[ooc] Roleplaying Problem

[ThePlagueRat]

Originally posted by Ninot


In this town of Madrid, I'm sure you'll find support

Perhaps also outside Madrid?
Dear señores, my familia grande streches it's roots overseas.
At the office of Don Plagiãtes, Sicilia, he might find suspicìoso supporto extravagante. if he pays well.
They can also "persuade" certain solicitors into certain doings.

Personally I would not be directly involved. Anyway, I possibly can't be. Since I'm off to an importante expiditiòne pretty soon.

[History Guy]

I shall seek justice from the only law in this land...the Great Lord Togas, compared to whom we are all as flies!

[Togas]

It should be noted that in these ancient times there are no "civil rights" and very little Justice other than "an eye for an eye." Life and death has little meaning. No one has a right to anything, and the most powerful individuals make the rules and enforce them violently if necessary to maintain their control.

We should be warry as the only sorts of disputes that I'm likely to hear are between two equals who are of enough importance (like two wealthy merchant families) that I feel the matter needs to be resolved.

Disputes between a person of power and a "tribesman" are settled by the person with power, and there's rarely any appeals about the matter to anyone, especially since death cannot really be appealed.

I know the court cases can be a lot of fun and excitement, but we should be careful as future "problems" may not be resolved in such a mannor. A leader of the civ may just decide for execution to save time and trouble.

I'm a pretty generous leader right now. This could change if I ever have a Tyranical Son.

--Togas

[mrmitchell]

Life and death has little meaning.

So the possible investigation of Senor Pikesfans(?) death should be dropped.

However, Thug was property, and that was important!!!

[Togas]

Originally posted by mrmitchell
So the possible investigation of Senor Pikesfans(?) death should be dropped.

However, Thug was property, and that was important!!!

Speaking entirely out of character here:

I felt that the Mitchell vs. History Guy dispute was bound to happen at some point, as the rival Calamari storylines were flaring up, and settling a dispute between these two important merchant families is something I felt the Despot would want to do.

Not all disputes will be taken up. In fact, I've instituted a new policy in the EDICTS thread.

As for Pikesfan, you should drop it. Already resolved with Mitchell paying the funeral costs and the cook taking a plunge down the waterfall.

--Togas

[History Guy]

[OOC, I believe we are overlooking fact. Ancient Kings [b]did[/] care if they had a governor who was creating unrest and abusing his priveleges. Alexander the Great had many problems with such guys, and killed alot of them. If this is strict roleplay, we can either have 1) A completely corrupt government where there is no law, or 2) A more enlightened government, like that of Hammurabi or Alexander, which does indeed have a law and if you break that law you are punished. I prefer the latter.

If we follow the latter, we must actually create a system of laws. The Sumerians, the first civilization, always had a law code. If you commited murder, you were executed. If you threatened one's life, you pay the man money, or if you were an official under the king and abused your power, you paid alot or lost your position (if you weren't just killed).

Historically, leaders have always been mindful of the fact that a corrupt government which allows corruption in their ranks and it goes noticed by the public and creates unrest cannot stand. Machiavelli tells us this, and it has always been thus, as he notes. [/OOC]

[pikesfan]

O Señor Calamari,

I thank you for your concern for my uncle’s death, but I have already caught the badsquid and given him to the Wise and Just Despot, who will have the badsquid thrown off the waterfall. Please, you need not bother yourself about the matter any longer. My family will always gratefully welcome you if you or yours should ever decide to visit our valley in Los Piraneos.

Jordí Pikesfan

[pikesfan]

Originally posted by Togas

As for Pikesfan, you should drop it.

--Togas

unwritten subtext

... or I shall drop you and next time it won't be off a soft landing waterfall ahahaha!

[pikesfan]

Originally posted by History Guy
[OOC, I believe we are overlooking fact. Ancient Kings [b]did[/] care if they had a governor who was creating unrest and abusing his priveleges. Alexander the Great had many problems with such guys, and killed alot of them. If this is strict roleplay, we can either have 1) A completely corrupt government where there is no law, or 2) A more enlightened government, like that of Hammurabi or Alexander, which does indeed have a law and if you break that law you are punished. I prefer the latter.

If we follow the latter, we must actually create a system of laws. [/OOC]

[OOC] We haven’t invented Code of Law yet. That could be the roleplay. The Despot right before Code of Law could be so corrupt that his son is ashamed, or at least gets so sick of the work he had to do restoring order that he sets his wise men to invent something to stop this, so they invent Code of Law. [/OOC]

[History Guy]

True, but even the earliest cultures had a standard law code. The Sumerians had one since pre-4000BC, and there's evidence that other cultures had such before then.

[ThePlagueRat]

ooc:

If we are to use polls on amending these laws in the future,
we don't have to wait until researching (modern) democracy to make some roleplay of that.

We could actually begin that during the ancient era.
Just as the Greeks did in their days of philosophy.
Then we can arrange mass meetings, (a polling thread)
and the despot becomes a demagog or something?

[Ninot]

OOC:
Threats upon a life are not abuse of power

and publically, before i threatened you, i never abused my powers once.

I dont really think that there was any abuse of powers. It was nice to use as a rallying point, but a commoner can threaten just as well as a Governor. Nothing special involved.

Now the wonderful way Togas backed me up... that was just a beautifully elegant use of his supreme power, to back up my less-then supreme power.

[pikesfan]

Originally posted by ThePlagueRat
ooc:
We could actually begin that during the ancient era.
Just as the Greeks did in their days of philosophy.

OOC
Well, no. We will 1. have to wait for philosophy to do this, and 2. it still could not be a poll during the age of Despotism. Instead, once we invent philosophy, some of us could be philosophers and have philosophical discussions about what would happen if we changed the laws. If the Despot, or the City Governor is enlightened, he will listen to us, but if the he is not enlightened, he will invite us to drink squid ink.

Polls have to wait for Monarchy, where the city governors could poll among themselves, or for Republic, where we all as heads of families get to vote.

[ThePlagueRat]

To wait until philosophy is allright. That's what I meant too.


But one thing is clear from ancient history:
One does not need the republic to arrange mass polls.
Anyway, that was just the case with the Romans .

[ThePlagueRat]

Originally posted by Ninot

I dont really think that there was any abuse of powers. It was nice to use as a rallying point, but a commoner can threaten just as well as a Governor. Nothing special involved.

ooc:

As you say, some of the members of my clan, the Plagiãtes,
even takes steps to pose a threat to the dicator himself.
As when they publically requested mercenaries from the GoW.
Its a cool way of roleplaying life in a totalitatian regime,
while confusing everyone outside.


My current character Pedro does not theat anyone.
He is an explorer and dedicated to service for the Spain,
but his family is kinda "mafioso" though.


To emphasize, Pedro is always loyal to his family and clan.
Moreover, he do respect the power of the dictator so that he can do what he likes to do... Go out and explore!