AU mod: Wheeled units and impassable terrain

[nbarclay]

I ran a test scenario (using chariots) to doublecheck, and wheeled units can move onto a roaded tile of otherwise impassable terrain only if they are moving along a road (that is, from one roaded tile onto another). If a wheeled unit starts on an unroaded tile or tries to land from the sea, a road on the tile the unit wants to move onto makes no difference. Just in case anyone isn't aware of it, the fact that a road is in another civ's territory does not keep wheeled units from using it to move through otherwise impassable terrain, although of course the road's movement bonus does not apply in the absence of a ROP agreement.

So with the Wheeled flag, artillery and radar artillery could move along roads to attack enemy territory regardless of the terrain, but could not participate in amphibious invasions of mountains, volcanoes, jungle, or marsh even if the tiles they want to land on are roaded. So we would get the effect we (presumably)want with respect to preventing players from landing artillery as part of amphibious operations.

[Aqualung71]

Yes, and it also makes sense. Can't imagine too many Trebuchet's being dragged across an unroaded mountain!

[alexman]

Just in case someone had not noticed Catapults, Trebuchets, and Cannons are already wheeled.

[Hermann the Lombard]

Originally posted by ZargonX
I actually set up a PBEM with pretty much the exact restrictions that are being talked about over at MZO. I can post the mod here, if anyone is interested.

Hmm...since the AI handles all of this poorly, would it be feasible to implement the change only for MP? (Mind you, I'm much too slow to *ever* play MP.)

[Dominae]

Adding Wheeled to Artillery sounds fine. Everything else does not provide a clear enough benefit to be worth the change.


Dominae

[Aqualung71]

Originally posted by alexman
Just in case someone had not noticed Catapults, Trebuchets, and Cannons are already wheeled.

Yes.....I'm getting confused again

[Risa]

Originally posted by Dominae
Adding Wheeled to Artillery sounds fine. Everything else does not provide a clear enough benefit to be worth the change.

By the age of artillery, AI should road every tile already.

[nbarclay]

Originally posted by Risa

By the age of artillery, AI should road every tile already.

That depends on the tech pace. Get a big tech lead pushing at a fast tech pace and there's a good chance there will be unroaded tiles in existence when you get artillery. That's especially true with tiles that are within an AI's cultural borders but that are not within a city radius for a city to work them, and of jungles an AI hasn't gotten around to clearing to work yet. Still, except maybe if there's been some pillaging, the cities will all be connected by roads that the artillery can move along.

In any case, my main goal with the suggestion that artillery and radar artillery be given the wheeled flag was to keep players from including them in a stack landed on mountains in an amphibious assault. That way, AIs don't have to face both artillery and the mountain defense bonus at the same time when counterattacking amphibious landings. For that purpose, it doesn't matter whether the mountain a player wants to land on is roaded or not because an amphibious landing does not qualify as movement along a road.

[Arrian]

To "wheeled" artillery. First, it makes gameplay sense. Second, it also happens to be fairly realistic. Arty DOES have wheels.

-Arrian

[alexman]

Under consideration:

1. Yes/No: Add wheeled property to Artillery
2. Yes/No: If 1 results in a Yes, also add wheeled property to Radar Artillery.
3. Yes/No: If 1 and 2 result in yes, add wheeled property to Tank, Mechanized Infantry, Modern Armor, Panzer.

Voting in a week.

[alexman]

It's been a week. Time to vote. 48 hours.

Mine:

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes

After thinking about it for a week, I think that wheeled mechanized units will add enough depth to military tactics to make it worth the change. Giving another use for Special Forces will also encourage the human to research their optional tech requirements a little more often. The situation where the AI is handicapped by jungle/mountain barriers are not very common.

[ZargonX]

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes

[lockstep]

1: YES
2: YES
3: YES

[Moonbars]

Originally posted by alexman
It's been a week. Time to vote. 48 hours.


After thinking about it for a week, I think that wheeled mechanized units will add enough depth to military tactics to make it worth the change. Giving another use for Special Forces will also encourage the human to research their optional tech requirements a little more often. The situation where the AI is handicapped by jungle/mountain barriers are not very common.

Also, as the AI seems to research these techs a fair bit more than players do, it gives them a use for the units..

[Theseus]

Y
Y
N (but Y if we do a full-blown Special Forces unit)