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  • Turn orders starting 1020

    This is the thread we will post orders and saves in for the game.
    Aggie
    The 5th President, 2nd SMC and 8th VP in the Civ3 Demogame. Also proud member of the GOW team in the PTW game. Peace through superior firepower.

  • #2
    Acting CP Budget Request for the next 5 turns

    We still have 3 Pikemen that need to be upgraded to Musketmen for 60L each and 1 Warrior that needs to be upgraded to Swordsman for 40L. Total of 220L for upgrades (currently).

    THIS Request is final. Edited to show figures with WF changes.

    We have 652 Lytons with an income of 170 LPT (After WF changes). SMC has not requested funds at this time, but I know he will want to upgrade some units (which can be done over the next 5 turns).

    NEEDED:
    Arcadia - Courthouse for 224L, subtract 12 LPT.
    Heliopolis - Courthouse for 268L, subtract 4 LPT.
    Avignon - From turn 1 and beyond, Courthouse for 280L, subtract 4 LPT.
    Lhasa - From turn 2 and beyond, Courthouse for 280L, subtract 4 LPT.

    THROUGHPUT:
    Hole in the Wall - Cathedral on turn 2 (that turn only) for 28L.


    This Request is FINAL.

    Also, we have 4 turns of Research on Medicine left to complete, We might be able to turn down the Science % in succeeding turns (while still having complete on time), and that would release more funds to our Treasury on the following turns.

    If we turned up the slider to finish faster it will be at:
    Approx:
    [EDIT] 80%: 3 turns with -29 LPT (shrinking)
    No other benifits at higher %ís

    E_T
    Last edited by E_T; November 20, 2002, 14:20.
    Come and see me at WePlayCiv
    Worship the Comic here!
    Term IV DFM for Trade, Term V CP & Term VI DM, Term VII SMC of Apolytonia - SPDGI, Minister of the Interior of the PTW InterSite Demo Game

    Comment


    • #3
      DM/CP Orders - Are ready to go

      These Orders are FINAL.

      General stuff:

      In the Orders, WF refers to Work force allocation/placement. See this image:

      For further explanation on this, see this post.


      If during the turnchat, any workers that finish tasks that would benifit Production, Trade or Food (in that order of priority, with corruption/waste in mind) increase in a city (cleared jungle, mine or road built, etc.), please change WF allocation to fit the situation. Please, also keep in mind, that some cities are having to maintain a delicate balance between growth & time of build completions. We will be rushing things somewhat, but Some items I don't want to have to rush too soon (because of impending Disorder because a city grew too fast).


      Approved Budget for Rushes:

      Budget for 1060 Lytons had been approved for the following times


      Emergency:
      None

      Needed:
      Arcadia - Courthouse on turn 0 for 224L
      Heliopolis - Courthouse on turn 1 for 268L
      Avignon - Courthouse on turn 3 for 272L
      Lhasa - Courthouse on turn 5 for 268L.

      Throughput:
      Hole in the Wall - Cathedral on turn 2 for 28L.



      Turn 0 (1020AD)

      Current built/Queue Changes:

      Macross City - Add Uni-Musket-Colos to Q
      Tessagrad - Add Court to Q
      Timeline - Add Cavalry-Wealth to Q
      Gaia - Change Wealth to Bank, Add Wealth to Q
      Contaginon - Change Wealth to Uni, Add Musket-Wealth to Q
      Del Monte - Add Cavalry to Q
      Here It Is - Change Wealth to Uni, Add Musket-Wealth to Q
      Seeburg - Change WC to Cannon
      Port Rouge - Add Cannon-Bank to Q
      Apolyton - Add Colos to Q
      New York - Add Wealth to Q
      Willsbury - Add Musket-Harbor to Q
      Tarsus - Add Musket to Q
      Gotham - Add Court to Q
      Port of Malignance - Add Musket-Bank to Q
      Antioch - Change Wealth to Uni, Add Musket-Wealth to Q
      Susa - Add Wealth to Q
      Termina - Add Court to Q
      Banana HQ - Change Wealth to Uni, Add ??Galleon?? to Q
      Muncie - Add Cavalry to Q
      San Cortez - Change Wealth to Wrk, Add Uni-Wealth to Q
      Hole in the Wall - Change Caravel to ??Galleon??
      Shiberport - Add Mrkt to Q
      Ghengistown - Add Uni-Wealth to Q
      Opiadom - Switch Mrkt & Aqua
      Another Glorious City - Add Uni-Musket-Wealth to Q
      Chiquita - Change Wealth to Bank, Add Cannon to Q
      Loveshack - Switch Cath in build with Aqua in Q, Add Bank-Musket to Q
      Jerusalem - Add Court-Cannon to Q
      Ubergorsk - Change Wealth to Uni, change Cavalry in Q#1 to Musket, Add Bank to Q
      Bacteria - Change Mrkt to Aqua, Add Mrkt-Cannon-Wealth to Q
      Chartes - Add Cannon to Q
      Arbela - Change WC to Musket, Add Bank to Q
      Rheims - Add Mrkt-Musket to Q
      Boomtown - Add Granary-Musket to Q
      Whelsh Coast - Add Aqua-Mrkt to Q
      Oak Ridge - Add Court-Cannon to Q
      Solace - Add Barracks to Q
      Dijon - Add Mrkt to Q
      Geofront - Change WC to Cannon
      Port of Where It's At - Change Wealth to Cath, Add Aqua to Q

      WF allocations:
      Macross City - 1-2-3-5-6-7-8-11-13-14-16-17.
      Willsbury - WF to 1-3-5-6-10-14-19-20.
      Chartes - WF to 1-2-3-11-12-13.
      Seeburg - WF to 3-4-5-6-8-9-10-18-20.
      Avignon - WF to 1-2-7-8-20 + 1 Tax.
      Ubergorsk - WF to 1-3-8-14-19-20.
      Jerusalem - WF to 1-2-6-16-19-20. Will be Zero Growth, but max pop.
      Loveshack - WF to 1-2-3-7-8-10.
      Chiquita - WF to 3-5-6-13-14-17.
      New York - WF to 1-4-5-7-8-9-16-20. Will be Zero Growth until Flood Plains is Irrigated. < - Added note
      Another Glorious City - WF to 1-2-3-5-9-18.
      Opiadom - WF to 3-4-5-7-12-13.
      Welsh Coast - WF to 1-8-9-15-16.
      Gotham - WF to 1-2-4-5-6-13-15.
      Boomtown - WF to 1-6-8-10-20.
      Ghengistown - WF to 1-2-3-4-8-12.
      Shiberport - WF to 4-5-6-8-17-18. < -----Watch during turnchat
      San Cortez - WF to 1-6-7-8-10-17.
      Neon Uber City - WF to 1-2-8-15.
      Muncie - WF to 2-3-4-7-11-13-18.
      Here It Is - WF to 1-2-3-4-7-9-10-11-19-20. < -----Watch during turnchat
      Del Monte - WF to 1-3-4-5-6-7-8-14-15-19.
      Apolyton - WF to 1-2-6-7-8-9-13-15-19.
      Banana HQ - WF to 1-5-6-7-8-17-19.
      Congaginon - WF to 3-4-5-7-8-9-10-11-12-15-18-20. Will have slight food shortage until turn 4, will NOT starve.
      Port Rouge - WF to 1-2-5-6-7-8-9-19-20.
      Termina - WF to 1-2-3-8-10-13-19.
      Susa - WF to 1-6-7-8-16-17-20.
      Rheims - WF to 2-4-6-9-15-16.
      Lhasa - WF to 4-16-17-18.
      Tessagrad - WF to 3-4-5-6-7-8-11-12-13-16-18-20.
      Antioch - WF to 2-4-6-14-15-16-17.
      Tarsus - WF to 2-4-5-6-8-13-15-16.

      Planned Rushes:
      Arcadia - Rush Courthouse for 224L - No WF Changes.


      Turn 1 (1030 AD)

      WF allocations:

      Willsbury (grows to size 9, looses WLKD) - WF to 1-3-6-8-10-13-14-19-20, should be 9 shields after Waste. < ------look note
      Ubergorsk (Borders Expand) - WF to 1-3-8-14-19-20.
      Arcadia - Court built, Cath next in Q - No WF Changes.
      Solace (grows to size 6) - WF to 1-2-3-10-11-12.
      Oak Ridge (grows to size 6) - WF to 2-4-5-14-15-16.
      Welsh Coast (grows to size 6) - WF to 1-2-8-9-15-16.
      Port of Malignance - WF to 2-5-9-10-17-18-19.
      Boomtown (grows to size 6) - WF to 1-4-6-8-10-20.
      Ghengistown (Borders Expand) - WF to 1-2-3-4-8-12.
      Apolyton (grows to size 10) - WF to 1-2-6-7-8-9-13-15-19-20.
      Susa - WF to 1-2-6-7-8-17-20.

      Planned Rushes:
      Heliopolis - Rush Courthouse for 268L - No WF changes.


      Turn 2 (1040 AD)

      WF allocations:
      Willsbury - WF to 1-3-5-6-10-13-14-19-20, should be 8 shields after Waste. < ------look note
      Chartes - WF to 1-3-5-11-12-13.
      Bacteria (grows & shrinks, should be size 6) - Wrk built, Mrkt next in Q - WF to 2-3-8-10-11-20.
      Seeburg - WF to 3-4-5-6-8-10-12-18-20.
      Avignon (grows to size 7) - WF to 1-2-7-8-18-19-20.
      Ubergorsk - WF to 3-8-14-15-19-20.
      Gotham (grows to size 8) - WF to 1-2-4-5-6-7-13-15
      Ghengistown (grows to size 7) - WF to 1-2-3-4-8-12-13.
      Shiberport (Borders Expand) - WF to 4-5-6-8-17-18.
      Heliopolis (grows to size 4) - Court built, Cath next in Q - WF to 6-15-16-17..
      Port of Where Itís At (Borders Expand, grows to size 2) WF to 1-5.
      Muncie - WF to 2-3-4-7-8-11-18.
      Congaginon - Musket built, Uni next in Q - No WF changes.
      Susa - WF to 1-2-4-6-7-8-20.
      Rheims (grows to size 7) - WF to 2-4-6-7-9-15-16.
      Lhasa (grows to size 5) - WF to 4-9-16-17-18.
      Arbela - WF to 2-3-4-6-12-16.
      Tessagrad - WF to 3-4-5-7-8-10-11-12-13-16-18-20.
      Antioch - WF to 2-4-6-13-15-16-17.
      Tarsus (grows & shinks this turn, should be size 8) - Wrk built, Lib next in Q - WF to 2-4-5-6-7-13-15-16.

      Planned Rushes:
      Hole in the Wall (Borders Expand) - Rush Cathedral for 28L - WF to 3-6-7-11-12-15.


      Turn 3 (1050 AD)

      WF allocations:

      Chartes -Mrkt built, Aqua next in Q - WF to 1-2-3-11-12-13.
      Seeburg - Lib built, Cannon next in Q - WF to 3-4-5-6-8-9-10-18-20
      Dijon (grows to size 5) - WF to 1-5-6-7-8.
      Welsh Coast - WF to 1-4-8-9-15-16.
      Ghengistown - Cannon built, Market next in Q - WF to 1-2-3-6-8-12-16.
      Hole in the Wall - Cath built, Harbor next in Q - WF to 3-6-11-12-14-15.
      Here It Is (grows to size 11) - WF to 1-2-3-4-7-8-9-10-11-19-20.
      Apolyton - WF to 1-2-3-6-7-8-9-13-15-19.
      Port Rouge - Court built, Cannon next in Q - WF to 1-2-5-6-7-8-9-10-19.
      Arbela -Aqua built, Musket next in Q - WF to 2-4-5-6-7-16.

      Planned Rushes:
      Avignon - Rush Courthouse for 272L - No WF changes


      Turn 4 (1060AD)

      WF allocations:

      Willsbury - Lib built, Wrk next in Q - WF to 1-2-5-6-8-13-14-19-20. < ------look note
      Avignon - Court built, Cath next in Q - No WF changes. < ------look note
      Ubergorsk - Aqua built, Cavalry next in Q - WF to 1-3-8-14-19-20. < ------look note
      Heliopolis (grows to size 5) - WF to 6-7-15-16-17.
      Port of Where Itís At (grows to size 3) WF to 1-5-13.
      Muncie (grows to size 8) - WF to 2-3-4-5-7-8-11-18
      Congaginon - WF to 2-3-4-5-7-8-9-10-11-15-18-20.
      Susa (Borders Expand) - WF to 1-2-4-6-7-8-20.
      Arbela (grows to size 7) - WF to 2-3-4-5-6-7-16.
      Tessagrad - Cavalry built, Uni next in Q - WF to 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-15-16-18-20.

      Planned Rushes:
      TBD


      Turn 5 (1070AD)

      WF allocations:

      Seeburg (grows to size 10) - WF to 3-4-5-6-8-9-10-12-18-20.
      Ubergorsk (grows to size 7) - WF to 1-3-8-14-15-19-20. < ------look note
      Port of Malignance - Lib built, Musket next in Q - WF to 1-2-9-10-17-18-19.
      San Cortez (grows to size 7) - WF to 1-2-6-7-8-10-17.
      Muncie -Cavalry built, Bank next in Q - WF to 2-3-4-7-8-11-13-18

      Planned Rushes:
      Lhasa (grows to size 6) - Rush Courthouse for 268L - WF to 4-9-15-16-17-18


      These orders are FINAL.
      Last edited by E_T; April 26, 2003, 22:30.
      Come and see me at WePlayCiv
      Worship the Comic here!
      Term IV DFM for Trade, Term V CP & Term VI DM, Term VII SMC of Apolytonia - SPDGI, Minister of the Interior of the PTW InterSite Demo Game

      Comment


      • #4
        Move the slider to 80%. After we get Medicine, we can move it back down for one turn to 0% to make up any loss, but after techwhoring, there probably won't be any.

        Comment


        • #5
          I beleave that Aggie is looking at the slider & budget closely. Yes, I'd like to have some things rushed, but I'd also like to get Medicine first.

          But, please limit this kind of discussion to another thread.

          E_T
          Last edited by E_T; November 19, 2002, 18:03.
          Come and see me at WePlayCiv
          Worship the Comic here!
          Term IV DFM for Trade, Term V CP & Term VI DM, Term VII SMC of Apolytonia - SPDGI, Minister of the Interior of the PTW InterSite Demo Game

          Comment


          • #6
            Assuming we are upping it to 80%, I can restrain my upgrading impulses for a couple turns. I would like to get those pikemen upgraded as soon as possible. So, if we turn down the slider in subsequent turns, I want to get those done.

            I should be getting orders in soon. I just have one quick question for Aggie, what is our master plan for the cannon moving into Gaia?

            Also, I have a request for musketman production in the near future at ubergorsk and\or Gaia.
            "The Enrichment Center is required to inform you that you will be baked, and then there will be cake"
            Former President, C3SPDGI

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Thud
              Assuming we are upping it to 80%, I can restrain my upgrading impulses for a couple turns. I would like to get those pikemen upgraded as soon as possible. So, if we turn down the slider in subsequent turns, I want to get those done.
              I'd like to see the Pikeman in San Cortez upgraded to Musketman, it's the only defender there.

              Also, I have a request for musketman production in the near future at ubergorsk and\or Gaia.
              I've changed Ubergorsk's Q#1 item to Musket from Cavalry. Timeline, which is next to Gaia, is schedualled to build a Musket after it's current build of University, same with Del Monte after it's Bank, Will those be O.K.?

              E_T
              Come and see me at WePlayCiv
              Worship the Comic here!
              Term IV DFM for Trade, Term V CP & Term VI DM, Term VII SMC of Apolytonia - SPDGI, Minister of the Interior of the PTW InterSite Demo Game

              Comment


              • #8
                That's great, thanks E_T.
                "The Enrichment Center is required to inform you that you will be baked, and then there will be cake"
                Former President, C3SPDGI

                Comment


                • #9
                  FAM ORDERS - 1020 A.D. TURNCHAT

                  Turn 0 (1020 A.D.):

                  Incense deal with Rome - let it ride (they're broke)
                  Dyes deal with Greece - let it ride (they're broke) - we COULD use this to buy Nationalism at ~92 LPT rather than 122 LPT, but that's still too expensive.
                  Dyes and Incense deal with Germany - We CAN renegotiate this to receive 26 LPT + 12 L (or 532 L) rather than the current 14 LPT, but I'm unsure whether we want to be at war with Germany within the next 20 turns. If I get an O.K. from the SMC, we'll go ahead and renegotiate the deal.
                  Saltpeter deal with Persia - Renegotiation to 18 LPT (current deal is only 4 LPT)

                  Turn 1 (1030 A.D.)
                  Turn 2 (1040 A.D.)
                  Turn 3 (1050 A.D.)
                  Turn 4 (1060 A.D.)
                  We should have Medicine on this turn. Check to see what the price of any technology we don't have is (with each available civ) if we throw Medicine into the deal (assuming they don't already have it).

                  If Greece ends the Dyes deal, try to see if they'll take 20 LPT or higher for it. If not, hold off on that deal to see if we can use them to discount Nationalism or another tech once we get Medicine.

                  If Rome ends the Incense deal, sell it to the Iroquois, Zulus, or Persia (best price). The reason we want to let it ride is that Rome now has their own source of Incense. The Iroquois will currently pay us 3 LPT for it, but we may be able to get more from one of the three of them on a later turn.

                  Selling Dye:
                  We currently have 2 extra, 3 if Greece cancels our deal
                  Sell Dye to the each Civ IF they offer at least the following amount:
                  Rome: 20 LPT minimum (or to discount a techbuy)
                  Greece: We're attempting to let the current 19 LPT deal ride. If it lapses, only re-sign for 20 LPT or higher (or to discount a techbuy)
                  Germany: We are renegotiating in 1020 A.D (see above)
                  Persia: 4 LPT minimum (except ALWAYS leave enough Dyes to cover Rome, Greece, and Germany or raise minimum to 25 LPT)
                  India: 4 LPT minimum (except ALWAYS leave enough Dyes to cover Rome, Greece, and Germany or raise minimum to 25 LPT)
                  China: 4 LPT minimum (except ALWAYS leave enough Dyes to cover Rome, Greece, and Germany or raise minimum to 25 LPT)

                  Selling Wines:
                  We currently have 1 extra
                  Babylon: 2 LPT minimum

                  Selling Incense:
                  We currently have 0 extra, 1 if Rome cancels our deal
                  Persia: 3 LPT minimum
                  Zululand: 3 LPT minimum
                  Iroquois: 3 LPT minimum

                  Selling Horses:
                  We currently have 3 extra
                  no-one needs them

                  Selling Iron:
                  We currently have 2 extra
                  Persia: 5 LPT minimum

                  Selling Saltpeter:
                  We currently have 2 extra
                  Babylon: 5 LPT minimum
                  Persia: We are renegotiating in 1020 A.D. (see above)

                  Trading Worldmaps:
                  Hold off on mapwhoring until 1060 A.D. Then mapwhore in conjunction with hopefully techwhoring Medicine (using both to discount Nationalism and any other available techs). Buying WM's needs Presidential approval, but selling them apparently does not. If I'm not at the turnchat, FAM rep should obviously seek Presidential approval for mapwhoring (I'll do that myself if I'm there ).

                  Selling Technology:
                  Middle Age Techs: 75 L minimum
                  Industrial Age Tech: 200 L minimum

                  Buying Technology:
                  Wait for 1060 A.D., when we get Medicine OR for when all of the civs with Nationalism already possess Medicine (if that unfortunate possibility should take place). Maximum to pay is 1200 Lytons (should President Aggie ok that much money from the treasury), but it probably will be far less than that if we can throw Medicine into the deal. The decision of whether to use cash or LPT I leave to be decided in the turnchat guided primarily by the President's discretion concerning the budget.

                  Treaties:
                  RoPs: Do NOT sign them (requires Presidential approval even if considered)
                  Military Alliances, Trade Embargoes, and Mutual Protection Pacts would be illegal to sign because we have not obtained Senate approval. So don't sign them.

                  Demands
                  Do not give into ANY demands. If the refusal to give into a demand results in a civ declaring war on us, end the turnchat.

                  Demand that the following Civs Stay Out of our Territory:
                  Germany, Greece, England, Russia
                  For all other civs, only demand exit if their "invading" units possess an immediate threat (please consult with the SMC or SMC rep for this determination if I'm not there)

                  All matters left unattended in these orders can be altered by the FAM or FAM rep during the turnchat. If neither of those is present, such matters may be considered at the discretion of the President. If an order above was obviously written under a drastically different understanding of the situation than changes in the turnchat have brought about, then alterations are permitted to be made by the FAM, the FAM rep, or the President (in that order). If any change is made in the above orders, it must be recorded and a written justificiation provided to the FAM for the orders change (if the FAM wasn't the one who made the change ). The FAM may (and indeed, given the situation, may be required to) post the justification on the boards for public review if it was not already posted with the turnchat report.
                  Last edited by Arnelos; November 21, 2002, 05:42.
                  Long-time poster on Apolyton and WePlayCiv
                  Consul of Apolyton from the 1st Civ3 Inter-Site Democracy Game (ISDG)
                  7th President of Apolyton in the 1st Civ3 Democracy Game

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    CP order Recommedations are up. They still need to be double checked and any rushed items determined if & when.

                    Our income has Increase by 24LPT (to 170) at 60% and our shrinkage at 80% will be 29 LPT instead of 36 LPT.

                    If we sell Theory to a couple of Civs, we should recoop most of the loss. I say go for broke....

                    [Edit] changed income figures to reflect the exact amounts.

                    E_T
                    Last edited by E_T; November 20, 2002, 14:22.
                    Come and see me at WePlayCiv
                    Worship the Comic here!
                    Term IV DFM for Trade, Term V CP & Term VI DM, Term VII SMC of Apolytonia - SPDGI, Minister of the Interior of the PTW InterSite Demo Game

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Turn 0 CP Save.

                      I'm kind of jumping the gun here, but I have all of the turn 0 CP stuff done. As the next was to be SMC Thud, He'll only have a few things to redo, if he hasn't started yet.

                      E_T
                      Attached Files
                      Come and see me at WePlayCiv
                      Worship the Comic here!
                      Term IV DFM for Trade, Term V CP & Term VI DM, Term VII SMC of Apolytonia - SPDGI, Minister of the Interior of the PTW InterSite Demo Game

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I gotta admit, I almost started doing my orders when I saw that this thread was up. I'm having FAM withdrawals.

                        --Togas
                        Greatest Moments in ISDG chat:"(12/02/2003) <notyoueither> the moon is blue. hell is cold. quote me, but i agree with ET. "
                        Member of the Mercenary Team in the Civ 4 Team Democracy Game.
                        Former Consul for the Apolyton C3C Intersite Tournament Team.
                        Heir to the lost throne of Spain of the Roleplay Team in the PTW Democracy Multiplayer Team Game.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Acting CP Budget Request for the next 5 turns

                          Originally posted by E_T
                          We still have 3 Pikemen that need to be upgraded to Musketmen for 60L each and 1 Warrior that needs to be upgraded to Swordsman for 40L. Total of 220L for upgrades (currently).

                          THIS Request is final. Edited to show figures with WF changes.


                          E_T
                          Upgrading pikemen to Musketmen has a low cost/benefit ratio. We have bigger fish to fry until we get Nationalism.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Here is the Budget Timeline for the next 5 turns
                            Note: the estimate or 170/turn is low and will most likely be far below actual income. If this is the case the cheapest item in a years budget can be done the previous turn if the amount of gold stays above 200.
                            Also it must be noted that the senate can change this budget with a vote.
                            Budget for 1020+

                            Turn 0 Start 652
                            Courthouse in Arcadia 224(428)
                            Pike in Cortez 60(368)
                            Pike upgrade 60(308)

                            Turn 1 Start 308
                            Income 170 (478)
                            Courthouse in Heliopolis 268(210)

                            Turn 2 Start 210
                            Income 170(380)
                            Rush cathedral in HIW 28(352)
                            Pike upgrade 60(292)

                            Turn3 Start 292
                            Income 170(462)
                            Courthouse in Avignon 272(190)

                            Turn4 Start 190
                            Income 170(360)
                            Pike upgrade 60(300)

                            Turn5 Start 300
                            Income 170(470)
                            Courthouse in Lhasa 268(202)

                            Aggie
                            Last edited by Aggie; November 20, 2002, 20:05.
                            The 5th President, 2nd SMC and 8th VP in the Civ3 Demogame. Also proud member of the GOW team in the PTW game. Peace through superior firepower.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              My ISP keeps flaking out on me...

                              I should have my orders and any budget requests complete by sometime later tonight, but they may or may not be posted by tonight (perhaps sometime tomorrow?) because of ISP issues.

                              Thanks.
                              Long-time poster on Apolyton and WePlayCiv
                              Consul of Apolyton from the 1st Civ3 Inter-Site Democracy Game (ISDG)
                              7th President of Apolyton in the 1st Civ3 Democracy Game

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