damn it!!! what am i doing wrong!

[splangy]

i like to play prince most of my time and i have a few problems that always make winning damn near impossible!

1-im incredably good at keeping up in tech until the ai starts trading en-masse and i run out of city room! help! im not slow, i just cant keep up with: "france give zulus writing, zulus give french gunpowder, french give englis gunpowder...." the entire planet catches up to me in 3 turns!!

2-i cant get any good early wonders, id rather develop my citys than build them.

3-the AI tends to do the "allie up against me and refuse to do anything with me real early on! like 1300's!

4-i always say "im gona build citys right up till the end" but i usually get sidetracked and dont. does that matter?

5-i tend to be awkwardly rich early on but then my riches go down the tube its annoying!

6-in demo i cant seem to get a good science rate up like some of you do! that sucks!

7-this is more of a personal problem but in my last few games ive learned to hate the english as they get all the wonders i want! last game they got both leo AND gl. what the hell! also the zulus retarded agression tends to get on my nerves as well!

[KrazyHorse]

Don't build the GL on Prince; you won't need it.

Don't bother building cities past #20 or so; it's just a distraction.

Is every city square around every city RRed+farmland/mine? If not, then you've made a mistake. Every city should have at least 1 engineer working full time.

[La Fayette]

splangy
There are many levels in this game. If you tell us you lose almost every game at prince level, this means that you should play a few games at warlord level. Don't forget to read the GL in the meantime (information and morale are important: the GL will give you information and playing a level that makes it possible for you to win will improve your morale).
Don't hesitate to ask questions. There is almost certainly at least one person on this forum able to give you an answer to any question you might ask.
Good civing , splangy.

[fittstim]

1 - Make contact with the other civs and trade techs with them. In the early years, they are almost always willing to trade techs with you and you can reap the benefits.

2 - What do you mean "develop" your cities? I wouldn't suggest building any improvment other than a temple in your cities until you're required to build an aquifer. Build caravans to develop trade, build dips to make contact/steal from the other civs, build settlers to found new cities and build roads.

3- The AI will always team up against the human player who is winning.

4 - Continually expanding your empire (through city building) isn't necessary but it helps if you are interested in having "high scores".

5 - In Democracy, don't forget to immediately increase your lux rate to at least 30% (I usually choose 40%). The amount of tax/sci you get is directly related to your trade routes. So develop them early on and you'll be sitting pretty.

6 - I feel that way about the French. They always seem to be right up there on the tech tree with a very high [cheating AI] sci rate even though they are a 5-city monarchy. Nothing you can do about it except to change the British civ from 0,1,0 (expansionist) to -1,-1,1 (rational, perfectionist, civilized) - but then they become the Babylonians...

[shade]

some tips that might help
- try to have at least 1 settler/engineer per city to improve city radii
-build caravans to build wonders(just stack those caravans until you need them)
-try to build Great wall/united Nations, this gives you a little break
against aggressive AI
-if Demo doesn't work for you go to Communism (3 free defence units,no corruption,no unhappiness,max 80%)
-if you attack make sure you win/take over city
-build spies/dips to bribe/steal/cheat the hell out of the game (my personal strategy)

Shade

[Marquis de Sodaq]

1. To expand on the above suggestions, trade techs early on. You spare yourself the time of having to research them. Also, your cost of researching (as the tech leader) is greater - the game brings some parity to research, the beaker cost is less for those trailing behind. If you close the tech gap, you are penalized less. Give worthless techs away to close this gap. If you don't care if all the world knows construction, give it to everybody.

4. Don't worry about continuous expansion. You gain more by having a reasonable (to you) number of cities that grow large.

5. Your late game finance troubles probably are the result of building more improvements than your trade can afford. Build less, trade more. Instead of a cathedral in all 20 cities (60g/turn upkeep, 2400 shields to build them), build Michaelangelo's Chapel for 400 shields - Just eight caravans! For more direct aid, build Adam Smith's - all temples, granaries, marketplaces, libraries, and more are free!

6. Trade heavily! Caravans are your best friends in this game. They give you gold and a science boost upon delivery, and increase arrows in the trading city. This all adds up to a strong science rate. Those you don't deliver are stockpiled for building wonders.

[reds4ever]

spangly,
reading in between the lines, the reason your money is being eaten up is because you are building city improvements that you don't need. each improvement costs money to maintain each turn, don't build a temple in a city that is in no danger of rioting or an aqeduct in a city that is n't going to get to size 8 anytime soon, on prince you should be able to build a marketplace long before you need a temple by whichtime the revenue from the market will pay the maintenance on the temple, same principal with bank and aqueduct. also you need to build wonders, the pyramids is probally the best early wonder on prince as it allows fast growth and saves you building granarys in all your cities(and paying the maintenance)

in short look at the wonders again and don't build improvements just to mnake the city picture look pretty

[La Fayette]

Originally posted by shade
-if Demo doesn't work for you go to Communism (3 free defence units,no corruption,no unhappiness,max 80%)
(Shade

...and VET SPIES: the most powerful unit in this game
(I built more than 200 in my last game)
For example, look at sabotaging enemy units: those units lose half their strength at once, so you kill them easily afterwards, and the cost is low since, out of 10 vet spies sabotaging units, you lose less than 3!

(La Fayette, after successful attack of a strong enemy army, now yellow coloured and almost unable to fight)

[Ecthy]

Originally posted by fittstim
2 - What do you mean "develop" your cities? I wouldn't suggest building any improvment other than a temple in your cities until you're required to build an aquifer. Build caravans to develop trade, build dips to make contact/steal from the other civs, build settlers to found new cities and build roads.

aquiwhat? you don't play civ often, do you? first of all, you should build a library in each city before building an aqueduct.

3- The AI will always team up against the human player who is winning.

wrong. if done right, you can have many strong allies, even when you're winning the game

5 - In Democracy, don't forget to immediately increase your lux rate to at least 30% (I usually choose 40%). The amount of tax/sci you get is directly related to your trade routes. So develop them early on and you'll be sitting pretty.

I don't develop any trade routes yet only put my lux rate at 20%. I can do that because I build Mike's and Bach's early in the game. in a war (with units outside of cities), putting it to 30% or more is wise

[splangy]

thanks for the tips, heres a few other things that i now see are important.

first, its not that i cant win, ive tried diety and have done pretty damn good (2020-18,000 citisens, and only 3 of 7 AI left), its just that when i lose certain things (i always play bloodlust, so if i lose leo i quit), it becomes real tedius.

i never knew caravans were so important, what citys are best to trade with?
i like to build alot of early city improvement, what should i build?
what weopons are best? are spys really that great?
what govemants are best for a perfectionist, conquest, anti-AI(i really hate the ai) play style.
what kinds of things SHOULD i do in diplomacy?
one time, i was a african civiization (obviusly the world map) and i irigated, and colooniseed, and mined, and roaded EVERY TILE in africa, was that sane?

thanks for the help!!!

[Laertes]

Originally posted by splangy
i never knew caravans were so important, what citys are best to trade with?

Big ones, on rivers, on another continent, belonging to another civ. But any big, trade heavy city is good

i like to build alot of early city improvement, what should i build?

Temple - at Prince level, in Monarchy, you do not need it till size 6 probably, unless you have 16+ cities. The next thing you need is an aqueduct at size 8. Only build a library or market place if you're producing >10 beakers and >4 gold, and are building a science-specialist city

what weopons are best?

In the early game in my opinion, diplomats, elephants and Legions. Against walls you need catapults. Diplos should do reconnaisance, highlighting where enemy units are when in the field, and giving you some idea of what defence is in a city.

are spys really that great?

Oh yes - what units are in the city? Want to destroy the walls? Want to buy a city instead of throwing units at it? A vet spy is your woman!! Send them into a city to sabotage a random improvement, and you have an excellent chance of getting a veteran. Then you can go for wall sabotage and cheap city purchases.

what govemants are best for a perfectionist, conquest, anti-AI(i really hate the ai) play style.

I am not sure that perfectionist and conquest go together. There are plenty of infinite-city-sprawl (ICS) advocates around, where most cities are size 2.

what kinds of things SHOULD i do in diplomacy?

Demand tribute for your patience!! and give tech gifts.

one time, i was a african civiization (obviusly the world map) and i irigated, and colooniseed, and mined, and roaded EVERY TILE in africa, was that sane?

Depends on when you did it. Don't irrigate until you are close to monarchy, or only have plains squares available. Dont road non-shielded grass. Only improve the squares you can use immediately or very soon. And dont improve them at all (or hardly at all) until you have your first four cities underway.

[fittstim]

Originally posted by Ecthelion


aquiwhat? you don't play civ often, do you? first of all, you should build a library in each city before building an aqueduct.



wrong. if done right, you can have many strong allies, even when you're winning the game



I don't develop any trade routes yet only put my lux rate at 20%. I can do that because I build Mike's and Bach's early in the game. in a war (with units outside of cities), putting it to 30% or more is wise

You're a mean, unpleasant person, Ecthelion

Plus, I totally disagree with you about the library...

[fittstim]

splangy, depending on how you play your game, I think that dips and spies are the most important units in the game. They can bring a lagging civ up to par with the leading civ but also bring the leading civ down to the bottom. Oh so powerful are they.

Spies are even more powerful because they aren't destroyed after their use and you can steal one tech after another from the same city (dips can't do this).

[Laertes]

They are also very handy, when positioned (but not fortified) outside border cities, to warn about incoming spies ready to plunder mobile warfare or space flight.

[splangy]

thanks!! i just played a game with you tips and wn by conquest 19 somtin! thanks again!!!