The Nationalist Party: Our Last Best Hope

[PresidentMike]

Citizens of the Republic! We face a great crisis! There is a spectre haunting our great nation, and unless we act quickly, our vital national interests will be sacrificed upon the altar of petty ethics and moral handwringing!

Certain high minded intellectuals, weak in body and spirit, are gaining more and more influence in our great government. Their words spread like a disease among most of our leaders! Black words, such as "peaceful expansion" and "industrail development." These bleeding hearts, with their myriad of morals and principles, do not have the stomach or the strength to do what *needs* to be done! They have lost site of the *only* principle: the advancement of our nation!

Citizens, our situation is clear. We must do what is right for our country! This alone should guide us! The Nationalist Party calls for the research of the latest military technology, the formation of modern military units, and the building of military improvements. We call for the creation of a system of roads to speed the advance of our armies. We say that in foreign affairs we should take what is rightfully ours! We advocate aggressive military expansion as a way to gain money, maps, territory and technology! And finally, we urge that these measures be put into place before it is to late!

UberKrux, our magnificent military minister, has said it best:

we have [no] time to putz around with our infinately large jungle while the AI expands rapidly on a huge world.

we shall soon find ourselves surrounded, with all the good land grabbed.

Quote taken from: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=53515

Citzens, our situation is clear. Either we act quickly and decisivley, or we are destroyed! The bleeding hearts may be content to peacefully submit to destruction, but we are not!

There is yet time to save our people and bring glory to our nation. The Nationalist Party calls on all like minded citizens, government ministers, and political parties to join us in our great crusade. United, we cannot fail! Come and stand with us against our enemies, and together we will make our land strong!

[Spiffor]

The best way to be destroyed is to attack the enemy when we don't stand a chance. How many of us said the aia was "stupid" when it declared an already lost, suicidal war ? Without iron or horses, I don't see how we could triumph in battle. Enemy swordsmen will cost as much as our archers, because of the AI production bonuses.
Your party doesn't intend to do what we have to do. Your party is raw ideology. And this ideology will lead us to a humiliating defeat.

[PresidentMike]

Originally posted by Spiffor
Your party doesn't intend to do what we have to do. Your party is raw ideology. And this ideology will lead us to a humiliating defeat.

What is politics but a war between competing ideologies? And this party intends to do exactly what we must do, which is to do whatever is necessary to expand our borders and build our military strength.

[Harovan]

I think the approach of the Nationalist party is very good. At the given difficulty level, an early war is a must, or our defeat will be certain. As soon as we crippled our neighbors (hope it's not an island...), we'll succeed to build up much better than now, and we may have a leader for a well placed FP.

Spiffor: The AI performs lousy in early wars (just like in any others). Do not fear it. You can only win in an ancient war. Even if you didn't achieve your primary goal (take the enemy capital early), which is unlikely if you do it well, the AI will give you techs and gold for peace, after about 10 turns of war are over.

Alas, I won't join any political party. Wish you good luck.

[Guardian]

Re: The Nationalist Party: Our Last Best Hope

Originally posted by PresidentMike
The Nationalist Party calls for the research of the latest military technology, the formation of modern military units, and the building of military improvements. We call for the creation of a system of roads to speed the advance of our armies.

I'm curious to learn how you plan to achieve these things without industrial development (-which you have termed a "black word")...

[Nubclear]

Originally posted by PresidentMike


What is politics but a war between competing ideologies? And this party intends to do exactly what we must do, which is to do whatever is necessary to expand our borders and build our military strength.

Whatever is necessary? That will definately lead us to a complete and total defeat. And a very embarassing one at that.

We must strike a balance between peace and war. If we mindlessly declare war against the AI just to expand our borders, they will use their production bonuses against us. They will gain allies as they always do. At this level, negotating with the AI is quite hard for us, and that will give them the advantage.

We must think carefully before going to war, as war at the wrong moment could be fatal. The AI will eventually form alliances against us, and with your "do everyting necessary to expand borders" ideology we will soon be at war with the entire world. And a war with the world is a war that cannot be won.

[Spiffor]

Please do not confuse "what we have to do" with "what we have to do to expand our military strength". These two things are completely different. Our military "strength", without iron or horses, will be laughable, no matter how many units we'll churn out. Rather than wasting our production in useless units, we'll have to expand our empire by settling on unclaimed territory, to become really and structurally stronger.
Your options are those of the true weak : the one who cannot build up everlasting strength.

[PresidentMike]

Originally posted by Tassadar5000 If we mindlessly declare war against the AI just to expand our borders, they will use their production bonuses against us. They will gain allies as they always do. At this level, negotating with the AI is quite hard for us, and that will give them the advantage.

Perhaps some clarification is in order.

You are quite right when you say that we should not "mindlessly go to war." That is not what the party stands for. We do not advocate immiediete attacks whenever we meet a rival civ. War is a complicated effort that requires proper preperation. After we meet a civ, we should begin planning their downfall: moving units into place, setting the diplomatic stage, etc.

The Nationalists advocate military expansion as the only way to save our nation. But we do not advocate stupid or foolhardy attacks. We advocate well planned precision strikes against our enemies.

Also, for those of you who decry the lack of horses or iron: we must make scientific discoveries before we can even see these resources. That is why this party advocates researching those technologies that will lead to a military advantage.

[Nubclear]

Perhaps more claficiation is in order, because declaring war against a civilization just because we want more territory is, unless there are very valid reasons, mindlessly declaring war.

Is that what the nationalist party stands for?

[Harovan]

Early wars, capturing cities "to gain territory", are foolish. Because capturing is not the primary goal for the early attacks. The goal is to cripple and slow down the AI's expansion, and to extort techs for peace. 10 build libraries are nil compared with 2-3 techs, gold and may be a city beaten out of an AI civ in an early war.

[Duddha]

I purpose that the Nationalist party should merge with the Hawk party or create a coalition. If the warmongers split their votes all hopes for early expansion will be lost.

[Ninot]

well if the Nationalists and the Hawks unite.. just from an outside point of view, I suggest you drop the Nationalist name in favor the of the Hawk name...

the name "Nationalist" is often associated with racism.
Take for example "National Socialist Party (Nazi party)" and certain extreme groups such as the "National Socialist White People's Party"

(yea, I know Socialist is in both of them too..., so...)

and i can't not mention my hometown extrememist group.. the Seperatist party.. with many members who are labled as "nationalists", who have specific goals of ridding Quebec of all english speaking peoples.

Im just sayin... Nationalism is bad.

[jdd2007]

ummm, i wouldnt mind merging. our views are basically the same

[Inverse Icarus]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
Early wars, capturing cities "to gain territory", are foolish. Because capturing is not the primary goal for the early attacks. The goal is to cripple and slow down the AI's expansion, and to extort techs for peace. 10 build libraries are nil compared with 2-3 techs, gold and may be a city beaten out of an AI civ in an early war.

not exactly sir ralph.

i understand what you are stating, but you have to factor in the whole "democratic" nature of this game.

the people (albiet perhaps a minority) won't stand for small skirmishes with AIs, as you often use / discuss. they just wont let us declare war on people we see just because we should "trim" them a bit.

so i'm basically stuck with the choice that we should attack the first people we see, the french, and make use of their land.

if the people wish to smack them areound, and then extort them, i'll allow it, although i'd rather take ALL their land, and use it as a
base for conquering the others.

i value your opinions and strategies. keep them comming.

this post brought to you by supreme military commander UberKruX. Glory Comes From Spilt Blood.

[jdd2007]

Originally posted by Ninot
well if the Nationalists and the Hawks unite.. just from an outside point of view, I suggest you drop the Nationalist name in favor the of the Hawk name...

the name "Nationalist" is often associated with racism.
Take for example "National Socialist Party (Nazi party)" and certain extreme groups such as the "National Socialist White People's Party"

(yea, I know Socialist is in both of them too..., so...)

and i can't not mention my hometown extrememist group.. the Seperatist party.. with many members who are labled as "nationalists", who have specific goals of ridding Quebec of all english speaking peoples.

Im just sayin... Nationalism is bad.

i definitely agree. plus, 'the hawk party' sounds cool...