AU506: The Power Early Warfare - Pregame Discussion

[Theseus]

Hmmm.... the big questions for me are:

Research BW or trade for it?

Philo/Repub Beeline or Monarchy?

Impi-triggered Despotic GA for really early warfare, or try to trade for Horses instead, later pairing them?

Granaries? (methinks Dom might be teaching ole Theseus a lesson... )

How many Scouts? 3 more seem advisable given the central start.

[Tassadar500]

I like it so far. When the DAR threads are started, would it be possible to have links to the AU Course in the HoF? And could I have the starting picture resized to something like 250x250? Thanks.


Anyway, I have some good news. I'm getting rid of my Macintosh, and I should be getting a new PC very shortly, which means that I am going to be able to have a much more active role in the AU, and participating in more discussions. YAY!

[Dominae]

Originally posted by Lord Nuclear
Anyway, I have some good news. I'm getting rid of my Macintosh, and I should be getting a new PC very shortly, which means that I am going to be able to have a much more active role in the AU, and participating in more discussions. YAY!

[Mountain Sage]

Originally posted by Dominae
Anyone care to post a tentaive build queue? What do you expect the first 40 turns to be like? What will the first few build items in your capital be? What tech will you go for first? Do you have any set plans regarding foreign policy? How are you anticipating this game will play out? Discuss!

Mmm... my building queue? Let's do it my PP way...

Granary (with forest help), then scout, warrior (for MP), barracks, 2nd worker, 2nd warrior (for MP), archers until size 5, then settler/archers combo.

2nd city: worker, barracks, archers, archers, archers, archers and a...

Diplo? with 6+ archers the world is yours....

Techs? The bronze/iron road is quite long and knowing Dominae, the only iron is in some other civs' territory anyway...

I'll probably go for writing/philosophy to get a free tech. Can usually trade those techs quite well and hope to get alphabet with early trading (or some archers' help).

All in all, my expansion will be slow at first, since I won't build my second city for quite a while, but then I'll have a settler every 4/5 turns and military enough to rein in my adversary. Workers (enemy ones, that is) should not be a problem either

[-SafaN-]

i would do a scout first, then granary with a chop.

since we are zulu i would try for monarchy first.
possible tech order: pottery, wheel or wc, cebu, myst, politheism and monarchy.

wheel is better for the extra movement, while wc is a pre for monarchy.

The thing I hate the most about expansionic is the rgn: if u get settlers or the techs from the huts, its a win, if u get maps, then it will be hard.

I don't like despotic golden ages, so no impis for me until after monarchy. It will also be the start for the war.

I'm looking forward to play on a small map, never done that before.

Greetz

[Krill]

The only thing that I could say is that I want to know where the nearest available source of fresh water is. We have a four turn setler pump sitting there, ready to be used, but we need to chop the game forests and irrigate, as well as mine the oasis or the bonus grassland (me thinks tha bonus grassland. It's nearer, but there looks like there is water near the oasis).


I reckon that scout/worker/scout/granary might be doable, but I want to keep an eye out for goody huts. I free settler would probably make me change my mind and archer rush someone. A longer term start would be to build up chariots and upgrade to horses, while trying to get to Monarchy.


First moves:
1) Scout 62, worker 8(maybe 7), settle unless something good appears.

2) scout 96, worker chop (build scout).


------

My personal view of early warfare is that it is very useful if it can be pulled of correctly, and can be great if you can get a few towns in a peace treaty. I also hate a despotic GAs, and that is why I want to get Monarchy. I would rather have chariots, and upgrade them, so that my SoD can move quickly later on in the game. The warfare may not be as early, but it is still in the anchient age, is it not?

[Dominae]

Originally posted by -SafaN-
since we are zulu i would try for monarchy first.
possible tech order: pottery, wheel or wc, cebu, myst, politheism and monarchy.

You're in luck! As the Zulu you start with both Pottery and Warrior Code.

[Dominae]

Originally posted by Krill
I reckon that scout/worker/scout/granary might be doable, but I want to keep an eye out for goody huts.

If your initial Worker goes for a Forest Chop, your capital will produce 25 Shields in 5 turns, which is not enough time for the growth needed for a second Worker. Even without the chop, you produce a second Scout in 4 turns and a Worker 4 turns after that, for a total of 8<10 turns.

[Krill]

Sorry, I should have pointed out that chopping was dependant on what I saw. I might just road the tile and be done with it, leaving the chop till later. Or I could use a chop to speed a second scout, then slow the production of a second worker...etc

[joncnunn]

Adding my build queue to the post. My builds and worker moves are timed for chops with the Granery.

My tech reserach (post CB to ensure NOT getting that cheap one via GH) depends upon what the first goody hut found reveals. I'm hoping for a free settler.

[pvzh]

Ok my opening moves and predictions (corrected)

Scout 6-6 (I want to be absolutely sure about that coast / inland-lake)

* if it is lake then worker goes 6-9 (Osis is adjusten to this "lake" right? It is hard as hell to tell tiles in this graphic set under reduction) and road/irrigate (to use this tile for turns when 2 shields from game-forest is not needed, I will re-mine Oasis later)

* if it is not lake then worker goes 8 and start chop/mine/road (unless I see fresh water source northward) and do so with all games

Build orders are the same regardless lake or not Scout / Barrack / Archers untill enough population for settler is reached. I might insert scout or warrior depending how the chops agree with Archers to maximize chop effects. I do not plan for granary until maybe 2 settler is done (map is crowded), neither I will build a worker before the first settler to get the second city ASAP for unit support.

By the time I have 4 archers I hope scout(s) will find somebody to hit.

I will research CB "full-speed" at worst I will trade for it with reduced price. BW is either from hut or from trade (luckly extort it in peace treaty). Consequent research will depend on what I gets in huts/trade/extortions. Since it is small pangea with 1 more expanist and 1 semi-expansionis (Aztecs). I doubt that I can avoid GA in despotism, so "brace for impact": too little huts to pop for 50-turns alphabet in hopes for early monarchy.

I hope I can Archer rush the first AI without impies and avoid ultra-eraly GA.

My first 2 cities after worker or 2 will go for barrack and archers/impies until they are ready for another settler/worker as population/shields/"need" dictates. Granaries will be built during GA when I hit 8-9 shields per city (no use for 20 shield units)

I aim for Feudalism since I expect little or no core cities with fresh waters, so I probably might skip Phiposophy beeline unless I get Math early, so I can pick Construction or Currency as free tech.

Since it is pangea, the game will be "ugly" and barbaric: mostly barracks/units with temples/colloseum (if this version with militaristic flag on colloseums), some core cities will gets markets and maybe even aqueducts and kill, kill, kill... I doubt that anything else except "constant" warfare is feasable. The continent setup would be much better because after several oscilating wars settling down could have been an option worth of consideration.

[Mountain Sage]

Just to let you know that on Emperor level and above, goodies huts will give you more barbs than techs. This is why I'm not in favor of too many scouts. Once they make contact with other civs, they are basically useless. You can learn about the surrounding lands by sending warriors/settlers teams (plus some isolated archer).

This is why I favor an early 'powering up' of your capital. A second worker is more useful once your city has a size of 3-4, since a worker when you're size 3 drops you back to not that many shields and you won't have enough tiles irrigated to be back to a decent size for a while.

Ah well, as in chess, there are as many openings as players. Good to know Civ3 is still not 'standarized' game...

[pvzh]

Zulu are expansionis: so no barbarians from hut ever!

Beside, for some reason powering up my capital on demigod (the level I plan on using) does not work for me. I end up boxed-in even on standard map with normal number of opponents. However, described above agressive military opening works as charm on standard map with 7 opponents provided I am militaristic, so it must work on small with 7 too: easier to reach your enemies, so I will hit them earlier.

[joncnunn]

Originally posted by Mountain Sage
Just to let you know that on Emperor level and above, goodies huts will give you more barbs than techs. This is why I'm not in favor of too many scouts. Once they make contact with other civs, they are basically useless.

Zulus -> Expanionist -> NO BARBS poping goody huts

[joncnunn]

The settler builds I placed in my queue were to increase unit support enough to go after the nearest AI.

Distance will determine if it's straight imps or Horsemen/Imp combos.