Announcement

**godinex** · April 3, 2002, 16:11

only 3 points

1. The civ name is: Jews... And I thonk the best leader will be Moses, not David.
2. Jews great leaders: Saul not, Saul was an enemy of David. Put some one else like Daniel, or other of the great prophets.
3. Incas, the UU must be an scout, or change the name... look the xplanation in the 7th part of this tread

**Wernazuma III** · April 4, 2002, 12:36

Re: only 3 points

1. We have discussed whether the civ's name should be "Jews" or "Hebrews" and I think the final outcome of the discussion was to have "Hebrews", so we don't focus on either religion nor "race". So I don't think we should change it.
2. I'm lamentably not fond in the Old Testament, so I'll simply change it for now. Other opinions welcome of course.
3. We were thinking about the Chasqui-runners, but then decided not to have them in because of several reasons: Giving him one more movement makes him too powerful. The incans would discover in no time large areas and get too many benefits from goody huts. Even more so, if we give him some defense or offense, as he then even could defend against barbarians. On the other hand a non-combat UU means no Military Golden Age for the Incans. I know that the Sun Warrior is a bad approximation of "typical Incan", but I didn't have another idea.

Btw.: Great work with finding graphics (except for the Ethiopian Woman...)

**Wernazuma III** · April 4, 2002, 12:42

Oh, sorry. I've just looked up a bit and saw, that Saul was the first king, so why not including him? And Great Leaders should be political or military leaders and no prophets, so I let the list as it is. (And if I remember correctly, the list was made by an Israeli)

**godinex** · April 4, 2002, 13:02

Ok, but the Hebrews are a religious state. At least one prophet is needed.
Ah! and if David woul be the leader please don`t make him like the actor of the movie (The same of Lancelot and Pretty Woman!)

**Wernazuma III** · April 4, 2002, 14:16

Theodor Herzl is almost a prophet, don't you think

No, honestly: I'll add Moses as a Leader then, as he was also politically important. About David: With your gift of finding good images, I'm sure you can find a more appropriate one.

**godinex** · April 4, 2002, 14:20

Hey this one is from Salomon but If You want to see more take a look at the new tread called Hebrews.

Attached Files

**siredgar** · April 4, 2002, 18:16

I find it questionable to include quasi-fictional figures like Moses in a game that is mostly based on real history. The Bible has not been validated after all. We're not even sure if Moses even existed. This is a problem, isn't it? This is a unique situation with including the Israelites in the game.

**godinex** · April 5, 2002, 00:38

mmm. but the Occidental worls and also the muslim accept in fact taht Moses exist, and in the egyptian history exist too... and don´t forget the Disney Movie.

**siredgar** · April 5, 2002, 01:17

If you have Moses or David as the great leader, it would be very different from other more historical great leaders like Lincoln or Mao.

**godinex** · April 5, 2002, 12:08

Why? Only because they appears in bible? like Xerxes or Nabudonozer or whatever speel it.

**Wernazuma III** · April 5, 2002, 13:03

I partially agree about Moses: He is semi-fictional, but nevertheless he is also half historical, just like the Spartan law-giver Lykourgos or the romano-etruscan kings. I think it's not too much a problem to have him in the leaders list.
David, however, is a historical person for all we can judge. As godinex says, he is as historical as Nebukkadnezar and other mesopotamian rulers of the 1st millenium BC.

**Viseus** · April 6, 2002, 12:04

About the Vikings

First of all, I find it terrible that a dane should be the leader of the Vikings. This Knut was even a christian! No, a real, norwegian heathen king would be better. Harald Hårfagre, for instance.

Also, the spelling of the leader names should be "Leiv Eiriksson" and "Harald Hardråde" ('aa' if you can't use 'å'). I suppose the other names can be accepted as translated to english.

The last of the leaders, 'Magnus', should probably be given a last name too, as there are at least a dozen persons by that name mentioned in the sagas. I don't know which of them this one is supposed to be.

There are of course plenty of other leader names to chose from, if you need more. Appeared to be a bit few.

Finally, I think you should call the Viking unique unit "longship" instead of the proposed "drakkar". The drakkar was a kind of longship that was very big, expensive and rare. The smaller types were much more common, and "longship" is also a more understandable and general name, spanning all viking ships.(Reference link)

I like the 1/1/4 stats, and the open sea ability. Would be very cool (and historically accurate) if units could attack directly out of the longships, but I'm sure that'd be difficoult to implement, technically.

(Hope this post is ok, and that it doesn't fall under the "leading debates on minor issues" paragraph.)

**Kharash Tirum** · April 6, 2002, 12:34

About the Incan UU:
Try an improvement of the archer. As the AoK exp. did. Why not?
Also, where do I download all this? Can I download this?

**Wernazuma III** · April 6, 2002, 14:32

Re: About the Vikings

Viseus: At first, your post is perfectly OK, especially as many seem to have discussed this enough, so I don't face a fllod of posts to look through.
To your issues: The Drakkar will stay. Not because I simply like it, but because it has become the common agreement in the old thread. Personally I wouldn't mind the Longship, maybe we can change it, if no one opposes. I think, the Drakkar was chosen in order to give it even more a "Viking-flavor". We also have discussed about making the Drakkar a "Marine" unit, i.e. capable of attacking land squares. AFAIK, it's impossible to implement a feature that would allow units debarking from a sea unit to attack directly without the Marine specifics.
About the spelling of names: "In general" we have opted to prefer the English versions of names, although some exceptions could be made. If you have a good choice for a "heathen" ruler of the Vikings, please post it with a quote from a website, although I guess, our "Viking" civ is supposed to cover all scandinavian ocean-tied culture, including the Normans etc.
Just propose some last name for "Magnus". I can only repeat to say, that most of the lists were not made by me, so I simply added them and put them here for discussion, so I don#t exactly know what the maker of the list thought, when adding "Magnus".

Kharash:You cannot download the info because it is not yet implemented into a scenario. We'd need still graphics guys and a modmaker to do this. The information yet exists only as it is put here, so downloading it to your PC is "copy&paste" it to your notepad

Announcement

Extra Pack Finalization Project, parts 1-4 compiled

Extra Pack Finalization Project, parts 1-4 compiled

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment