AU Mod: Mythic Hero

[Tassadar500]

Should a level be put in between Emperor and Demi-God? Vote away.

[Tassadar500]

You have 96 hours to vote.

[vmxa1]

No we have enough levels now. There is not much room to make the level unique as many of the values are either the same or close.

[Modo44]

No.

[Dominae]

Yes...

Just kidding! I voted no.

[nbarclay]

It seems to me that this poll is premature since the issue is still under discussion. I'm about to present a piece of hard evidence, and at this point, seven votes have been cast without seeing it. (My vote is the eighth, but since I'm presenting the evidence, I've obviously already seen it. )

[Theseus]

I was a yes... go Mythic Hero, go!!

(New argument: If nothing else, Firaxis needs to understand this for Civ4)

[vmxa1]

If this is meant to be some offical AU poll for the mod or community, disread my vote. I do not want to impact the choice. I thought it was just a what if type of poll.

[Tassadar500]

Originally posted by vmxa1
If this is meant to be some offical AU poll for the mod or community, disread my vote. I do not want to impact the choice. I thought it was just a what if type of poll.

Why? Your opinion is as important and valid as anyone else's.

[Dominae]

Originally posted by nbarclay
It seems to me that this poll is premature since the issue is still under discussion. I'm about to present a piece of hard evidence.

Hard evidence that Mythic is conducive to better learning? I'm not seeing it. One form of "hard evidence" that I would accept is an actual AU course where Emperor-level players try their hand at Mythic and report how challenging/interesting they thought it was, and what they learned from it that they did not know from playing Emperor. Of course, such an exercise would be fraught with bias, but it's the best thing that I can think of at the moment.

[nbarclay]

Originally posted by Lord Nuclear

Why? Your opinion is as important and valid as anyone else's.

One of the dangers of a democratic system is that a majority that has no significant vested interest in an issue can outvote a minority that has a much stronger vested interest in the opposite direction. I view vmxa1's attitude (if I'm reading it correctly) of, "From a personal perspective, I'd rather not have the change, but I don't want to get in the way of it if others do want it," as a perfectly reasonable response to that danger.

[punkbass2000]

Well, I voted 'yes', and here's why, if anyone's interested. Though I couldn't read every post in the discussion thread in its entirety (especially as a fair bulk of it was between Christmas Eve and Boxing Day), I did atleast get a sense of most of it. All in all, I find Dominae's argument more compelling in all aspects except one. This is the 'tyranny' argument, where I agree with NAthan. Essentially, I feel why not add this level. Who does it hurt? People who think that Mythic Hero is a crutch, etc., don't have to use it. The rest of us can. There is nothing to lose here, really, provided no one is playing Chieftain anyway, or cares about their score. BTW, I think you guys need to define terms in your debate, as you seem to arguing 'tyranny' in two different ways . I wouldn't have said Dom was being tyrannical, but, in the most literal sense of the word, I believe Nathan to be correct here. Oh, and one thing I wasn't sure was mentioned was World Size. An extra Settler on a Tiny map is huge advantage compared to a Huge map, where it is a tiny advantage . The primary idea behind playing higher levels with your deficit is that you can outsmart and catch up to the AI. This is easier when the OCN is ~16 and you start with one city instead of two than when the OCN is ~5. Oh, and I don't know if this poll is just a general vote towards whether there should be a level between Emperor and DG or if it includes a specific concept of 'Mythic Hero', but I still maintain that the new level should mirror Deity in every way minus one Settler, as opposed to mirroring DG.

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by Lord Nuclear



Why? Your opinion is as important and valid as anyone else's.

Basically it as Nathan said. I have no vested interest in the outcome, so let those that do make the determination.

Since I am loathed to mod my games, it matters not what others decide to add. Well I do enjoy seeing the mods that players come up with.

By the way I also enjoy the debates that take place.

[Tassadar500]

Fine. It's 6-3.

[nbarclay]

Originally posted by punkbass2000
Oh, and one thing I wasn't sure was mentioned was World Size. An extra Settler on a Tiny map is huge advantage compared to a Huge map, where it is a tiny advantage

Actually, it's more a matter of civilization density than of world size. Since the maximum number of civs goes up with world size, the difference in the impact of the extra settler is not nearly as great as world size alone might seem to indicate as long as players play with the maximum number of civs for their world size. Still, even with the maximum number of civs for the world size, there is somewhat more room per civ on larger maps. And if players don't play with the maximum number of civs, the amount of room per civ gets even larger.

but I still maintain that the new level should mirror Deity in every way minus one Settler, as opposed to mirroring DG.

My experiment watching AIs REX on Mythic Hero and the surrounding levels seems to indicate that somewhere in the general neighborhood of half the REXing advantage AIs get on Demigod comes from the other bonuses, not from the extra settler. If that result is typical, a difficulty level that is essentially Deity without the extra settler would be about as bad as Demigod in terms of AI REXing advantages, and would be worse than Demigod in other respects. In contrast, having the intermediate level be like Demigod except for the extra settler seems to split the difference between Emperor and Demigod reasonably evenly.