The first wonder to build

[ramses II.]

I play deity, 7 civs, raging, map 125x80.
My research goes straight to monarchy, then trade.
The first wonder I manage to build is Marco Polo's or the Great Library. The AI is faster in building the Hanging Gardens or the Colossus.
Should I research pottery first? I have noticed that your expansion is faster with the HG.

In my actual game I've had tons of luck getting the needed techs by tipping huts:
I managed to build the HG, the Pyramids, Colossus (in HG-city!), Marco Polo's and so on (I'm no fan of the GL, i prefer MP, I only build the GL to prevent the AI building it).
Delhi, my capital, is a SSC with all needed wonders (Colossus, Shakespeare's, Copernicus', Isaac's, SETI) and city improvements.
The AI has only build 4 or 5 WoW, for example Sun Tzu's in London, meanwhile a pearl in my crown, the GL in the Aztec capital - meanwhile an Indian province capital. And Rome is an Indian city, too. It was nuked, then taken by my paratoopers.
My space ship is on the way, I managed to destroy two other space ships.

But now back to my question. Which wonder would you build first, and what would you build, if the HG, the Pyramids and the Colossus are no more available?

[Scouse Gits]

Gardens - every time. Start your capital on the Colossus (or any other WoW) as soon as you have established martial law (or built a Temple if you like laundrettes) get Pot at your leisure and transform to HG -- you truly need fell fortune not to get the Gardens this way - normally before any AI civ even starts a Wonder. With happiness assured - go kick butt in your favourite way.

If the bad guys have got HG, Pyramids & Col - I'm in a bad way ... Mike's is now essential and I shall get that, but next on the list is probably either the LH or MPE can be a hard call on a large watery world and given the start the AI has already got you are very unlikely to get both of these and Mike's

SG[1]

[LDiCesare]

Agreed, Hanging Gardens. Not that you can't complete Colossus before if you want to, though (provided you can without knowing pottery). I used to use Pyramids, but no longer do.
It very much depends on the kind of game you want to play. For early conquest/ICS, HG is definitiely the choice. If you want a spaceship, well, Colossus may be better. In OCC, Colossus or Marco Polo, or even Copernicus if you are lucky enough to research astronomy fast.

[rah]

In MP, HG. It really helps in the initial land grab if you're playing deity. You don't have to rush those temples after 12 cities. For the production of a temple, you can make another settler. It's also nice for SP but the AI usually isn't as concerned with happiness wonders so you can wait on it a bit.

RAH

[-Jrabbit]

Not an expert here, but that doesn't mean I'm without an opinion.

I play SP, deity, raging, medium world.
--I always have greatest success when I get HG first.
--My 2nd choice is Colossus, then racing to Mike's.

In your scenario, MPE is the obvious early WoW, but you'd better get Mike's too or you'll be, uh, well... unhappy about it..

[Marquis de Sodaq]

I tend to build the colossus first, but will take the hanging gardens sometimes, instead. It depends on the game. The gardens are a fine substitute wonder for a SSC, and the happiness boost is too hard to pass up.

[DrSpike]

Boringly, HG. With a semi reasonable start you can get to trade and produce 4 caravans before the AI gets it. If you don't think you have a good enough start then by all means start it early.

[TCO]

hg/pyramids.


but to answer your question (assume these are gone) would go for STWA.

GL to AI is no biggie. Let em have it.

[Carolus Rex]

SG[1] said it all.

Except that I wouldn't have a city working on a wonder; I'd go for Trade and build caravans instead.

Carolus

[Scouse Gits]

I have found that starting a WoW sometime before Monarchy is certain way of getting the first W of your choice (HGHGHGHGHG), then a bit of capital infrastructure followed by the 'vans for subsequent Ws

SG[1]

[Six Thousand Year Old Man]

(Assuming SP-Deity) HG is usually first. Start with Colossus and switch when I get Pottery. If nobody else has started a wonder when I'm close to finishing it, I may switch back to Colossus and let it get built, just for the arrow/science boost early on. Then when I have Trade, I can be pretty sure of getting HG too, via building 4 Caravans faster than the AI can landscape

Ideally I'd like both of them, and usually I get 'em. In rare cases I can even snag MPE. I never build GL or Pyramids anymore, for the usual reasons. I don't think I've built Lighthouse, STWA, GW or Oracle, more than once or twice each, ever.

STYOM

[geofelt]

I build Hanging gardens first. Here's why:
1) The three happy faces in your capitol will give you extra trade and science as soon as you get to size 3.
2) Expanding past 10 in monarchy or4/5 in despotism is difficult w/o HG because the first citizen is unhappy. This means that you need to build a warrior in addition to a settler to get a new city started.
3) Later on, the extra happy face in each city is the difference that lets every city celebrate and grow, regardless of size under democracy. Without HG you will need to build a courthouse.
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I find that the ai wants to build pyramids first. I start on a wonder in my capitol after it has one defender and has produced one settler. Almost any starting location with some trade and some shields will let you do this.

[Six Thousand Year Old Man]

Originally posted by geofelt
I build Hanging gardens first. Here's why:
1) The three happy faces in your capitol will give you extra trade and science as soon as you get to size 3.

Good point. I'm not always at size 3 by that time (due to 'size 2' strat of of maxing shields) but that's something to consider if the city is about to grow naturally.

And I agree with the other points... that's why I will ALWAYS build HG first if there is a chance the AI has a shot at getting it if I finish Colossus first.

[Carolus Rex]

I like the LH. You can go explore safely, tipping huts with a diplo, and you can establish some early trade routes. And nobody, nobody, can do anything about it (well, almost)!

In one of the comparison games we played last fall (one of Smash's?), I tried going for LH first with a good early game as a result. IIRC it gave me nice trade, which bought caravans, which gave me the other wonders. To be fair, this was the second attempt with the same map so I had prior knowledge about where my neighbours were (most of us played the same game several times).

Carolus

[Six Thousand Year Old Man]

Originally posted by Carolus Rex
I like the LH. You can go explore safely, tipping huts with a diplo, and you can establish some early trade routes. And nobody, nobody, can do anything about it (well, almost)!
Carolus

I tend to be pretty isolationist in the early going, so perhaps that's why the LH never seems a priority for me. Ideally, if I could have a big continent to myself, and put down 2 dozen cities before I meet anyone, I'd be happy, if a bit bored (since the rest of the game will be a foregone conclusion). I trade more aggressively when I get to Republic, and hopefully by that time I have access to Caravels. Or at least I don't have to strike out blindly in Triremes.

That said, the benefits you mention sound good - but would you take LH at the expense of the Colossus and/or HG?