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A poll: do you accept caravan rehoming?

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  • A poll: do you accept caravan rehoming?

    I think it's time for us to determine this. I find this trick very controversal. Surely it isn't what the designers had ment. The popup message says it so clearly if you try to 'h' a caravan: "You can't change the home town of a trade unit" (or something like that). However you can "support from this town" using city command menu. If only they would have fixed this (in one way or another) we wouldn't be here discussing this.

    As it has been said before, it doesn't matter what tricks you do when playing SP and not posting logs here. But what if we are competing here e.g. who lands on AC the earliest? After reading Solo's log of his new landing recod, he tells us that caravan rehoming was a major part of his strategy. I'm not saying this is a problem at all. After all, we are playing a game here and the main point of it is to have fun! Solo actually told us that he had fun changing home town of his caravans "doing a sneaky thing". Competition with other humans is a part of that fun and for the competition to be fair we absolutely need to have the same rules, don't you think?

    After all, there are many other "sneaky" things we do and get kicks of it. All commonly accepted. Like incremental rushbuilding, ship chaining and have a city hill square mined before building on it. All those things are in similar category of caravan rehoming: not intended by the developers! So I conclude that this mysterical argument of "designer intention" can't be used as a rule when judging these kind of matters. We must make the rules ourselves and this is exactly what we have done in the past. IMHO it's now time to try getting an agreement on this matter.

    So my vote here is: let's accept caravan rehoming! I also like the sneaky nature of that practise..
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------

    Addition per 9.4.2001: Just to clarify things: I've changed my mind since I wrote this post. I've explained it down to the thread. My main point is that the poor AI is already handicapped against an experienced human player and rehoming only makes the situation worse. Finally, the AI is puny making good trade routes and certainly can't rehome HIS caravans!
    [This message has been edited by Marko Polo (edited April 09, 2001).]

  • #2
    no to caravan rehoming..... but i love repeated comodities to the capital go hides go !!!! No wonder Canada is such a great place to live and were so rich..... it was all those fur traders
    Boston Red Sox are 2004 World Series Champions!

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    • #3
      No problem with this in MP... you can't do it
      Keep on Civin'
      RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

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      • #4
        I'm tired of arguing about the "intent of the designers". Where is the patch where they tried to fix this stuff? Civ 3 will be coming out before too much longer. Maybe then, we'll find some of these things fixed. But how much do you want to bet half of them still won't be? We have a game full of holes, and I usually just shrug and drive through them. If people want to rehome caravans, I say let them.

        BTW, do you have a vested interest in this permission, Marko?

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        • #5
          It is a good topic for discussion and one that I was considering raising myself.

          Solo was honest to tell us about rehoming freights and shared with everybody some of the interesting strategies he used in his epic game. Without taking anything away from his achievement, I am a NO vote for rehoming caravans.

          If people do post records they should make it clear (like Solo did) if they have rehomed caravans. I don't see any problem in having two sets of records, one for those that do and another for those that don't!


          --------------

          SG(2)
          "Our words are backed by empty wine bottles! - SG(2)
          "One of our Scouse Gits is missing." - -Jrabbit

          Comment


          • #6
            It was a 2nd attempt so "official" record status is not a consideration.Dam impressive though.Seems like the big speeder upper was free cities early.Saved tons'o'turns not having to build so many settlers.

            I don't know.
            No in MP(unless you are way behind )
            Do whatever you want in solo games.

            I guess there should be some standards.Arii used food caravans and re-homing IIRC.
            The only thing that matters to me in a MP game is getting a good ally.Nothing else is as important.......Xin Yu

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            • #7
              Once upon a time (a very long time ago, I'm afraid) I was a young boy and lived and studied in Bordeaux. I happened to travel to Genève (Geneva) in Switzerland and bought chocolate (swiss chocolate has always had a very high reputation in France). I unwrapped it and found it delicious. Then I had a look at the wrapping paper: "Tobler, la qualité suisse du chocolat français"
              (Tobler, swiss quality for french chocolate; made in Bordeaux ).

              Wasn't that rehoming?
              IMO we are living in a world economy and thousands of products are rehomed every minute all around the world.
              I don't know what the genious who designed this game had in mind, but I state that rehoming is absolutely realistic, and I use it and abuse it when playing civ (alas not with results quite as impressive as those achieved by arii and solo ).

              ------------------
              aux bords mystérieux du monde occidental
              Aux bords mystérieux du monde occidental

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              • #8
                SINGLE PLAYER

                Pro (2 - 14)
                Gastrifitis
                Rah "but must state you did it when you brag about it"

                Against
                Ming
                Marko Polo "No in regular SP, but yes when shooting records and telling the others"
                War4ever
                Scouse Gits(2)
                SG[1]
                East Street Trader
                DaveV
                Marquis de Sodaq
                Hasdrubal
                Blaupanzer
                Deity Dude
                Boney
                Solo
                La Fayette

                Don't know
                Smash


                MULTIPLAYER

                Pro (0 - 14)

                Against
                Ming
                Marko Polo
                War4ever
                Scouse Gits(2)
                Smash
                SG[1]
                East Street Trader
                DaveV
                Rah
                Marquis de Sodaq
                Hasdrubal
                Blaupanzer
                Deity Dude
                Boney

                No comment/Don't know
                Gastrifitis
                La Fayette

                Please correct me if interpreted your answer wrong. I'll edit this post when we get more votes!

                Also, if you happen to change your mind (like I did) please let me know!
                [This message has been edited by Marko Polo (edited April 09, 2001).]
                [This message has been edited by Marko Polo (edited April 09, 2001).]
                [This message has been edited by Marko Polo (edited April 10, 2001).]

                Comment


                • #9
                  I do it - but it adds yet another layer of nanomanagement upon a game that I prefer to play in a cavalier fashion. For me the game would be 'better' without this feature (so why do I not deny it to myself? Guess I'm just weak) ... after all this prevarication -- I follow General de Gaulle, "Non!" -- sorry LaFayette

                  ------------------
                  Scouse Git[1] -- git1@scousers.net

                  "Staring at your screen in horror and disbelief when you open a saved game is one of the fun things of a succession game " - Hueij
                  "The Great Library must be built!"
                  "A short cut has to be challenging,
                  were it not so it would be 'the way'."
                  - Paul Craven
                  "Our words are backed by empty wine bottles! - SG(2)
                  "One of our Scouse Gits is missing." - -Jrabbit

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I'm a no.

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                    • #11
                      Another "no" vote. Trade is powerful enough already. I say this one is like the airfield cheat; a clear programming mistake that should have been patched.

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                      • #12
                        MP.......No
                        SP.......Whatever, but must state you did it when you brag about it.
                        It's almost as if all his overconfident, absolutist assertions were spoonfed to him by a trusted website or subreddit. Sheeple
                        RIP Tony Bogey & Baron O

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          quote:

                          Originally posted by Scouse Gits on 04-05-2001 06:01 AM
                          I follow General de Gaulle, "Non!" -- sorry LaFayette


                          It's a free world (thanks god! ... and thanks those who have been, are and are going to be able to stand up and say no to any other kind!).
                          I have explained why I do use rehoming, but have great respect for those who don't.
                          And I feel ready to stop using it if we decide it so.
                          (BTW what do ICSers say about the black faces turning light blue? do you find it realistic? (I don't); do you think the designers intended it to work that way? (I don't ); shall I start a poll?).
                          Aux bords mystérieux du monde occidental

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Take into consideration what CivII is trying to duplicate. In reality, La Fayette has a good point - trade routes were historically incremental, altho the goods themselves moved tremendous distances. Silk from Shanghai was traded for jade from Samarkand; they traded the silk to Bokhara for pottery; they traded it to Susa for gems; they traded it to Baghdad for grain; they traded it to Byblos for timber; they traded it to Venice for tortellini.

                            Do we limit trade to a silk-tortellini route between Shanghai and Venice? Shanghai produced it, they should benefit from it. Rehoming prevents the origin city from benefitting from the trade, altho its civ does benefit. This would be inappropriate for despotism, republic, and democracy. Under a centralized government (monarchy, commie, fun), all gold ends up where the rulers want it, anyway. I think rehoming is acceptable under these gov'ts.

                            I vote NO. I'm one of those silly people who play an aesthetic game, not necessarily to win. Stick with how it really happens...

                            ------------------
                            "There is no fortress impregnable to an ass laden with gold."
                            -Philip of Macedon
                            The first President of the first Apolyton Democracy Game (CivII, that is)

                            The gift of speech is given to many,
                            intelligence to few.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              One more no. It is clearly another unintended feature, making the game easier for the human player yet again.
                              Hasdrubal's Home.
                              Ceterum censeo Romam esse delendam.

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