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OCC fortnight #22

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  • OCC fortnight #22

    Calling it fortnight is more tradition than reality now.

    This time I thought it might be fun to play on a gigamap. This does mean that you'll need MGE to play. I don't know if gigamaps work on the Mac, maybe someone with a Mac can try it and tell us.

    You play as the Japanese on a giga worldmap. I edited the terrain at the starting location to make it more OCC-friendly and like in OCC #20 I replaced the second settler with an engineer. In order to allow you to explore the world and meet other civs before you land on AC I gave 4 transports with a spy loaded on each transport.

    You start with knowledge of Bronze Working, Ceremonial Burial and Horseback Riding. The other civs in the game are the Romans, French, Spanish, Americans, Carthaginians and Indians.

    I have never played OCC on a gigamap before, so I hope it will be fun. Download here.

  • #2
    quote:

    Originally posted by Paul on 01-05-2001 02:59 PM
    This time I thought it might be fun to play on a gigamap. This does mean that you'll need MGE to play. I don't know if gigamaps work on the Mac, maybe someone with a Mac can try it and tell us.
    here.


    I've heard that they work on the Mac too.
    By the way, I've just finished a 143x229 real world map. I've tried OCC as the Japanese thrice and thrice I've beaten. For me, it's the real test. I've already won several times on random gigamaps. The only difficulty is to find other nations. Usually other civs don't come to bother you. But on the world map, I've had some real neighborhood problems with the chinese and the germans seemed to be able to build wonders like in Civ1, once every 2 or 3 turns, that is.
    But I'm no champion of OCC.


    ------------------
    Oh Man, when will you understand that your greatness lies in your failure - Goethe
    Oh Man, when will you understand that your greatness lies in your failure - Goethe

    Comment


    • #3
      I had no problems running gigamaps on either MGE or 2.42 MAC versions.

      This one works fine on MGE.
      The only thing that matters to me in a MP game is getting a good ally.Nothing else is as important.......Xin Yu

      Comment


      • #4
        Talk about a major hut fest!I got almost all my first 20+ techs from huts.Including Monarchy,Trade,Construction,Astronomy,Gravity.Even Theology popped out before I found Invention.Tons of gold also.

        I did manage some alliances and gifts but it really served no purpose as things were happening very quickly.

        I feel as though I should have been able to arrive earlier.

        deity-MGE

        Arrival-1096ad

        Collosus-2450bc
        Cope’s-1300bc
        Shake’s-1200bc
        Sir Isaac-625bc
        Darwin’s-150bc
        Apollo-660ad

        Monarchy-3450bc
        Republic-1850bc
        Democracy-725bc

        Trade-3250bc
        Construction-3100bc
        Sanitation-1050bc
        Refrigeration-350bc
        Automobile-40ad
        Computers-360ad
        Space Flight-640ad

        1-1400bc
        2-1250bc
        3-1150bc

        12-1400bc
        21-800bc


        4000-hut-horseman-Tokyo established
        3900-hut>Alphabet -hut>Laws
        3800-warrior-hut>Map Making-hut>50gold-hut>25 gold-
        3750-hut-horseman-supported..hmmm
        3700-hut>50 gold
        3650-hut>Masonry-hut>Math
        3600-hut>barb horse>bribed-41.(supported)
        3550-hut>Warrior Code-hut>Monarchy -hut>barb horse>bribed-41(supported)
        3500-revolt-hut>Mysticism
        3450-govt-Monarchy-size 2-hut>horseman-non
        3400-hut>50 gold-hut>chariot(supported)
        3350-disband 2 horses after returning home-hut>archer(supported)-hut>Currency-
        3250-hut>barb horse-hut>Trade
        3200-hut>barb horse-hut>Astronomy-contact Americans-gift 3 techs-peace-share maps-hut>50gold
        3150-hut>barb horse>bribed-41(non)
        3100-hut>50 gold-hut>Construction
        3050-hut>Iron Working
        3000-size 3-hut>barb horse-terminated-hut>Feudalism-hut>Polytheism
        2950-hut>Pottery-hut>chariot(non)
        2900-hut>Seafaring-hut>legion(non)
        2850-hut>horseman(non)
        2800-hut>Navigation-hut>50 gold
        2750-hut>The Wheel-hut>Writing
        2700-hut>barb horse
        2650-contact Indians gift 4 techs-alliance-share maps-hut>Bridge Building-embassy with Indians-hut>barb horse-hut>horseman(non)
        2600-size 4-supported chariot KIA-hut>elephant(non)
        2550-hut>elephant(non)-hut>barb horse-hut>25 gold-hut>Chivalry-hut>Engineering
        2500-hut>knight(non)-disband 1 transport
        2450-Collosus-hut>50 gold-hut>legion(supported)
        2400-disband warrior-hut>knight(non)-hut>knight(non)
        2350-we love the king-hut>barb horse-hut>25 gold
        2300-library-barb leader 150-hut>50-hut>25-Indians gift 25
        2250-hut>barb horse>bribed-41(non)-hut>barb horse terminated-
        2200-silver caravan-hut>Literacy-hut>Philosophy-hut>knight(non)
        2150-hut>legion(non)-hut>legion(non)
        2100-The Republic-dye caravan-hut>legion(non)
        2050-hut>University-hut>barb horse terminated-hut>knight(non)
        2000-wool caravan-hut>Monotheism-hut barb horse terminated-hut>Banking-hut>Economics-hut>crusader(supported)disband on the spot
        1950-hut>barb horse-hut>Theology-disband 1 transport
        1900-temple-revolt-hut>barb horse-hut>50 gold-hut>legion(non)
        1850-govt-Republic-hut>Physics-Hut>Gravity-Indians gift 50-disband 1 transport
        1800-”we love” 4-market-hut>barb horse-hut>legion(non)-hut>barb horse terminated-hut>barb horse
        1750-hut>Atomic Theory-this is getting out of hand-hut>legion(non)
        1700-hut<50
        1650-disband archer-hut>Invention-finally-hut>50-hut>25
        1600-colliseum-hut>25-hut>50-hut>25-disband 1 spy
        1550-aquaduct-hut>50-hut>50
        1500-hut>50-hut>crusader(non)-hut>50-hut>legion(non)
        1450-hut>50-hut>legion(non)-hut>crusader(non)-hut>25-hut>50-hut>25-hut>legion(non)
        1400-end “we love” 12-gems caravan-silver arrives in Washington(demanded)690-hut>3 barbs
        1350-hut>25-hut>25-hut>50
        1300-Medicine-Cope’s-hut>crusader(non)-hut>50-hut>50-hut>50-sell colliseum
        1250-dye arrives in Washington-272-hut>50-hut>100-hut>50-sell temple
        1200-Shake’s-hut>25
        1150-contact Romans-gift techs-peace share maps-wool to Washington 258-hut>50
        1100-contact French gift techs peace-establish embassy-hut>25-hut>100
        1050-Sanitation-”we love” 12-hut>50
        1000-sewer system-hut>3 barbs-hut>barb horse
        975-hut>3 barbs
        950-bank-hut>25-hut>100-contact Spain-gift techs-peace-share maps-hut>3 barbs-hut>50-hut>50
        925-hut>50-hut>25
        900-French sneak attack-stock exchange-hut>50-sabotage barracks in Paris-spy returned
        875-hut>25-hut>barb horse terminated-hut>50-hut>50-bribe barb chariot 61
        850-Magnetism-harbor-hut>50-hut>50
        825-hut>25
        800-end “we love” 21-hut>25-Indians gift 100
        775-bribe barb chariot 61-hut>legion(non)-hut>25-hut>50
        750-hut>50
        725-Democracy-instant revolution-hut>legion(non)-hut>2 barbs bribed@41-hut>barb horse terminated-hut>25
        700-”we love” 21-hut>barb horse terminated-hut>legion(non)
        675-hut>50-
        650-hut>3 barbs-hut>legion(non)-hut>25
        625-Sir Isaac’s-hut>50-hut>3 barbs-hut>legion(non)-hut>3 barbs
        600-Gunpowder-end “we love” 25
        575-build university-hut>3 barbs-hut>50-hut>musket(non)
        550-Chemistry-hut>3 barbs-hut>100
        525-gems caravan
        500-Explosives
        475-coal caravan-Cancel alliance with Indians to get many,many units sent home.
        450-Metallurgy
        400-Electricity
        375-engineer
        350-Refrigeration-engineer-alliance with Rome
        300-Steam Engine-Romans cancel alliance-hut>50
        275-supermarket
        250-Railroad-hut>50
        200-”we love” 23
        175-Industrialization
        150-Darwin’s>The Corporation>Steel-hut>50
        125-gold freight
        100-Refining
        75-end “we love” 28-sell sewer-hut>100
        50-hut>50-sell aquaduct
        25-Combustion
        ---------------------------------
        1AD-disband 1 engineer
        40-Automobile-hut>50
        60-superhighways
        80-Leadership
        100-factory-bribe barb musket 61
        120-Conscription-bribe barb cannon 82-coal to Bombay 700
        140-power plant-hut>50
        160-Tactics180-gems to Bombay 700
        180-hut>50
        200-Machine Tools-bribe barb musket 61
        220-hut>25-bribe barb musket 61
        240-Electronics-bribe barb cannon 82
        280-Miniaturization
        300-offshore platform
        320-Mass Production
        360-Computers
        380-research lab
        400-Mobile Warfare
        440-Robotics
        460-manufacturing plant-contact Carths-peace-share maps
        480-Flight
        520-Radio-fighter(barb frigate trying to unload)
        560-Advanced Flight
        600-Rocketry
        620-hut>25
        640-Space Flight
        660-Apollo
        720-Plastics-bribe barb artillery 102-bribe Indian caravan 235
        780-Nuclear Fission
        800-hut>50
        840-Nuclear Power
        880-hut>3 barbs
        900-The Laser
        920-coal to Panormus 473
        940-bribe barb artillery 102-hut>musket(non)
        1000-hut>25
        1020-Fusion Power-sell research lab-hut>100-hut>rifleman(non)
        1060-15-1-1-1-1-1-LAUNCH
        1096-ARRIVAL
        The only thing that matters to me in a MP game is getting a good ally.Nothing else is as important.......Xin Yu

        Comment


        • #5
          You seem to have started a bit faster, but I overtook you later. I got 26 advances from huts including atronomy and medicine; invention in 2150 BC ended the run.

          I haven't completely finished yet; I just got flight in 320 AD, so I'm 8 turns ahead of you. I wouldn't be surprised if Ribannah got space flight BC in this game.

          Comment


          • #6
            AC: 936

            Monarchy: -2450
            Republic: -1850
            Democracy: -925

            Colossus: -2450
            Copernicus: -925
            Shakespeare: -1150
            Newton: -750
            Magellan: -575
            Darwin: -150
            Apollo: 500

            Trade routes: -1400, -1200, -1200

            Size 12: -1350
            Size 21: -875

            Trade: -3000
            Construction: -3150
            Sanitation: -1350
            Refrigeration: -500
            Automobile: -125
            Computers: 260
            Space Flight: 480

            4000 BC Hut: Archer
            Kyoto
            3900 BC Hut: Currency
            3850 BC Hut: 50 gold
            3800 BC Warrior
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            3700 BC Hut: Archer
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            3600 BC Hut: 25 gold
            Warrior
            3550 BC Hut: Polytheism
            Hut: Horsemen
            Hut: Warrior Code
            3500 BC Hut: Masonry
            3450 BC Hut: Mysticism
            Hut: Elephant
            3400 BC Hut: Alphabet
            Hut: Elephant
            3350 BC Hut: Chariot
            3300 BC Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Elephant
            3250 BC Hut: Map Making
            Americans: share maps; alliance
            3200 BC Hut: Archer
            Hut: Iron Working
            Hut: Barbarians
            3150 BC Hut: Legion
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: Construction
            Hut: Code of Laws
            3100 BC Hut: Wheel
            3050 BC Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            3000 BC Hut: Trade
            Hut: Mathematics
            2950 BC Hut: Legion
            2850 BC Hut: Engineering
            Hut: Monarchy
            Hut: Barbarians
            2800 BC Hut: Chariot
            Indians: peace; share maps
            Hut: Pottery
            2750 BC Hut: Elephant
            2700 BC Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Barbarians
            2650 BC Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Seafaring
            Hut: Barbarians
            2600 BC Hut: Legion
            Hut: Barbarians
            2550 BC Hut: Chariot
            Hut: Writing
            Hut: Legion
            2500 BC Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            2450 BC Colossus
            Gov: Monarchy
            2400 BC Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Literacy
            2350 BC Hut: Philosophy
            2300 BC Republic
            Hut: Chariot
            Hut: Feudalism
            Hut: University
            2200 BC Build Wool Caravan
            Hut: Astronomy
            Hut: Medicine
            Hut: Navigation
            2150 BC Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Invention
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            2100 BC Build Silver Caravan
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            2050 BC Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            2000 BC Build Salt Caravan
            Hut: 50 gold
            1950 BC Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            1900 BC Temple
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Horseman
            Hut: 25 gold
            1850 BC Gov: Republic
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Start WLTCD, size 3
            1800 BC Harbor
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Horseman
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 100 gold
            1750 BC Marketplace
            Hut: Barbarians
            1700 BC Library
            Hut: Elephant
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: 25 gold
            1650 BC Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            Americans: gift 100 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            1600 BC Colosseum
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            1550 BC Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            1500 BC Aqueduct
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            1450 BC Hut: 100 gold
            Carthaginians: peace; share maps
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Elephant
            1400 BC Build Coal Caravan
            Wool to Washington (not demanded): 254 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: 50 gold
            1350 BC Sanitation
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Legion
            1300 BC Sewer System
            End WLTCD, size 13
            Romans: peace; share maps
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: 50 gold
            Sold Colosseum
            1250 BC Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            1200 BC Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Legion
            Salt to Washington (not demanded): 280 gold
            Silver to Washington (not demanded): 280 gold
            Sold Temple
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            1150 BC Shakespeare's Theatre
            Banking
            Start WLTCD, size 13
            Hut: 100 gold
            French: peace; share maps
            Hut: 100 gold
            1100 BC Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Chariot
            1050 BC University
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: Barbarians
            975 BC Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            Spanish: peace; share maps
            Hut: 100 gold
            Americans: gift 50 gold
            Carthaginians: alliance; gift 75 gold
            Indians: alliance
            950 BC Hut: 100 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            925 BC Copernicus' Observatory
            Democracy, change gov
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            900 BC Hut: Elephant
            Hut: Legion
            Hut: Barbarians
            875 BC Bank
            Hut: 100 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Elephant
            850 BC Bridge Building
            Hut: Barbarians
            Americans: gift 75 gold
            825 BC Hut: Elephant
            800 BC Theory of Gravity
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Legion
            Americans: cancel alliance
            Carthaginians: cancel alliance
            Indians: cancel alliance
            Hut: 25 gold
            775 BC End WLTPD, size 25
            750 BC Isaac Newton's College
            Physics
            Coal to Washington (not demanded): 394 gold
            725 BC Magnetism
            700 BC Build Gold Caravan
            Hut: 50 gold
            675 BC Gunpowder
            650 BC Build Wool Caravan
            625 BC Metallurgy
            600 BC Hut: Barbarians
            575 BC Magellan's Expedition
            Hut: 25 gold
            550 BC Electricity
            Hut: Elephant
            525 BC Build Gems Caravan
            500 BC Refrigeration
            Hut: 50 gold
            Americans: trade Chemistry
            475 BC Supermarket
            Hut: 50 gold
            450 BC Explosives
            Hut: 50 gold
            425 BC Engineer
            400 BC Economics
            350 BC Steam Engine
            325 BC Hut: 50 gold
            300 BC Railroad
            275 BC Start WLTPD, size 24
            250 BC Industrialization
            225 BC Hut: 50 gold
            200 BC Corporation
            Wool to Madras (demanded): 715 gold
            175 BC Steel
            Romans: alliance
            150 BC Darwin's Voyage: Refining, Combustion
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            125 BC Automobile
            100 BC Superhighways
            End WLTPD, size 29
            75 BC Electronics
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            50 BC Spanish: 200 gold for war on French
            Hut: Musketeer
            25 BC Conscription
            Hut: 50 gold
            1 AD Hut: 50 gold
            40 AD Chivalry
            Gems to Rome (demanded): 1060 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 100 gold
            60 AD Leadership
            Hut: 50 gold
            80 AD Hut: 50 gold
            100 AD Tactics
            Hut: Barbarians
            140 AD Factory
            Machine Tools
            Hut: Musketeers
            160 AD Sold Sewer System
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            180 AD Power Plant
            Miniaturization
            Hut: Musketeers
            Sold Aqueduct
            200 AD Hut: 50 gold
            220 AD Offshore Platform
            Mass Production
            Hut: Musketeers
            240 AD Build Gold Freight
            Hut: Barbarians
            260 AD Computers
            French: peace
            280 AD Research Lab
            Mobile Warfare
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            300 AD Romans: 400 gold for war on French
            Build Oil Freight
            Robotics
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            320 AD Build Gems Freight
            Flight
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            340 AD Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            360 AD Manufacturing Plant
            Radio
            Hut: Musketeers
            380 AD Armor
            400 AD Advanced Flight
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Riflemen
            440 AD Rocketry
            Hut: 50 gold
            460 AD Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 100 gold
            480 AD Space Flight
            500 AD Apollo Program
            520 AD Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: Riflemen
            540 AD Plastics
            Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: Riflemen
            Hut: 25 gold
            580 AD Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            600 AD Atomic Theory
            Oil to Washington (not demanded): 398 gold
            Gold to Washington (not demanded): 398 gold
            Gems to Washington (not demanded): 398 gold
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 50 gold
            620 AD Nuclear Fission
            Hut: 100 gold
            640 AD Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            660 AD Hut: 25 gold
            Hut: Musketeer
            680 AD Nuclear Power
            Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 25 gold
            700 AD Hut: Musketeer
            720 AD Hut: 50 gold
            Hut; Barbarians
            740 AD Laser
            Hut: 50 gold
            Hut: 25 gold
            780 AD Hut: Barbarians
            Hut: 25 gold
            800 AD Romans: cancel alliance
            Superconductor
            860 AD Fusion Power
            900 AD Lanuch
            936 AD Arrival at AC

            Comment


            • #7
              quote:

              Originally posted by Paul on 01-06-2001 05:00 PM
              I wouldn't be surprised if Ribannah got space flight BC in this game.


              I'll give it a try, Paul
              Will be back soon, playing Might and Magic VI at the moment. Happy new Millennium everybody!
              (How many fortnights is that?)


              ------------------
              If you have no feet, don't walk on fire
              A horse! A horse! Mingapulco for a horse! Someone must give chase to Brave Sir Robin and get those missing flags ...
              Project Lead of Might and Magic Tribute

              Comment


              • #8
                All those huts sure help! Here is the log of my game. I will post some more notes later, as I have discovered some interesting things about the game since playing OCC.

                OCC #22, MGE, deity, arrival date: 856 AD

                4000 BC hut: archer
                3950 hut: chariot
                3900 hut: archer
                3850 3 huts: horseman, archer, alphabet
                3800 hut: 50 g
                3750 6 huts: horseman, chariot, polytheism, 125 g, Kyoto founded
                3700 2 huts: map making, 25 g
                3650 3 huts: archer, barbarians, masonry
                3600 3 huts: 100 g, math
                3550 3 huts: mysticism, pottery, 50 g
                3500 temple, hut: 50 g
                3400 2 huts: code of laws, barbarians
                3350 3 huts: monarchy, warrior code, seafaring
                3300 3 huts: elephant, wheel, currency; revolution
                3250 granary, govt. to Monarchy, 4 huts: trade, writing, astronomy, construction
                3200 2 huts: barbarians, archer
                3150 8 (my record for 1 turn!) huts: engineering, navigation, feudalism, chivalry, 3 barbarians, 25 g
                3100 silver, 3 huts: iron working, literacy, 25 g
                3050 6 huts: bridge building, philosophy, university, legion, 100 g
                3000 diplomat, 4 huts: republic, invention, 2 barbarians, barbarian leader, 150 gold
                2950 3 huts: 125 g
                2900 salt, 4 huts: 125 g, barbarians; revolution
                2850 Republic, 3 huts: 125 g
                2800 3 huts: 25 g, barbarians, knight
                2750 4 huts: 100 g, knight; start WLTCD at 4
                2700 colosseum, 4 huts: barbarians, 175 g
                2650 4 huts: 150 g, knight
                2600 library, 3 huts: 50 g, legion, barbarians
                2550 4 huts: 125 g, knight
                2500 university, 3 huts: 75 g, legion
                2450 aqueduct, 3 huts: barbarians, 75 g,
                Indians: alliance, share maps, embassy, give tech
                2400 5 huts: 250 g
                2350 food, 5 huts: 150 g, knight, legion
                2300 WLTCD stops at 12, 4 huts: legion, knights(2), 50 g
                2250 food, 5 huts: 150 g, barbarians
                2200 3 huts: barbarians, 75 g
                2150 food, 4 huts: 150 g
                2100 Colossus, 7 huts: knight, 225 g, barbarians
                2050 4 huts: 200 g
                2000 food, 2 huts: knight, barbarians
                1950 medicine, 5 huts: legion, 100 g, knight, barbarians
                1900 food, 5 huts: 225 g, barbarians
                1850 Copernicus, 7 huts: knights(3), 125 g, barbarians
                1800 5 huts: 125 g, barbarians, knight
                1750 food, 7 huts: 275 g, legion, barbarians
                1700 4 huts: 125 g, barbarians
                1650 food, sanitation, 4 huts: 100 gold, legion, barbs,
                French: peace, share maps, give tech, embassy
                Indians: give tech, 150 gold gift
                1600 hut: 50 gold
                1550 food, hut: legion
                1500 Romans: peace, share maps, embassy, give tech, Spanish: ditto
                1450 food, 3 huts: barbarians, legion, 25 g
                1400 theory of gravity, 2 huts: 50 g, barbarians,
                start WLTCD at 12
                1350 sewer system, 5 huts: 225 g, knight
                1300 Shakespeare’s Theater, 4 huts: 100 g, legion
                Carthagians: peace, share maps, embassy, give tech
                1250 3 huts: legion, barbarians, 100 g
                Americans: peace, embassy, give tech (no maps!)
                1200 harbor, 4 huts: 125g, barbarians, legion
                1150 gems, physics, 3 huts: 50 g, barbarians(2)
                1100 6 huts: 150 g, knight, barbarians
                1050 food, 4 huts: barbarians, 100g
                1000 food, 4 huts: 200 g, salt(d) to Madrid 572 gold
                975 food, steam engine, 2 huts: legion, 50 g
                950 food, WLTCD stops at 21, 2 huts: 100g, silver(d) to Utica, 589 gold
                925 Isaac Newton’s College, railroad,
                5 huts: 150 g, barbarians, Romans: give tech
                900 wool, 2 huts: 100 g
                875 coal, magnetism, 4 huts: 125 g, barbarians
                850 galleon
                825 atomic theory, 3 huts: legion, 75 g
                800 city walls, 3 huts: 75 g, legion
                Americans: trade for banking, give tech
                French: give tech
                775 6 huts: knight, legion, 200 g
                750 food, democracy, revolution, govt. to Democracy, 3 huts: legion, 25 g, knight
                725 hut: barbarians
                700 diplomat, 5 huts: 200 g, legion
                675 economics, 2 huts: legion, 25 g
                650 bank, 3 huts: 75 g, legion
                625 industrialization, 2 huts: 100 g
                600 7 huts: 150 g, barbarians(2), knight
                575 stock exchange, corporation, 2 huts: 150 g
                550 food, 4 huts: 150 g
                525 food, gunpowder
                500 Magellan’s Expedition, 6 huts: 275 g, barbarians
                475 metallurgy, 4 huts: barbarians, 100 g
                450 gold freight, hut: musketeer, Indians: give tech
                425 electricity, hut: musketeer
                400 2 huts: musketeer, barbarians
                375 steel, hut: barbarians
                350 oil
                325 refrigeration, 3 huts: 100 g, barbarians(2)
                300 3 huts: barbarians, 100 g
                275 chemistry
                250 food, 2 huts: barbarians, 25 g
                225 explosives, hut: 25 g
                200 food, hut: barbarians
                175 refining
                150 food, 3 huts: knight, 50 gold
                125 combustion, coal(d) to Utica, 918 gold, 2 huts: barbarians: 50 g
                100 food, automobile, hut: 50 g, gems(d) to Rome, 970 gold
                75 supermarket, mass production, 2 huts: 75 g
                50 mass transit, 3 huts: knight, barbarians, 50 g
                25 superhighways, electronics, hut: 50 g
                1 AD start WLTPD, 6 huts: barbarians(2),175 g, musketeer
                20 food, nuclear fission, wool(d) to Malaca, 1100 gold
                40 gems, nuclear power, hut: 50 g
                60 2 huts: knights(2)
                80 food, leadership, 2 huts: dragoon, 25 g, WLTPD stops at 28
                100 food
                120 food, conscription, hut: 25 g, gold(d) to Madrid, 1198 gold
                140 food, tactics, hut: 25 g
                160 food, 2 huts: 25 g, rifleman
                180 food, machine tools, 3 huts: 75 g, musketeer
                200 factory, 3 huts: 150 g
                220 nuclear plant, miniaturization, hut: barbarians
                240 offshore platform, hut: 50 g
                260 engineer, computers, hut: 25 g
                280 research lab, 3 huts: 75 g
                300 food, laser, 2 huts: 150 g
                320 food, hut: musketeer
                340 food, flight, gems(d) to Rome, 1408 gold, 2 huts: 75 g, give everyone all my tech
                360 food, radio, 2 huts: 100g, salt to Utica, 674 gold
                380 gems, advanced flight, hut: 50 g
                400 Darwin’s Voyage, rocketry, space flight
                420 Apollo Program
                440 begin structurals, plastics, hut: 50 g
                480 superconductor, 3 huts: 100g
                520 fusion power
                560 mobile warfare, 3 huts: 125 g
                660 gems(d) to Seville, 1344 gold
                700 robotics
                720 15 structurals done, starting components
                760 2 components done, starting modules, last hut (South Pole): 25 g
                820 3 modules done, 15-1-1-1-1-1, launch
                821 wool
                822 Adam Smith’s Trading Company
                823 Hoover Dam, Americans: trade for monotheism
                824 gold
                825 hides
                826 Oracle
                827 hides
                828 hides
                829 Hanging Gardens, oil to Carthage, 666 gold
                830 Lighthouse, recycling
                831 hides
                832 hides
                833 Marco Polo’s Embassy, wool(d) to Rheims, 1504 gold
                834 Great Library, theology
                835 J. S. Bach’s Cathedral
                836 Statue of Liberty
                837 Great Wall, hides to Madrid, 560 gold
                838 Sun Tzu’s War Academy
                839 King Richard’s Crusade, hides to Paris, 688 gold
                840 Eiffel Tower, genetic engineering
                Carthagians: alliance, 100 gold gift,
                gold(d) to Neapolis, 1612 gold
                841 Michaelangelo’s Chapel, hides to Washington, 378 g
                842 hides
                843 hides to Paris, 688 gold
                844 United Nations
                845 armor
                846 armor
                847 gold
                848 hides
                849 hides
                850 hides, hides to Madrid, 594 gold
                851 Cure for Cancer
                852 gold
                853 hides
                854 hides
                855 Manhattan Project
                856 arrival on Alpha Centauri

                Final score: 626, 81%


                [This message has been edited by solo (edited January 12, 2001).]

                Comment


                • #9
                  Below are some discoveries I made while playing OCC #21 and OCC #22:

                  1) This may be common knowledge, but at least it was a personal discovery for me, because I have never read about it. The amount of the bump you get in research, when delivering a caravan or freight, is exactly equal to the amount of gold you receive as your trade bonus. For example, a cargo yielding say, 204 gold, bumps your research by 204 beakers. Any excess is lost, so it is best to delay delivery until the next advance, if you are already close to a discovery. Early in the game, when discoveries cost less than beakers yielded by the bump, do not set science to zero, and expect to get the advance next turn just from the bump. In my experience, doing this turns off science completely. You need at least 10% science. Knowing the exact amount of the science boost from a trade is very useful. Subtract that from total beakers needed for the next advance, and adjust your science rate and Einsteins accordingly.

                  2) I also discovered that there is a direct relationship between the number of beakers needed for your next advance and the amount of gold you will receive when delivering a caravan or freight. So far, all the evidence (limited to the 2 scenarios above), I have collected supports one tentative conclusion: If your city has only produced and delivered commodities that are in demand, you can predict your trade bonus to be exactly two-thirds of the beaker requirement for your next advance. One turn I noticed that I needed 900 beakers, and that I got 600 gold for a demanded cargo. Nice round numbers, I thought. A few turns later, I needed 999 beakers, and I got 666 gold. Hmm!
                  This got me checking things a little more closely, and sure enough, every turn I delivered a demanded cargo the 2/3 rule seemed to be in effect. Imagine only needing 1/3 of the science than usual for your next advance! 3 turn discoveries become 1 turn discoveries! This rule was ironclad for both #21 and #22, and in #22, the city delivered to or the commodity did not matter, just so long as it was in demand. This relationship was spoiled after the delivery of an undemanded cargo. After that event the payoff was only exactly predictable in one way: it was certain to be a lot less.

                  3) The two discoveries above lead to two more useful things to know. Very early in the game, before the beaker cost exceeds 300, delivery of demanded commodities always yields at least 200 gold. A delivery made before the beaker cost reaches 200 can lead to 1 turn advances, which is something I certainly welcome during that stage of a game!

                  There is another useful technique you can use later in the game, if you have a cargo ready to deliver. Deliver before giving away any tech to the AI, since you get more gold and a higher science boost when the beaker requirement is high. Then give away tech to lower your beaker requirement. For example, the turn I discovered flight in OCC #22, I noticed I needed 2112 beakers for the next advance. I delivered gems(d) to Rome and got 1408 gold (and a 1408 beaker boost in research). Then I gave away all my tech to the AI and checked my beaker requirement, which had shrunk to 1536! It was a struggle, but I managed to get my science rate low enough for the additional 128 beakers needed to discover radio!



                  ------------------
                  It is more pleasant to live in the corner of a housetop,
                  than in a wide house with a brawling woman.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Very interesting, Solo. There are some commodities that don't give a demand bonus. These are all commodities except uranium, oil, silk, spice, gems, gold, silver, cloth, and wine. So are you saying, that it is useful delivering commodities that are in demand even if they don't give a demand bonus?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Solo, the 2/3 rule is the upper limit set for the bonus from a demanded commodity delivery. In OCC you will hit the upper limit rather frequently. Had you delivered demanded goods to a smaller & nearer-by city, and/or would you have been much further in the tech tree, you would most likely have received less than the upper limit.

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                      A horse! A horse! Mingapulco for a horse! Someone must give chase to Brave Sir Robin and get those missing flags ...
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                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thanks Lars-E and Ribannah, for your replies. You and many of the others here seem to know just about everything about the game! In response to your comments:

                        Lars-E, in OCC #21, I consistently received the 2/3 bonus for hides. I also got it once that game for gold. After delivering an undemanded cargo, I never got it again. In OCC #22, I got the 2/3 bonus for salt, silver, coal, gems, wool and gold (all demanded), but after delivering undemanded salt, never got it again. Not much info to work from, but my game results seem to contradict your list. My hunch is that the 2/3 bonus is available for any commodity until delivery of an undemanded one spoils it.

                        Ribannah, my results only seem to contradict what you say in one way. In OCC #22, I delivered gems(d) to Rome after discovering flight, and received the 2/3 bonus. Did you mean even further along the research path? On the next turn in that game, I delivered undemanded salt (first undemanded delivery), and never saw the 2/3 bonus again that game. One question: Why is the upper limit hit frequently in OCC? In your experience, what triggers it?


                        ------------------
                        It is more pleasant to live in the corner of a housetop,
                        than in a wide house with a brawling woman.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The bonus depends on the number of trade arrows in the home and destination city of the caravan (more arrows means larger bonus), the distance between the two cities (bigger distance means bigger bonus), freight or caravan (freight gives double bonus), discovering certain advances (I believe navigation and invention, but I'm not sure of that and there may be others; these lower the bonus), whether the commodity is demanded (the demand bonus depends on the commodity; uranium has the highest bonus) and some other stuff that I can't think of right now. The bonus is capped at 2/3 the cost for your current research.

                          The reason why you often get the maximum bonus in OCC is because OCC cities are designed to maximize trade arrows by building near trade specials and building the Colossus and later superhighways to increase trade arrows in your city. The reason why your later trade routes gave lower bonuses may be because you delivered to smaller cities or to cities closer to your own city or because you delivered commodities with lower demand bonuses.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Solo, I don't think my list contradict your results. You can hit the 2/3 limit without any demand bonus at all. I stole "my list" from Sid Meier's Official Strategy Guide (1995), p. 300. Anyways your note on meeting demand is taken, I have not consistently done that in the past, but will surely start to now (wheter the commodity yields a demand bonus or not).

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Lars-E: So they published the Strategy Guide in 1995 and released CIV 2 in 1996 - didn't realise that!
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