Announcement

**zeit** · January 17, 2003, 07:30

Well, what about the Vox roading effort south of the isthmus?
are we going to just let them go on, when we have no way of blocking their roading effort all the way towards the jungle (and even beyond). It doesn't seem like they appreciated our falling back... (and i asked myself back then- what's the point in gestures of goodwill, when Vox certainly doesn't care about these kind of notions). Having only one warrior up there is IMHO an unnecessary risk.

**nbarclay** · January 17, 2003, 07:55

Originally posted by zeit
Well, what about the Vox roading effort south of the isthmus?
are we going to just let them go on, when we have no way of blocking their roading effort all the way towards the jungle (and even beyond). It doesn't seem like they appreciated our falling back... (and i asked myself back then- what's the point in gestures of goodwill, when Vox certainly doesn't care about these kind of notions). Having only one warrior up there is IMHO an unnecessary risk.

What do you propose doing with the second warrior?

**Shiber** · January 17, 2003, 08:12

There's a 2 tile-wide choke point which we could block momentarily, in order to delay Vox's roading efforts. Should we try this?

Btw, isn't it great how Vox's worker is building a road instead of improving their territory? So what if they'll have a road to us, they probably won't have a lot of immortals to attack with (with their lousy starting location and poor allocation of workers and other resources).
At the end of the day, the smart economists emerge triumphant.

**nbarclay** · January 17, 2003, 08:21

Originally posted by Shiber
There's a 2 tile-wide choke point which we could block momentarily, in order to delay Vox's roading efforts. Should we try this?

Btw, isn't it great how Vox's worker is building a road instead of improving their territory? So what if they'll have a road to us, they probably won't have a lot of immortals to attack with (with their lousy starting location and poor allocation of workers and other resources).
At the end of the day, the smart economists emerge triumphant.

If we block them, we pretty much ruin our chances of leveraging a good relationship with Vox in the early game to help us relative to the other teams. I view Vox as too useful to us in the short term and not likely enough to be dangerous in the long term for it to be worth our antagonizing them. And that goes triple before the second part of our two-stage trade deal goes through, while they could use our "aggressive" actions as an excuse not to honor a deal that would give us a military technology.

In any case, by the time Slash could get back and into position, their worker will be finished and moved on to his next project. If they're planning to road into the two-tile-wide area, we can't stop them without violence.

**Harovan** · January 17, 2003, 09:20

We decided to go the way of peace and trade, at least for now. This needs a certain amount of trust at both sides. To block them now and box them in would be inacceptable for them. Imagine, if they would do this with us, what would we do? And who of us would be the loudest to scream war?

We can't afford this approach. The minimap trade so far has shown, that probably at least 3 of the other civs are at the same continent. They most likely trade techs and already are advanced, compared with us. We need Vox as trade partner, and we need our resources to expand instead of building, maintaining and reinforcing huge invasion armies.

Let's for this time show Vox, that we are good and reliable neighbors. Try to make them trust us, and try to show them, that we trust them. That means in no way, that we should not build armed forces, but all we need at the moment is a small, efficient militia, that could hold off a small sized Voxian army (they can't have a huge army yet), till our economy is switched to war production.

**DeepO** · January 17, 2003, 12:25

I agree in full, Sir Ralph.

DeepO

**alva** · January 17, 2003, 14:12

I agree, but we could use this to bargain. Afterall they gain from it, so we should too.

**nbarclay** · January 17, 2003, 14:43

Originally posted by alva
I agree, but we could use this to bargain. Afterall they gain from it, so we should too.

Use what to bargain? And use it how?

**Dominae** · January 17, 2003, 14:56

I believe alva is referring to our ability to block the isthmus, if we so choose. The problem with bargaining with this is that we would be implicitly stating that we do not trust them (as mentioned above), which is bad.

Dominae

**alva** · January 17, 2003, 15:21

Dominae is correct, but do we think they trust us now, or if we don't block the isthmus they will.
Thay didn't change their mind about exploring our south, until they saw more warriors popping up then they expected.
If they are building a blood path, we do good on delaying them as much as possible.

**nbarclay** · January 17, 2003, 15:34

(1) We don't have the ability to block the isthmus at this point.

(2) Even if we did, how would our blocking them be any less bad than what they did to us exploring while blocking us from exploring? If we regarded their actions as worth fighting over, shouldn't they regard ours the same way? Not to mention the hypocrisy that would be involved.

(3) Once we get writing, Vox is our gatekeeper to foreign contact. That alone is a good reason to keep on good terms with them for the time being.

**alva** · January 17, 2003, 15:47

I want to reamain at peace with VOX too(for now), with have to keep looking at things from more then one angle IMHO.

If we regarded their actions as worth fighting over, shouldn't they regard ours the same way?

True, but in the end, no war was started. They got a (minor) victory over us. Nothing holds us from doing the same thing.

Not to mention the hypocrisy that would be involved.

Just call it politics

**nbarclay** · January 18, 2003, 02:11

Turn's here. Guess I get to play another one.

**nbarclay** · January 18, 2003, 02:22

Team Scores:

65 (+1) Gathering Storm
76 (+1) Demogyptica
65 (+1) Glory of War
70 (+1) Role Play
62 (+0) Vox Controli
58 (+1) Lux Invicta
74 (+2) Legoland

Four turns of +2 for Lego. I wonder whether they've used the settler they built recently yet.

Announcement

Turn 35

Turn 35

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