Hawks: Rise Up!

[Inverse Icarus]

My friends, dark times are upon us. I have left the game for a little more than a month, and I now come back and gaze in awe of all our glorious empire has accomplished.

Out military machine has gained much, land, gold, technology, wonders of the world, everything that makes a civilization great.

When I left, we were on the verge of war with France, and my Deputy (and soon after full SMC) carried out my plans flawlessly. The tangled web of war at first scared the culture mongers of Apolyton, but the bold Hawks were resolute in their aims. War is the way of life, after all.

After all is said and done, gaze with me. Persia, the threat to our east, has been reduced to nothingness. In a few short turns, they will be completely erridicated. We took the mighty Pyramids from our ancient enemies, and now all our cities are growing rapidly.

Leaders have been produced, and two wonders rushed, in the greatest city in our empire, Ubergorsk. I thank all of Apolytonia for such an honor to be bestowed on my fair city.

But now, the darkness is onsetting. Talks about a Republic are surfacing. Our warlike people will not fare well in such a government.

Looking over the game (for the first time in a while) I've noticed a few things about the military.

Firstly, we have 59 units, all being FREE right now. When we go to the Republic, all those units are going to cost us 1 gold per turn.

Now, at first glance, that seems alright. You can defend the Republic with statements like "we'll get some extra trade, more gold, we can easily support this army".

Then factor this in. We have a "weak" army when compared to Rome (i use 1.21, with correct military unit comparisons). We have an avergae military compared to the Aztecs, and the Germans. We are stronger than the rest of the known world.

Rome is quickly becomming far too powerful, and the Germano-Aztec threat has to be dealt with. A beefing up of our armed forces is in order. Plus, "mop up" operations with America, Persia, and France have yet to be carried out. We need to finish what we started, Manifest Destiny is upon us.

Talk of Caravel exploration has begun. We will begin launching exploration teams from our East coast, traveling as far as they can. Launching from our EAST coast (say, from, Grenoble), we could cover more ground. Manifest Destiny is key.

Again, dark times are upon us. We only have 7 knights as of now, and Rome is just about to go on a power trip.

this rabble rousing brought to you by ex-supreme military commander UberKruX. Glory Comes From Spilt Blood. vote Smart, Vote KruX Aggie.

[Ninot]

bah, wormonger drivel.

[Duddha]

O great prophet, you have returned! I will immediately prepare for a parade in Ubergorsk.

[Donegeal]

I have always played civ (all versions) as a builder and have never even considered a warring concept.

This experience in the demo game has changed my thought process almost completely. Our warring has been unbelievably successful, and it has shown me many new things.

Two main things happen with war. One, you build a nice military and other civs treat you better (ie: gpt for peace). And two (also more significant) is while increasing our production/commerce base (ie: more cities) we are reducing our opponents production/commerce base (ie: lost cities).

With this in mind, we see how the current situation in Abananaba has formed. We have been keeping some civs (ie: America, France, Germany and Persia) in check by wacking them around but have left other to their own devices. These others (Aztec, Greek and Rome) have become the only people who can challenge us because we haven't whacked them.

A quick strike on one of these civs (most likely Aztec in the American Region) is almost a best option. Strike quick. Take a couple of cities then sue for gpt and tech for peace. Since we're right there, maybe give Greece a quick wack and take Argos.

Just some thoughts about war.

[Inverse Icarus]

LOVE the sig donegeal

[Donegeal]

Just changed it in tribute to a legend

[Meshelic]

UBER - Inspirational indeed. hear hear!

[XOR]

I support war, but I also truely and legitimately think we need to improve our industrial base a bit in order to empower a better army.

It is important, however, that the period of improving our industrial base is as brief as possible, and I disagree with your plans to attack aztecs after conquering Persia, America and France.

I propose that after Persia, America and France have been conquered we should attack Grece, to grow a bit further but we could use Germany and England to declare war on Aztecs and take what we want of the aztec-american cities while the 3 of them (Otto, Liz, Montezuma) engage in their war. During that war we could strike on Grece.

This way we would have the guarantee that neither Otto or Montezuma would interfere (ie. attack us) during the conquest of Grece, at least for 20 turns. If Otto is losing by the time we are done with Grece, we should side with Montezuma against him, if not, we should side with Montezuma against him. By that time we would doubtlessly become the strongest nation on the map. We will be able to do and undo anything we want, without rules, without anyone to stop us.

And I've had plenty of wars as Republic, that will not prevent us from going to war. Besides, we are a Religious Civ, we can change from Republic to Monarchy and then back whenever we want.

[Donegeal]

Nice general plan, but I think Quick strike plans are the best way to go until we have wacked everybody to keep them in check. We can whittle away civs instead of long greulling campaigns like the War of Wonders I.

Quick strike like we did against the Americans in the WoN.
Quick strike like we did against the French.

Do damage then get gpt, tech. We can't be stopped this way!

[jdd2007]

Uber! I shall sacrifice twenty of my finest bulls to you!

My thoughts:

Of course we should continue our wars of conquest. Greece and Rome will be a huge threat if we lie dormant and 'build.' Our Monarchy is wonderful and we need it at the moment. But, Republic is not such a bad thing. If we keep our conquests swift, we can manage the [rp] DIA-sponsored [/rp] war weariness and gold consuming armies. So, we must hang on to Monarchy for at least half of next term.

[History Guy]

Well, I think we should mop up the remains of America, and perhaps France. Persia, I think, might still become a threat if they get ships, and decide to transplant their empire abroad (which they might, after all, do, knowing the AI). This would just be to rid ourselves of a nuisance, to gain valued lands, money, and technology.

Now, as for the military, it must be preserved in order to counter the threat, the very serious threat, I might add, brought to us courtesy of the intellectual leaders of the world right now, the Germans, who you may recall were defeated in a very small war several months ago, and have been a bit agitated as to our existence ever since. Mr. Bismarck, I would note (having met the little chap myself during the war with Germany and the subsequent peace negotiations), is a hard man, and he does not appreciate being defeated, even in a small, inconsequential war, such as the won he fought against us several months back. Bismarck is like an elephant in that he finds it extremely hard to forget just about anything, especially not an insult, and being defeated in warfare as he was was quite an insult indeed. Let's face it, the man is amassing an army, and he hates Apolytonia. If he gets a reason, he will attack us, and with the Republic on as it might well be in the near future, we will be left without any means of self-defense, or counter attack. If this occurs, we will loose a lot of land, and Bismarck will not be kind to us. It's in our best interests to have a large defensive/offensive army to protect and expand our empire (i.e. taking out the rest of America, France, and Persia, as we should do). Otherwise, we are in terrible danger.

Rome and the Aztecs are certainly a danger, but not nearly as much a danger as Germany, in my opinion. The Romans are far from us, not so the Germans. The Aztecs are relatively weak, most of their army is made up of weak, cheap Jaguar Warriors, guys who fight with stone clubs, after all, and weak cudgels. But Germany is a very significant threat, and if we try to pay one gold for every unit every turn, we aren't going to win against them, because we will never be able to afford it.

[E_T]

The Germans aren't really too much of a Threat to a well prepaired Army, If Otto had any smarts, he would have attacked us while we were in the middle of the Persian conquest. Instead, he has been paying us LPT for Peace. That is very good overall, because Germany looks to be the Tech leader for the near term, at least until we get up to speed.

If we allow 20-30 turns on building our Infrustructure AND bringing our Armies back to full strenght, we can take some of Otto's accomplishments from him, at a time of our choosing. Remember, The war with Persia (and Germany) was a punishment for attacking us while we were taking care of the French. It did turn in to the First War for the Wonders.

The problem is that it HAS left us WEAK in many areas and Economically subserviant to the other Civs. War does have it's time & place, but even a warmonger MUST stop and tend the homefires for a while before marching off again.

E_T

[zeit]

"If we allow 20-30 turns on building our Infrustructure AND bringing our Armies back to full strenght, we can take some of Otto's accomplishments from him, at a time of our choosing. Remember, The war with Persia (and Germany) was a punishment for attacking us while we were taking care of the French. It did turn in to the First War for the Wonders."

E_T- you've put this quite eloquently, we SHOULD take the time to keep up with the tech race and strengthen our infrastructure. This is the only way we can support an effective war machine to make quick and decisive victory. As i once stated, referring to Richard Overy's "Why the allies won", one of the reasons the Allies finally beat germany, both on the eastern and the western front, was that, besides punding the industrial infrastructure of germany to dust, with endless aerial bombardments (western front), they also managed to their industrial output considerably, so germany just couldn't keep up. On the other hand, right from the start of the war the german industry did not went through the modernization, both in the factories themselves and the industrial adminitration. The russians on the other hand, despite suffering great economical loses, managed to re-organize their industry and back in 1942 already produced more weaponary then germany, despite having their resources supplied gretly cut down. The germans on the other hand, did not manage to exploit the great amount of resources they acquired in the war, and in 1943 their induty fell behind considerably, depite the fact that in that time, the allied bombardment on the german industry was merely a nusiance. We should learn from the german's (RL germans, that is) mistakes and work our economy, exploit the resources and the relatively quite and safe period we are about to go through, so we come out stronger and more prepared for another round of fighting.

[Aggie]

In deed we must remember the best defense is a powerful offense,so we should build a force 20 knights,their use to be decided later. We MUST not let our military whither and we must look to the seas for other victims, did I say victim I meant future friends.
Aggie

[E_T]

I'm considering Running for City Planner but I don't know what support I would get from the Hawks. I'd also like to keep my FMD for Trade Position, if possible. That would keep me up with the foreign outlook while keeping up Domestic Issues.

E_T