OCC Fortnight 10 - Discussion and Logs

[Oldman]

I've e-mailed a scenario to Paul, you play as the Gibraltarians.
You need to move to get the right start location, but it shouldn't be too much trouble!!!

I've included a new city.txt file called (city.new) and the original (city.old), the game works with either, but i just changed some of the city names because i've made up all the civs.

[Paul]

http://members.home.nl/paulvdb/occ10.zip

If you want to use the new city names you must rename city.new to city.txt. Oldman included a copy of the original city.txt (named city.old), but if you have made your own changes to your city.txt you should make a backup copy first.

[Scouse Gits]

Oh Gordon Bennett!!!!

I haven't had a chance to do either OCC9 or BCB1 yet - so now we have OCC10, BCAD1 (or some such title) and did I see some suggestion for BCB2?????

I might catch up by Xmas - I'm still here - still want to be 'in' - but have no time ...

Good civin'

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____________
Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

[Oldman]

Cheers Paul!!!

Scouse, Keep up man!!! i mean you're letting the side down!??! What are you doing all day in Liverpool? Are you working or something?!?! Just think, 2 weeks and all those bloody students will have buggered off and you can play civ all day!!!!!

[Bohlen]

I'm planning on competing in this one. Please take a look at my post in the following thread:
http://apolyton.net/forums/Forum3/HT...tml?date=09:16

My questions posed there relate to OCC in general and not OCC #10 specifically so I thought I'd put a link here to see if I could get some opinions from the OCC experts.


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Proud Warrior of the O.W.L. Alliance

[vik]

Okay, I completed OCC #10 this morning. Thanks for the map, Oldman -- nice twist.

Well, I think I had some excellent hut luck early on. I got two technologies that slowed my research, but mostly 4-legged units. But, the lowlight of my experience was how late I established a Republic, and, correspondingly, how late it took me to get to size 21. I also had an issue with the seafaring technology (harbor), which also slowed my growth. Other than that, I think I did okay. I took a gamble on the end-game technology route, opting for flight before atomic theory. I think it may have worked, but others can judge for me (and please comment on the viability of this). Thanks.

Highlights (Deity, 2.4.2) 1783 landing:

Colossus: 1700bc
Copernicus: 425bc
Shakespeare’s: 25bc
Isaac Newton’s: 540ad
Darwin’s: 1060ad
Apollo: 1600ad

Monarchy: 1250bc
Republic: 225bc
Democracy: 460ad

1st Trade Route: 600bc
2nd Trade Route: 575bc
3rd Trade Route: 425bc

Size 12: 25bc
Size 21: 420ad

Trade: 750bc
Construction: 525bc
Sanitation: 120ad
Refrigeration: 880ad
Automobile: 1160ad
Computers: 1400ad
Space Flight: 1590ad


4000bc- Rocky, leader of the Gibraltians, searches.
3950bc- Hmmm, 2 whales, one gold, and one of the “special” squares covered by unexplored blackness.
But the intro said I had to search around for the city site. Maybe I need to look more.
3900bc- hut-horsemen
3850bc- hut-chariot; meet luxembourgers; peace & alliance; I hope they never forget that I could crush there puny little undefended size-1 city with my chariot right now; hut-archers
3800bc- hut, horsemen; excellent!
3750bc- hut-writing
3700bc- meet seychellions; peace & alliance; didn’t ask for a gift because they had map-making
3650bc- Gibralter founded on the aforementioned location
3600bc- researching code of laws; hut-mysticism
3500bc- hut-barbarians (kilt’em)
3450bc- meet tibetans; make peace with the Dhali Llama; gain alliance
3200bc- hut-archers
3050bc- meet fijians; peace but no alliance; hut-currency
2600bc- hut, 50gold
2300bc- finally discover code of laws; researching moncarchy
2250bc- hut, horseback riding (Yech!)
1750bc- eskimos land; meet eskimos; peace & alliance with eskimos
1700bc- colossus built; building library
1500bc- hmm, looks like the World-Small map.
1350bc- excellent! Hut-monarchy, revolt
1300bc- WTF!?! Eskimos have Astronmy!?!? Trade eskimos for astronomy and map-making; share maps
trade luxembourgers for ironworking; share maps
get warrior code and 300 gold from seychellions; share maps
25 gold and the wheel from tibetans; share maps
exploring the arctic rim with archer (going left)
1250bc- monarchy established; library built; building marketplace
1200bc- researching trade
1150bc- marketplace built; building temple
975bc- get mathematics and masonry and 250 gold from eskimos
925bc- temple built; building trireme (I just have to see that dark square)
825bc- oops; dark square was a fish I should have seen after trading maps with the eskimos
800bc- slowing down “trireme” production to wait for the trade discovery
775bc- arctic hut- legion
750bc- trade discovered; researching construction (because I know someone discovered literacy)
get 425 gold in gifts, but no literacy; the seychellions are too busy working on the great library
650bc- built 3 caravans and a trireme so far; building more caravans
600bc- gold caravan to Unmak Island (eskimo-demanded) 228 gold
575bc- construction discovered; researching literacy; silver caravan to Unmak Island (demanded) 253 gold
550bc- tibetan civilization destroyed by the luxumbourgers
475bc- 475 from allies; waiting to deliver last caravan until after literacy is discovered
425bc- copernicus built; literacy discovered; researching republic; building caravans at 1 per turn
dye and copper caravans to Nikolski (eskimo-demanded); only 160 gold each. Hmmm, that’s low
400bc- arctic hut- bridge building
375bc- I’m not building a colosseum. It is useless as a size-5 city without a republic government.
300bc- 400 gold from allies
275bc- republic finally discovered; researching philosophy; REVOLT
225bc- republic established; I have about 8 caravans, but I don’t know what medicine is yet. We luv
175bc- 200 gold from luxembourgers; I think I need a colosseum after all
125bc- colosseum built; building aqueduct
100bc- aqueduct built; building caravans; 125 gold from allies
50bc- discover philosophy; discover medicine; researching engineering
25bc- shakespeare’s built; building caravans; weluv halted at size 12; sold colosseum
1ad- sold temple; actally, I built a dip first, then caravans
40ad- discovered engineering; researching sanitation
120ad- discovered sanitation; researching university; cranking up luxuries for weluv
encounter th’jamaicans, mon. peace, mon. share maps, mon. no alliance, mon
140ad- sewer system built; hijacked a trireme; building caravans
let me get this straight. No one has discovered pottery, and no one has discovered seafaring?
Okay, jamaicans had pottery. Got that and banking in trades.
240ad- luxumbourgers make peace with the babylonians. Guess the tibetties died too soon
discover university; researching seafaring; halting weluv at size 16. No harbor. Geez.
320ad- discover seafaring; researching invention; built university; building harbor; weluv again
340ad- harbor built; building bank
360ad- barb city just south where cameroon should be.
400ad- invention discovered; researching democracy
420ad- size 21; halting we luv
460ad- democracy discovered; researching theory of gravity
480ad- bank built; building caravan
520ad- discover theory of gravity; researching gunpowder; building INC; preparing for weluv
540ad- INC built; building caravan
560ad- gunpowder discovered; researching chemistry
600ad- discover chemistry; researching explosives
620ad- halted weluv at size 25
640ad- discovered explosives; researching metallurgy; building a pair of engineers
dump knowledge on AI; gain alliance with da jamaica, mon, by declaring war on fijis
680ad- discover metallurgy; researching navigation
720ad- discover navigation; researching physics
760ad- discover physics; researching magnetism
800ad- discover magnetism; researching electricity
840ad- discover electricity; researching refrigeration
880ad- discover refrigeration; researching economics
920ad- discover economics; researching steam engine
960ad- discover steam engine; researching railroad
980ad- stock exchange built; building supermarket
1000ad- railroad discovered; researching industrialization
1040ad- industrialization discovered; researching steel; supermarket built; building darwin’s
1060ad- darwin’s built; discover steel & corporation; researching refining; dump knowledge-200 gold
1080ad- discover refining; researching combustion
1100ad- built factory, building powerplant
1120ad- discover combustion; researching automobile
1160ad- discover automobile; researching mass production; switched production to superhighways
1180ad- ceasefire with fijis; superhighways built; building powerplant
1200ad- discover mass production; researching electronics
1220ad- trade eskimos for leadership; trade seychellions for conscription; 225 gold in gifts
1240ad- electronics discovered; researching tactics
1260ad- powerplant built; building freights
1280ad- tactics discovered; researching machine tools; sold sewer system. I thought I could increase the population later, but it looks like I’ll be turning all 3 river squares into hills/forests to get 80 shields
1300ad- Oil Caravan built; I click on “Supply and Demand” and Gibralter is the only thing that demands it
(but it also supplies it – that’s strange); aqueduct sold
1320ad- 150 gold from seycheeseans; discover machine tools; researching miniaturization
1360ad- discover miniaturization; researching computers
1380ad- offshore platform built
1400ad- computers discovered; researching mobile warfare
1420ad- research lab built; building freights
1440ad- mobile warfare discovered; researching robotics
1480ad- robotics discovered; researching flight
1510ad- flight discovered; researching radio
1530ad- radio discovered; researching advanced flight
1550ad- advanced flight discovered; researching rocketry; manufacturing plant build; building hoover’s
1570ad- discover rocketry; researching space flight; 300 gold in gifts
1580ad- sneak attack by fijians! Everyone else declares war on them. They busted 3 chariots on my engineers who were in a fortress on a hill; 350 in gifts
1590ad- space flight; researching plastics; 88 shields, so I probably didn’t need to alter the 3rd river square.
1600ad- apollo program built; building SS parts
1610ad- plastics discovered; researching atomic theory (my gamble to save some years)
1630ad- give adv flight to seycheeseans; get 150 gold
1640ad- discover atomic theory; researching nuclear fission
1670ad- discover nuclear fission; researching nuclear power; eskimos discover atomic theory (geez)
1700ad- discover nuclear power; researching the laser
1730ad- discover laser; researching superconductor
1740ad- 100 gold from seycheeseans; they didn’t ask for anything
1750ad- 15 Structurals built; building some engines
1752ad- discover superconductor; researching fusion power
1758ad- discover fusion power; researching nothing (actually, communism) sold research lab
150 gold from seycheeseans for rocketry
I wonder if I should build 4 components or the standard 6. 4 components is 20 year flight time and 6 components is 16 year flight time (launching 2 turns/4 years later). I don’t think it makes a difference in the landing year, but I’ll shave some turns off.
1760ad- sold university; oops; glad I looked at the OCC#9 logs. A 4-component space ship takes 21 years and a 6-component space ship takes 15 years. Might as well build 2 more components and land earlier
1762ad- sold library
1766ad- sold manufacturing plant to rush-buy great wall and switch to component
1768ad- launch space ship; eta is 1783; building alpine troops
1772ad- fijis kill an archer – bastiches!
1773ad- bribe the fiji ironclad. That takes care of that!
1781ad- chat with babylonians. In exchange for railroad, they ally with me. Gave me 250 gold
1783ad- Rocky (the Cruel) reaches Alpha Centauri; Civ score: 286 (37%)

EDIT: from 375 bc onward, I was referring to a "colosseum" as a "colossus." I changed the log to reflect this. Also, the first sentence is incorrect. I started this morning, and finished this afternoon. End of Edit

Again, any comments on the decision to go for flight before atomic theory? I liked the approach.


[This message has been edited by vik (edited May 30, 2000).]

[Oldman]

Nice one Vik!!! I can't believe i was beaten on my own scenario?!?! but only by a turn, 1785 was my landing year!!!!! i had a problem late on cause i over grew my city and when i transformed my land to get 80 prod, i was having 6 hunger per turn!! so i had to disband both engineers, and build 2 more to deal with the pollution. I don't think it actually hindered my production a great deal cause i used the 2 engineers to start modules so i could rush 'em!!! I'll post the log tomorrow!! Great!


Vik, i normally don't researching atomic theory upwards until after i've got space flight and plastics, and started building my ship!!! i slip back to about every 3 turns, that gets me superconductors in time to finish the components and structurals, and you can spend a couple of turns on 100% cash to rush buy the last items!!! Nice!

[Oldman]

Hey 2 posts in a row!!!! where are all you guys? So heres my log, 2 years after Vik, a few silly mistakes, but i don't think they actually cost me any time!??!

I didn't manage to get techs researching at 1 per turn at all!??! i was very close with steel, i needed about 5 more beakers!?!? argh!!!! anyway, Da Log:

2.42 Diety

Monarchy: 2850bc
Republic: 825bc
Democracy: 220ad

Colossus: 2250bc
Observatory: 250bc
Theatre: 380ad
Newtons: 160ad
Darwins: 1080ad
Apollo: 1560ad

Trade: 2300bc
Construction: 1450bc
Sanitation: 300ad
Refridgeration: 760ad
Automobile: 1080ad
Space Flight: 1550ad

Size 12: 450bc
Size 21: 560ad
24: 680ad

3950bc Founded Gibraltar
3850bc Archer (hut)
3750bc Militia
3650bc 50 (hut)
3600bc luxembourgers Peace,
3500bc 100 (hut)
3350bc code of Laws (hut)
3200bc gave code of laws to lux for alliance
3050bc currency (hut)
2850bc Monarchy, Revolution
Monarchy established!!
2300bc Trade
100 gift from lux
colossus rushed!
2250bc Colossus!!!!!
2200bc WltKD (+4 trade)
1950bc Writing
Caravan (beads)
1750bc 1st Trade to luxembourg, beads demanded, 60 revenue!
1700bc caravan (gold)
Masonry
1500bc 2nd trade to luxembourg. gold unwanted, 30 revenue
1450bc caravan (copper)
Construction
1200bc 3rd Trade to Differdange, copper unwanted 40 revenue
cons for myst with lexembourg, 50 gift!
1100bc Literacy
War with Seychellions for 100g
1050bc Marketplace
920bc Library
875bc Philosophy
Republic (free)
Revolution
825bc Temple
Republic Established!!!
800bc WLTCD (4)
775bc exchanged rep for bridges, gave writing, 100 gift!! luxembourgers
725bc Aquaduct
700bc WLTCD cancelled (7)
625bc maps, trade for map making with lux
600bc peace with tibetans for cons
575bc colesseum
WLTCD (7)
550bc 50 from lux
525bc caravan (dye)
475bc caravan (food)
450bc alliance with seychellions, 200 gift, maps
25 from luxembourg
size 12
425bc astronomy!
caravan (f)
400bc sold temple
375bc caravan (f)
325bc caravan (f)
medicine
250bc Observatory
225bc banking
200bc caravan
150bc caravan
75bc caravan
25bc caravan
20ad caravan
exchanged philos for engineering, maps, 200 gift with seychelles
40ad Theory of Gravity
60ad caravan
barb landing party!
100ad caravan
120ad invention
140ad caravan
160ad newtons college
180ad Democracy, revolution
50 from lux
200ad caravan
220ad Democracy Established!!
240ad caravan
280ad caravan
inv for seafaring with fiji, maps
300ad sanitation
250 from seychelles
320ad caravan
360ad caravan
380ad Theatre!!!
WLTPD (12)
250 from seychelles
75 from luxembourg
disbanded militia, rushed sewers
400ad sewers
440ad harbor
460ad Navigation
480ad caravan
500ad exchanged nav for iron, 200 gift from seychelles
520ad university (city)
Physics
560ad Bank
Magnetism
Size 21
600ad galleon
gunpowder
620ad peace with eskimos, gave 50 for quiet life!!! maps!
640ad explosives
caravan
680ad caravan
metallurgy
WLTPD cancelled (24)
peace wih jamaicans, gave 50 for quiet life!!! maps
700ad 50 from luxembourg
720ad Electricity
caravan
Trade (dye) to Kingston, 380 revenue
760ad refridgeration
engineer
800ad steam engine
caravan
840ad rail
caravan
860ad knights (hut)
880ad industry
caravan
All techs shared, actually behind most(poly, pottery) saved 10 beakers off next adv!!!
920ad economics
caravan
960ad corporation
caravan
1000ad refining!
caravan(oil)
Trade oil with luxembourg (unwanted)
1040ad combustion
supermarket
WLTPD (23)
1080ad Darwins!!
Steel
Automobile
1100ad electronics
100 gift from seychelles
150 from lux
WLTPD ends (26)
1120ad superhighways!
1140ad mass prod
1160ad factory
war with tibetans for 300
1180ad conscription
1200ad power plant
1220ad tactics
1240ad caravan
1260ad machine tools
1280ad carvan
1300ad miniatures
1320ad stock exch
1340ad computers!!
1360ad research lab!!!
But the lux do flight!??!!? argh!!!!!!!!
1380ad mobile war!
1420ad flight from lux
1440ad offshore
1460ad radio
1480ad manu plant
1510ad adv flight
1530ad rocketry
1550ad space flight
1560ad Apollo!!!!!
1580ad struct 1
plastics
galleon disbanded
1620ad atomic theory
1630 engineer disbanded
1640 engineer disbanded
1650ad comp (4)
fission
1670ad engineer
1680ad nuke power
engineer
1710ad laser
1740ad superconductor
struct (9)
1750ad 275 in gifts
1752ad 200 from lux
1754ad fussion
1758ad module(3)
1766ad struct (15)
1770ad comp(6)
Launch, 15-3-3-1-1-1 ship!! eta:1785ad!!
1771 coastal, city walls, tank, battleship, SDI etc
1785ad AC Landing!!!!
Henry VIII the Cruel!! 36% 284points


[This message has been edited by Oldman (edited June 01, 2000).]

[Bohlen]

Well, I'm sure I'm opening myself up to criticism here, but since I was determined to make OCC #10 my first challenge I thought I should share how my game went.

It went great until the end when disaster struck. An embarrassing disaster.

3 turns from landing on AC, my city was overtaken by my once allies, the Tibetans. My landing date would have been 1919. I know this is probably a very late landing date for this scenario, but I was pretty happy that I was going to hit that mark.

The big mistake that I made was trading away Advanced Flight. What happened? It was one of those times when you are flying through the diplomacy screens and you hit the wrong keys. I really meant to send the Tibetans away, but instead traded Advanced Flight for Espionage, which I did end up using to keep other civs from entering my city square. I should start a "Dumbest thing ever done in OCC" thread for that blunder. Well, as bad luck and bad play would have it, the Tibetans went on a world domination kick and took out 3 civs before breaking our alliance and making a sneak attack. I was holding out fine until 5 bombers and a naval force came in from Greenland to take out all of my defenses, allowing a weak cannon to stroll in and take everything away from me. I wish I could have seen the look on my face. I'm sure it was a good one.

This is the first game I've played on 2.42 in six months. After having played some trial OCC games on MGE, I do think the OCC game is easier to control when playing on 2.42. I got more tribute gold than I ever thought possible. Of course, my opinion doesn't mean much now thanks to my bonehead playing.

If anyone wants a good laugh by looking at the log, I can post it tonight. I'm sure I can learn even more from this experience by taking in the wisdom of the vet OCCers.

In closing, I learned a heck of a lot. The most important things learned were to be careful during diplomacy and to not underestimate the firepower of the AI, which is so easy to do during any other game.

One more thing...You can bet your life that I will be here for OCC #11. Right now, I'm going to start a bloodlust game and take my frustrations out on that bleeping AI.

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Proud Warrior of the O.W.L. Alliance

[Oldman]

Good to have you with us Bohlen!!

Tough luck about the tibetans!!! the trick with occ is to have 2 styles of play, the fast track tech check (ha ha, that's cool!!!), get the ship off asap, and then change to a complete defensive strategy: building city walls, coastals, sdi, tanks, marines, spies, the works, all for just the last 15 turns or whatever!!!!!

Post your log, the guys here are very good and will give good advice!!! My first occ game ever i played and posted my log here, number 7 i think, but i landed in 2032, and i was beaten by 2 AIs in the process?!?! argh!!! but i'm learning!!

I'm actually sort of glad the Tibetans acted that way!! i was hopeing when i did the scenario that they would be world dominators!! but on mine they got bullied by the Luxembourgers, Seychellion and Fijians all game!!! i thought the Eskimos might do more travelling, but they only engaged in a limited war the Luxembourgers after kicking the jamaicans arse in north america in the early game.

Edit: Typos, and a bunch, of, commas, that shouldn't, have been, there!!
[This message has been edited by Oldman (edited June 01, 2000).]

[vik]

Bohlen,

We don't really criticize much here, just offer pointers if we can. I encourage you to post your log, because you basically played the whole game.

I've submitted a scenario to Paul for use in OCC#11 (unless, of course, someone steps up like Oldman did this time and submits a scenario -- feel free to do so if you want).

Anyways, if my scenario gets played next, I guarantee the following:

1.) You will not have to search for a city site.
2.) You will not be taken over by the AI
3.) You will have 12 river squares
4.) Each of your four trade specials will be on river squares
4.) You will have no problem reaching 80 shields
5.) You will start with monarchy
6.) Most people will not set new personal OCC records inspite of these facts.

Intriguing, eh?

[Oldman]

Intriguing indeed Vik!!!! all those advantages, but no personal records?!??! looking forward to it!!!

I didn't mean to jump in infront of you last week Vik, sorry! no hard feelings!??! I'll have to think up a new one sometime, theres got to be something in this skull of mine...

[Paul]

Stupid Luxembourgers

They declared war on me and took my city. All that just because I wouldn't pay them all my gold. And I was doing quite well at the time. I did play the game again and landed in 1765, but that doesn't count because this time I knew the map.

[Oldman]

Sorry Paul!!!!! i meant for the luxembourgers to be a nice quiet peace loving people?!?! shows how wrong i got the setup hey?!?! they spent my whole game trading blows with the seychelles and tibetans!??!

good landing date second time around though!!!! beat me by 20 years!!?!?! 10 whole turns?!?! argh!!!!!!!!!!!

Did you keep a log of the 2nd attempt? post it all the same i'd like to see where you gained the time, or e-mail it to me alternatively!??!

Roll on number 11, is all i can say...

[vik]

Oldman,

Hard feelings? None whatsoever!

I am always hoping other people make scenarios. I asked Paul to save mine for later if someone else had one ready.

I encourage you to make more, and I encourage anyone to contribute. Especially because my ideas are running dry. I've tried to put some kind of odd twist in each of my scenarios -- some problem that the OCC players had to deal with. In addition, I've tried to make one scenario have the potential for several very different outcomes.

I'm running out of ideas and I don't want the Fortnights to become too routine. It seems like others agree, because they have added some interesting things in their scenarios, too, with the island, the arctic, etc.

SO please, submit your scenarios if you would like, and do NOT worry about stepping on my toes.