Glorious Threads!

[Donegeal]

Originally posted by UnOrthOdOx
The source of all the GoW Dtrategy jokes:

Started by GF: 3-20-03 thread topic: War Council: Dtrategy and Tactics

GF:

UnO:
GF:
MZ:
various reactionary posts:
Don:

And GoW henceforth went on with Dtrategy. [/QUOTE]

hey, Uno... check your source. MZ didn't join till after the Bobian War...

[UnOrthOdOx]

I did check, that was him. :shrug:

[DeepO]

Is this the analysis you guys based everything on? 28 immortals, over 11 turns? In 11 turns Vox was nearly gone, and we built something like 50 units or so. And it wasn't even hard to do. If they would have had 28 immortals right next to Grog, they would have had a big chance, but this is not the way you fight wars in MP... you have to stack, prepare everything beforehand, and time it so one big wave hits an opponent. If you start by dividing your forces, they will never have a chance of striking decisively.

If I find the time, I'll check for some of our threads. We figured Vox had 20 immortals ready right then, possibly even 25. Ourselves, we had 10 warriors or so, and one veteran spear. 4 turns later, our army had more than doubled, all vet units. It wasn't hard to win against immortals, it was hard to lose.

BTW, Vox had one very good decision in this war: they built warriors on Estonia, upgrading them in D-ville (the road between the iron source and their other cities was cut). An excellent tactic to keep producing both warriors and immortals. Only, if your advisary spots this, you're supposed to protect your weak supply lines which they failed to do... half of the setup was perfect, the other a huge mistake. But no need to bring that up again, they paid enough for that flaw.

Actually, come to think about it, Civ really is a game where a small mistake in a wrong situation can be fatal. And as you can't prevent those mistakes from being made, the whole game centers around avoiding those situations the best you can. Dividing defenders along your weak spots, taking certain losses when you otherwise have a chance of losing all, things like that.

DeepO

[DeepO]

Oh, and we perhaps talked about our strength, but I think you had too much Beta propaganda there. Our force was well below theirs, but well above yours atm... and because we switched everything to military production (and had the most cities by far), we caught up very soon.

I distinctly remember a chat with Lego at the time, when we were talking about a tech deal in the first turn after the invasion, and I was like "ohw, Vox has invaded but no biggy. We'll lose a bit of units, we'll maybe lose 3 cities (the worst case scenario we drew), but after that we're ready to deal with you again." They were totally surprised why we weren't begging for more gold to help, I was totally surprised we were seen as the underdog given the situation and our units.

DeepO

[Rhothaerill]

Originally posted by DeepO
I was totally surprised we were seen as the underdog given the situation and our units.

Overestimation of the power of Immortals perhaps. Great on offense, but on defense they die just as easily as a sword or spear.

[UnOrthOdOx]

Yes, you schooled allot of us on home defense in that little invasion.



You have my gratitude in showing us how it's done.

[Donegeal]

More on GoW/RP Relationship.

Started on Jan 4, 2003 by HE: Spies

HE: Just a quick post ....

I was lurking in the chat room..(I had the GOW sig on me)..and snapped this message from Togas to Trip.

I think it should of been a private one.

I have no idea what deal he was talking about...

Oops .. no attachments allowed right !!

I will email it ...

Togas to Trip -> We may have a better deal for you - GOW is trying to change their deal

GF: I just got a nasty email from Togas:

What the hell?! Don't you guys have any patience?
You'd rather make a deal with ND than with us?

We just wasted 5+ turns of TWO of our scouts to try to urgently contact you guys, and we told Lux that we had aquired Warrior Code from you, so we didn't need it from them. Hell, we TURNED DOWN other nations to trade with you guys only to discover that your people don't have the same respect for agreements with us as you just got Bronze working and are now trying to tell adaMada that the deal has to be changed!

And all this time you've been sending us emails confirming that the "deal was still on", leading us on, so all the while we held to the deal and didn't buy either tech from anyone else because we agreed we would buy it from you.

This is a very dishonorable way for a team to act, especially when you expect us to trust that you'll stick to your agrements. In the future, we will think twice before relying on the frail promises of your wishy-washy team.

--Togas

I have no idea what he is talking about as we all knew the Alphabet deal was horrible from ND considering we were getting it for free in 1 turn from RP. We ahven't traded anything with ND so he's apparently spreading lies.

HE: Or he has been lied to by some other team.

Perhaps ND or Lux have told them something ?

I think it best to try and figure out exactly what the problem is.
This could still work to our advantage...
1. Find out what the hell he is talking about
2. Clarify to him our position
3. Find out who is spreading lies

This will allow Togas to direct his displeasure at the right team.

I am not too sure it is Togas spreading lies, but rather he has been lied to (or incorectly assumed something). Find out who ...then kill them.

P32: great...

I was the one who sent adaMada a PM saying the trade deal would have to be renegotiated since it was out of date, but I'm not sure about the other stuff, like "And all this time you've been sending us emails confirming that the "deal was still on"," - It was in the original agreement that if we met or traded with another team before we met roleplay, the deal would be renegotiated. Also, we can still give them warrior code... I don't see what the big problem is.

Nevertheless, I will make an official reply and send it to Togas and adaMada, and probably post it here.

GF: Latest on the Roleplay situation:

Ghengis,

You need to talk to your people to see what they're telling us before
you go off
the handle. I wrote you after Panzer sent a message to adaMada stating
that you
just received one of the techs we were going to trade you, Bronze
Working, and
that the deal would have to be redone.

He informed us that "It seems like our warriors are very close together
now, but
our previous tech deal is obselete; therefore I would like to get a new
meeting
deal together with you."

adaMada posted his message to my forum and asked me what we should do
now.

As you should know, we had planned to give your team Alphabet AND
Bronze Working
for Wheel and Warrior Code. However, since your team aquired Bronze
working, the
deal would, in his words, have to be redone.

We turned down a deal with Lux for the same techs we had agreed to
trade to you.
We have a contact with them and could have made such a deal at any time
this
week, but chose not to. You can understand why this would upset me.
You can
understand why I immediately wrote to you.

I recontacted Lux this evening to see if they would reconsider their
offer to us.
Trip informed me that they will. However, I made it perfectly clear
to him that
I would only take their offer IF things could not be worked out with
your team.

Therefore, you have a decision to make. Make ammends for this mistake
... I'm
sure it wasn't intentional. I'm sure it's one of those situations
where one hand
isn't watching the other. Get us back to the bargaining table and make
a promise
that your team can keep. Or, tell us to f*ck off and we'll go trade
Warrior Code
and Wheel for Alphabet to Lux Invicta.

Either way we get the techs we need. However, only you or Lux gets
Alphabet from
us. I don't care either way, but I made a deal with your team and when
I make a
promise I keep it. YOUR team has priority here and I had ordered that
we trade
with your people first and formost, but I will change those plans if
your team
would rather take a more opportunistic approach to trade deals.

Lastly, explain to me how your team operates. Who's in charge and how
are these
decisions made? If you make a deal with me, how do I know that your
team will
follow through with it? If Panzer makes a deal, how do we know that
it's
official or not? In the future, how will we know who speaks for your
team and
who's word we can rely on if a simple incident like this can occur?

Post this message to your people so they can fully understand my
position.

--Togas

My Response:

Off the handle? If you had stated that Panzer32 had made that comment and asked why it had been altered I would have looked into it and corrected the situation.

Instead your team immediately begins denouning us in the chat room and forums as liars and backstabbers doing irrepairable harm to our postion in the game.

That is completely unacceptable. I had been pushing to give your team "favored status" and encouraging my team that Roleplay was a strong ally candidate whom we should forge strong trade and tech deals with. In less than 24 hours you and your team have undermined all of that work and undermined my credibility within my own team. I have no idea if I can convince my team to ebrace that attitude again.

We had never decided to renogiate any deal and we got Bronzeworking from Lux for FREE as part of a friendship offer to encourage us to be more supportive of their postion and not ND's. We were to consider it as a bonus and were still going to trade you both techs in our agreement for Alphabet to honor our deal.

I would far prefer that questions about "backstabbings" be brought to my attention before being publicly thrown around as propaganda.

All I know is 24 hours ago we were in a strong tech postion and had lined up a tech share agreements with Roleplay and Lux to generate 3 techs for every 1 we researched and now we are almost back to square one and on the verge of being at the receiving end of a tech embargo.

P32: I am sending a PM also, there GF... I am mostly done writing it when I saw yours.

P32: Here is my reply:

___________

Greeting Togas, ruler of the Roleplay team. What I have to reply to is this email you sent to Ghengis Farb. I am sending this to adaMada as well.

What the hell?! Don't you guys have any patience?
You'd rather make a deal with ND than with us?

We just wasted 5+ turns of TWO of our scouts to try to urgently contact you guys, and we told Lux that we had aquired Warrior Code from you, so we didn't need it from them. Hell, we TURNED DOWN other nations to trade with you guys only to discover that your people don't have the same respect for agreements with us as you just got Bronze working and are now trying to tell adaMada that the deal has to be changed!

And all this time you've been sending us emails confirming that the "deal was still on", leading us on, so all the while we held to the deal and didn't buy either tech from anyone else because we agreed we would buy it from you.

This is a very dishonorable way for a team to act, especially when you expect us to trust that you'll stick to your agrements. In the future, we will think twice before relying on the frail promises of your wishy-washy team.

This is a very dishonorable way for a team to act, especially when you expect us to trust that you'll stick to your agrements. In the future, we will think twice before relying on the frail promises of your wishy-washy team.

--Togas

Well, for one, you seem determined that we cheated you by trading Lux Invicta. We traded The Wheel and Warrior Code for Bronzeworking and Pottery. Now, our team can still give you the Wheel and Warrior code, and you can still give us alphabet. Therefore, I propose we do exactly the same trade that we had agreed upon earlier - You give us Alphabet, we give you the Wheel and Warrior Code, and we have a 50 turn nonagression pact. Think of this advantageous deal as compensation for not trading with other teams while coming to meet us. I believe our warriors are extremely close to meeting, so we will hopefully have this cleared up very soon.

This brings up another point: In the original agreement, there was a 'clause' stating that we would renegotiate the deal if we met and/or traded with another team. I fail to see which part of this the Glory of War actually broke. Do not mistake the above deal I am giving you as an apology from the Glory of War team, it is simply a sort of compensation for misunderstanding our contract.

I also understand that you said in the public chat room: "Togas to Trip -> We may have a better deal for you - GOW is trying to change their deal" What did you say this for? Are you trying to spread lies about us? The Glory of War has done every deal with Lux Invicta it said it would do, the aforementioned tech trade is a public example. Please research your facts before you spread rumours about others.

Are you also afraid we have traded 'behind your backs' with New Demogyptica? The only time we have done this was a while back, before the latest tech trade was agreed upon.

Thank you; I hope that we can clear up some of the misunderstanding between our two teams

Panzer32, Foreign Consul for the Glory of War.

GF: Panzer32, could you post the email you sent to adaMada where Togas and Roleplay "claim" you broke our trade deal.

I would like to look at the exact wording to see how they came to their conclusions.

P32: Here is the one (I think):

____________
Sent 3rd January 2003 03:14 pm EST

It seems like our warriors are very close together now, but our previous tech deal is obselete; therefore I would like to get a new meeting deal together with you. It might be good to tell each other what we have, so we can see what can be traded - therefore

The GoW has these techs:
-masonry
-Pottery
-wheel
-warrior code
-bronze working
-ceremonial burial

what does roleplay have?

P32: I sent an apology for this PM stating:
_____________

I looked over the situation, and think I understand some of what the problem is. Yesterday, I sent this PM to you:

It seems like our warriors are very close together now, but our previous tech deal is obselete; therefore I would like to get a new meeting deal together with you. It might be good to tell each other what we have, so we can see what can be traded - therefore... and so on

Now I can understand your point of view and thus your reaction to this PM. I realise now that obselete was a strong word, and should not have used it, since the deal was not really obselete. The Glory of War only obtained one technology that was included in the deal. It sounded like we were cancelling the whole deal, including the nonagression deal. I was simply saying that we needed to adjust the deal again so it fit into both of our team's situations. Therefore I apologise for the severe wording of that PM.

P32: Response from adaMada (from my long PM up there a bit)

_________________

RE: Can we clear this up?
Dear Panzer,
I'm sorry to say that I can't reply to this now, as I've got to go out, but considering the sensativity of this topic, I wanted to let you know that I will reply once I get back, and that I'm not ignoring you . I should be back in a few hours, and will have a reply for you and your team then.

-- adaMada

Thread too big. Continued in next post.

[Donegeal]

P32: More stuff

PM from Togas replying to big PM (same as adaMada)
_____________________

Re: Lets get this thing cleared up
Panzer,

I think this matter can be put to rest. If your team will trade us Warrior Code and Wheel for Alphabet, then we have no problems at all. I regret that there has been such confusion over this issue.

I got enraged when my ambassador posted to our forum that you aquired Bronze Working from another source and said that the deal would have to be renegotiated, which meant that the deal was basically off. The reason I was angry about this is because I had taken active measures to send people to meet your team ASAP, foregoing their original scouting mission to travel directly to you. I had also had many exchanges with Ghengis Farb where he asked me on several occasions if the deal was on, and even sent us a .jpg showing where your warrior was so that we could both meet.

I was only angry because we had done so much thus far to make this deal and it didn't seem to me that it was as important to you guys as it was to us

Furthermore, Trip had offered us Wheel & Warrior Code in conjunction with several other trades, but we turned him down on Wednesday saying we already had a deal with you guys. Then I had to go back to Trip on Friday, after receiving your PM, to see if he would reoffer the deal to us.

I also understand that you said in the public chat room: "Togas to Trip -> We may have a better deal for you - GOW is trying to change their deal" What did you say this for? Are you trying to spread lies about us? The Glory of War has done every deal with Lux Invicta it said it would do, the aforementioned tech trade is a public example. Please research your facts before you spread rumours about others.

I said this, as this is what was communicated to me by your PM. You told adaMada that our previous deal was obsolite and that you'd like to make a new deal. Did you not say this?

Regardless, I understand that if you received Bronze Working as a gift, you could not refuse it. If I had been made aware of that situation earlier, I would not have been so frustrated by this turn of events. Furthermore, if I had been made aware by your first PM that you were willing to offer Wheel and Warrior Code for Alphabet, I certainly would not have protested. Such a deal is acceptable to me and my people.

I apologize that this misunderstanding inflamed both your people and mine, and I hope that in the future we can keep each other more informed so that misunderstandings like these will not happen again.

--Togas
________________________


And My reply to this:
________________________

RE: Re: Lets get this thing cleared up

I thank you for your reply, and am glad that this could be cleared up quickly. I'm sorry my wording was sort of off in my PM: "You told adaMada that our previous deal was obsolite and that you'd like to make a new deal. Did you not say this?" Yes I did say this, and I realise that obselete was sort of the wrong word. I was thinking that either most of the deal could be left intact, and you give us something other than bronze working, or we could go ahead and do the deal as we had originally planned, only without you giving us Bronze working. It now appears that this is what we will settle on. Also, I now understand why you said what you said to Trip in the chat room (BTW - you might want to be more careful about using the public chat room to communicate: one of the GoW members was there).

So there you go then; let us continue to be friends and it will go well with us in the future.

BTW: let both of our teams record the date we meet, so we can calculate which 50 turns the nonagression pact will last, so that we know which turn to start renegotiations.


Thank You;

Panzer32, Foreign Consul for the Glory of War PTW democracy game team.

GF: quote:

Originally posted by Panzer32
BTW: let both of our teams record the date we meet, so we can calculate which 50 turns the nonagression pact will last, so that we know which turn to start renegotiations.

2850 BC

HE: Phew....Glad this was sorted out

I say at a minimum, do the deal with them.
Our 2 techs for their 1 tech.

P32: Yes, please do the tech deal GF.

now for calculating 50 turns from 2850BC...

Real: Who's being treacherous?
GF seems to think its Roleplay - Barring any further info you can ignore the rest of this post.


Someone is lying -

According to Trip, ND breaks agreements.
ND did not attack us.
Eigther ND or Trip is dishonest. Maybe later we trade Trip Territory(ie honest) Maps to find out.

Togas says we've been dishonest - is he trying to bully us into making a better agreement or is someone else lying about us?

Anybody know enough about these jokers to know who's full of it?

GF: Roleplay is definitely trying to manipulate us. But I do think they will make a good partner as long as we realize they are competition and not a full ally.

Lux Invicta is trying to manipulate everyone, especially Roleplay.

ND is somewhat of an enigma, not really getting involved with anyone but definitely trying to cozy up to Roleplay.

Don: So, is our trade back on? Did we get Alphabet from RP?

P32: when we meet we will

HE:

Roleplay is definitely trying to manipulate us. But I do think they will make a good partner as long as we realize they are competition and not a full ally.

Lux Invicta is trying to manipulate everyone, especially Roleplay.

ND is somewhat of an enigma, not really getting involved with anyone but definitely trying to cozy up to Roleplay.

We should definitely feed Roleplays ego.

Tell them we have the feeling that they are becoming the dominent civ on the continent, and that we want to align ourselves with them.
Was it not Togas who said that he felt there will be an early war soon in one of his posts ?
Tell him we agree and would like to have an alliance with them against one of the others.
Word it so that we don’t seem the aggressor, but simply want to follow them into battle.
This way, if word is leaked out, or we get some bad rolls and our offensive is destroyed, …we can say it was all Roleplays idea…lets kill them

We can suggest it to be ND, because they sit between us….but let them choose.
Let them bring Lux to the party.

GF:

Originally posted by donegeal
So, is our trade back on? Did we get Alphabet from RP?

They gave us Alphabet and 5 gold.

It appears that Roleplay and Lux are signing an alliance and mutual defense agreement of sorts.

HE: So we need to decide.

Option 1
Align with ND
2 vs 2
With a war timetable using knights (Riders & Ansars)
I like this idea, but can we trust ND...What if RP offers them an aliance and we end up being attacked by all three ?

Option 2
Align with Roleplay & Lux
3 vs 1
But if Lux & RP are in bed together already, they may then turn on us in a 2 vs 1


BTW, Lux needs to be taken out before they get Sipahi.
But that is way in the future...

GF: My devious plot is to align with Lux and Roleplay to utilize the tech leveraging to rapidly get us to Chivalry (this tech alliance makes the Great Library useless, we will get techs and surpass Education long before we would have built the Great Library). We then use our Riders to take out ND because we will have advanced faster and thus they never survive to see theirs.

By then we will hopefully have cultivated distrust between Roleplay and Lux and take out Lux before they get their UU.

Roleplay's UU is the Conquistidor and not as life threatening as the other two.

Really, the key Wonder is pretty much the Pyramids in the Ancient Age.

HE: Agreed

Good to know that we have a plan....A devious plan is even better.

So long as we dont end up being on the worse end of a 3 vs 1 aliance, then it sounds like you have things in order.

Priority has to be getting onto the RP/Lux bandwagon.

Then we need to break their alliance and go after Lux.
Even with weak Conquistidors and Lux not having their UU....it will be tough to take both of them on at the same time.
Perhaps some help from the other continent ?
This is way in the future though...
It is impossible to plan that far ahead.

My only suggestion...feed their ego.

Aro: Yep, but do it carefully. They have some smart guys there...

HE: Agreed.

I have complete faith in GhengisFarbs ability to grovel at the feet of Togas in the appropriate way.

Several posts about GF kissing Togas's feet (or the like... )

Aggie: I have an idea. We let their "alliance come to completion and then right as they are about to attack us lets get one to betray the other. For example we convinve ND to betray roleplay. Right as the roleplay army is on our borders ready for war we get nd to launch a sneak attack on them since their army is far away and unable to defend their homeland. We are forewarned so can destro there force near us. Lets face it, somebody is most vulnerable when they have just spent all their energy making an army and have moved it. The question is "how do we get one of the "evil three" to betray the others. Never again would those three trust the others.
Aggie

HE: This will require ND to break an agreement.
I feel not many teams will be willing to do this.

Unless we also get down and dirty.

Tell them we have proof that Lux and RP are intending to take them out immediately after dealing with us.

We could always fabricate some electronic proof.
We log onto a chat session with their member names and cook up some nasty backstabbing evil.
Take a snap shot of the chat and give it to ND.
Tell them we have a spy in one of their teams.

Ooooh ...I feel distgusting even thinking about it....
Is this even allowed within the agreed Demo rules ?

Oh well ... alls fair in love and war, and we may be talking about our very survival. RL govts do it all the time.

GF:

Originally posted by Aggie
I have an idea. We let their "alliance come to completion and then right as they are about to attack us lets get one to betray the other. For example we convinve ND to betray roleplay. Right as the roleplay army is on our borders ready for war we get nd to launch a sneak attack on them since their army is far away and unable to defend their homeland. We are forewarned so can destro there force near us. Lets face it, somebody is most vulnerable when they have just spent all their energy making an army and have moved it. The question is "how do we get one of the "evil three" to betray the others. Never again would those three trust the others.
Aggie

I like, especially possible considering my info tends to come from members of their teams that do not like them going in this direction at all.

I doubt we could get enough support to destroy the civs, but they might give us enough info to dishearten the warmongers amongst their ranks...

Wow... things got interesting VERY quickly...

[Donegeal]

A new Number One Threat: ND!!!

Started by GF on Dec 17, 2002: Number One Threat: Neu Demogyptia.

GF: They had already discovered The Wheel before us and are between us and Roleplay. They have already contacted a fourth civ and are in the postion of trading techs between us and the other two civs which only have contact with Neu Demo.

I think we should build the first camp and then the second camp should be the one south of Imperial City.

Imperial City should start on the Pyramids as soon as the settler is finished.

We could cut the forest with the game and mine it giving us a 3/1/2 tile to allow one of the camps faster growth for workers and settlers. With the Pyramids and those 3 city sites on hills with rivers those cities should grow to size 12 fairly quickly, once size 7 they have free walls with the city defensive bonus on top of the hill terrain bonus.

I think we could use a Worker to build a colony on the the Horse to the west of Imperial City.

Any suggestions/comments.

Don: So we have a new question. Do we still build a fort first (work/settler factory) or do we settle our second castle?

Two things come to mind about this. One: that source of Gems. Get that and we would start with two Lux in our borders to start. Boom. Happy people for quite some time. Two: Move toward ND. But I think going for the city site down by the spices is a little too aggressive. My vote would be for the middle site then for the Gem site. Go for the middle site and plant Basher in the middle of the coast and the cultural border of the city. If we see ND (or anyone for that matter) we tell them that that land is claimed by us and to attempt to settle there would constutue a declaration of war. It ours. Tell them so.

P32: Your strategy sounds like a good one.

I have suggested a tech trade of Masonry for Ceremonial between our two teams, but I have not yet recieved a response.

Otto: I've gotten word that Roleplay has contacted the Demogypticans. Apparently they just had a big chat to discuss trades ectera. My friend told me they ran into a ND scout but wouldn't tell me what kind of trade they agreed/didn't agree to.

They did trade minimaps and he said that Lux was visible to the east of the Demogypticans on the Demo minimap.

He also said there is some discussion in their forum about a potential tech embargo against the Demogypticans.

GF: Perhaps our warior on the Demogyptian border needs to go East then south.

Real: I think any early wonders are a waste of time. There are 6 other civs that might get it, and even if we did, it costs as much as 7 granaries. In that time we could have settled all over, or built 20 archers or 13 swordsmen or horsemen, and even if we do get it we'll have nothing to show for it until it's completely built, be more vunlerable for a while because of spending those shields, and the others will be aware of our temporary vulnerabilty/future threat and choose to attack us then.


We need to get at least one ally for a future war, attack while they're building wonders or soon after. What good is it to get The Pyramids just to lose half your cities?

The Wonders present us & our ally a golden opportunity to attack.

GF: I'm seriously considering having Imperial City build a second settler and with the first one from Camp Cod quckly founding the remaining two camps.

If the three civs do ally against us, this will give us enormous unit production power and a highly defensible core with them all being on hills.

Any city site stolen by Lux or New Demo can be taken and razed by our Horsemen.

I see sprinkling in a few Workers into the build queus and perhaps planting a colony on the Horse resource.

P32: Yes, I would say another Imperial City settler would be beneficial.

HE: Wow.. was thinking the same thing on the way to work this morning.

We need to prepare for this war, and perhaps even strike out early if it looks like their pact has been locked in.
Perhaps a 2 horseman sortie for each civ to raze undefended cities, kill workers, and pillage.

More cities and more units are required.

See? We weren't particularly friendly with ND to start.

[Master Zen]

you know, for the record, I wouldn't mind opening our private forum at this very instant... we did vote in favor of such a thing.

[Hot_Enamel]

Originally posted by Master Zen
you know, for the record, I wouldn't mind opening our private forum at this very instant... we did vote in favor of such a thing.

Not quite yet ... game is still on

Even though I was the lone voice to vote not to open our forum, anyone who wants a peek, can just apply for membership. I cant remeber who approves ?

[Master Zen]

Sadly, it is not me, it is Panzer. I think DanQ got the whole power transfer wrong since I do have mod powers inside the forum, just that I can't authorize anyone.

And btw, I joined before the Voxian war, not after the Bobian war

(I was the friggin CoFA during the whole Bob prelude, hence the reason I was and still am #1 on RP's most-despised list)