this long rant about how could we screw up so bad to let such a fine person and player like Sir Ralph leave the team. I wanted to throw-up it was so nauseating.

Kon - can you speak up in Sir Ralph's defence on this. What am I missing with this guy?

Shiber has surpised me by his stance as well. We have to get him off that team before they totally subjugate his personality.

Anyways - I put a paragraph in defending us as a team - and our actions. This judging the individuals on a team by what has gone on in this game is ludicrous. They need some serious perspective.


And Eli - I have been laughing all night at your Avatar. Great stuff.

[argha]

I was going to say post it, but i just looked into the public forum and saw that you did. did you guys see the post from ghengis?

When did the Glory of War spit in your face? You want to start a war with us too? Has GS sudden built its army and now wants to take on the whole world by itself?

[Beta]

Yes - I think Ghengis is positioning himself for the right point when he switches sides - and it will not appear to be the kind of back-stabbing that ours has been portrayed as. He is playing it subtle here.

He may also have been looking for the public reason to get into and argument with GS - and therefore some excuse for war.

[argha]

I agree completely, that was very good on his part, of course he seems to be very canny player