Which of the included civs is least important?

[Sandman]

My view:

Have a European, African, Middle Eastern, Indian, Chinese, SE Asian, Central Asian and Pre-columbian American civilisations instead of individual nations. That's eight civs. Give them convincing and flexible special abilities. No more whinging about Spain not being in, and the Russians being scientific.

[Rogan Josh]

I must say that I hardly even play civ with the Americans even present, never mind as my race (I usually pick the Celts but they won't be there for civ3 As a matter of interest, who else plays the Celts?). This is because they just feel wrong - Americans on tiremes and elephants??? :wtf: Or Americans discovering the wheel? (I know they think they did but that is the US proppganda system for you.) It is different from having the babylonians in modern day somehow because you can always think that they might have survived.

The US has only really been significant for the last 70-80 years or so. And what do we mean by significant anyway? Hamburgers, fries and diet coke?

But anyway, it is not that I think that they aren't/wern't powerful enough, or influencing world politics enough to be included, but that they are not unique enough. The Iroquois on the other hand are fairly unique (in civ) and colourful, and make a change from playing other races.

[axi]

I liked the CtP approach, that featured many modern-world nations, but not the biggest and most important, but always second-rate choices.

The Jamaicans were fighting the Nicaraguans and the Ethiopians. That was fun!

[Felch]

I like your comment Rogan, "not unique enough."

What's really unique about America is that the culture is a synthesis of every ethnic group that has migrated here. America is proud of its immigrant roots and the jus loci citizenship that is ingrained into the Constitution.

Furthermore, in terms of timeline, it makes no sense for the Celts or Romans to be developing Electronics or Genetic Engineering. Just because America hasn't existed for 6000 years doesn't mean that its impact on world history is meaningless.

And your meaningless slander of the US propaganda system is out of touch with reality. The press in America is freer than most in the world (libel laws are less stringent in the US than in the UK for example).

The US has only really been significant for the last 70-80 years or so. And what do we mean by significant anyway? Hamburgers, fries and diet coke?

Try containing Communism, and cleaning up the mess Germany started by rampaging across Europe. Not to mention the output of our media, America being second only to India in number of films produced, and far more influential on the world market. Add to that music, news, global trade, and yes fast food.

[Gramphos]

Originally posted by Felch X
Try containing Communism, and cleaning up the mess Germany started by rampaging across Europe. Not to mention the output of our media, America being second only to India in number of films produced, and far more influential on the world market. Add to that music, news, global trade, and yes fast food.

You forgot about making many good computer games (as Civ)
(and many bad)
But still I think that they are to recent.

[civcop]

Vanity, vanity...

...all is vanity. Or preferences and opinion, more likely. I voted for the Zulus but I will admit that the Iroquois are probably the weakest of the choices. However, they are still a civ to study. As for the argument over whether or not certain important documents of the USA came from the Iroquois example, it depends upon which source of info you seek. You can find examples that say both.

I think the Iroquois are the best choice for a Native American civ (too bad Tecumseh didn't get that whole confederacy thing up and running or it may have been a better choice). Matter of fact, I replaced the Sioux with the Iroquois in my Civ 2 game. I also replaced the Indians with the Arabs. Ideally, Civ 3 would come with 12-16 civs that are available for installation (in a seperate file) and players could simply choose the 10 they wished to have in their game. Don't want Iroquois? Don't install them.

[aaglo]

This is a terrible thread... grow up, people.

[Wernazuma III]

I can't believe that the romans got 2 votes and the japanese none yet (I voted the obvious iroquois)

[frankdog]

I voted to toss out the Americans becuase they came along too late. I have always thought it didnt make sense to include them.

[St Leo]

little peninsula of Asia.

Did you borrow that phrase from me? I think I said that a couples of days ago.

I think the Iroquois are the best choice for a Native American civ

No, the Aztecs, Maya, and other Mesoamericans are the best choices for Native American civs.

[joseph1944]

I should send an e-mail to Firaxis and ask them to hard code the America into the game.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by joseph1944
I should send an e-mail to Firaxis and ask them to hard code the America into the game.

That's hilarious.

[Arent]

Ok, let them have their americans (We can't
change it anyway I think )
I would hate the alternative someone
suggested: throwing usa and european nations
in some "western" civ... those nice europeans
guarding nature, taking third world countries
serious, apologizing for faults dating back
100 years - and those evil (boh!) americans,
forcing anybody to watch silly sitcoms and
talkshows (they are the reason I don't watch
TV anymore! )

Arent

[Gramphos]

Originally posted by joseph1944
I should send an e-mail to Firaxis and ask them to hard code the America into the game.

Noooo! I must replace America with Incas.

[civcop]

Id est

I said:
"I think the Iroquois are the best choice for a Native American civ..."

St. Leo answered:
"No, the Aztecs, Maya, and other Mesoamericans are the best choices for Native American civs."

Allow me to clarify. I believe that the Iroquois are the best choice for a native North American civ. If you consider all of the Americas then Leo is right and there are better choices as far as societal and historical influence is concerned.

To whomever asked, I still play the Celts in my games (I've played as and against them), however I normally choose either the Romans or Russians ahead of them. The purple civs are the ones I changed in my game. I replaced them all with the Iroquois, Portugese and Arabs.