Gee! More BLATANT AI Cheating!

[Gatekeeper]

Everyone:

Forgive me for yet one more mini-rant, but the most recent examples of AI cheating simply take the cake:

1. I have a veteran musketeers unit fortified right outside my capital. The AI moves a unit up to it and subverts it. No stunning surprise there. What PO's me is the AI managed to convert the unit for around 200 gold. Yeah, you heard right. 200 gold. Of course, if the human player would try that damn stunt, it'd cost around 1,500 gold. We're talking slightly pre-industrial age gold here, not modern.

2. AI-controlled legions are upgraded to musketeers with Leonardo's Workshop. Pretty cool how an ancient offensive military unit can become a Renassiance Period offensive/defensive military unit. Not.

3. The AI Spanish earned 58 gold in one turn. I went into their bank account and saw that, in actuality, their statements were running to the tune of -12 gold income per turn. Yet the bastards were raking in +58 gold per turn! WTF?! Last time I checked, one could only sell so many improvements per turn, and the AI wasn't doing that.

So right now I'm mad again. To the point of just eradicating the Spanish with the "God" abilities given to human players. I've rationlized this as much as possible, and I really don't care if this is the Emperor level or not. The AI shouldn't need an advantage in every single arena of this game.

Sheesh.

CYBERAmazon

[granite00]

quote: Originally posted by CYBERAmazon on 08-07-2000 07:36 PM 2. AI-controlled legions are upgraded to musketeers with Leonardo's Workshop. Pretty cool how an ancient offensive military unit can become a Renassiance Period offensive/defensive military unit. Not.

It works like this for the human player. Why is this unfair for the AI?

[Gatekeeper]

Granite:

It isn't. I'm just complaining anyway — probably because I rarely build Leonardo's Workshop. Nos. 1 and 3 are the real annoying cheats, though.

CYBERAmazon

[SandMonkey]

Cyber - For no. 3, did you check to see that the AI had any caravans near opponents cities? That oculd account for a surplus of gold for one turn. Or was this over many turns they kept getting the same amount?

[Gatekeeper]

SandMonkey:

Eep. No, I didn't check. **sobbing** And here I've been, all along falsely accusing the innocent AI of cheating!! AGGHHH!! I can't live with myself!

CYBERAmazon (damn, I knew I forgot something prior to ranting)

[jpk]

During one game I played an AI civilization bribed a unit or a city, I have forgotten wihich. On my next turn I looked to see how much money they had. They had a negative balance.

[Oldman]

Obviously they had not only discovered Banking but also must have built a wonder to improve the bank managers happiness!!!!! because mine certainly goes ape when i go into the negative?!?!?

[inca911]

You've never heard of defecit spending before?!?
I'm very very glad that the AI cheats as much as it does, and I wish it would cheat even more! The AI is a lame opponent even given all the nice cheating benefits it possesses. If a bit of so-called cheating is what must be programmed to make a competent AI opponent, then I'm all for it. I believe it is simply too difficult to program a compentent AI opponent without giving some easy cheat routes to improve the AI's game performance. All I want for Christmas is a better Civ3 AI!!

[Mao]

Well geez, if I started a thread everytime I was pissed at the AI...I would be s-o-o-o-o banned

But Cyber, did you cheating make you feel better?

[Gatekeeper]

quote: Originally posted by inca911 on 08-08-2000 10:14 AM The AI is a lame opponent even given all the nice cheating benefits it possesses. If a bit of so-called cheating is what must be programmed to make a competent AI opponent, then I'm all for it. I believe it is simply too difficult to program a compentent AI opponent without giving some easy cheat routes to improve the AI's game performance. All I want for Christmas is a better Civ3 AI!!

***

Inca911:

I expect Thue — a Freeciv developer and proponent — to pop up on this thread anytime now, extolling the virtues of his more than competent AI.

CYBERAmazon

[Gatekeeper]

quote: Originally posted by Mao on 08-08-2000 10:47 AM Well geez, if I started a thread everytime I was pissed at the AI...I would be s-o-o-o-o banned But Cyber, did you cheating make you feel better?

***

Mao:

YES! I felt the power of GODHOOD flooding through my veins! Then — POOF! — the Spanish civilization vanished, courtesy of the GODHOOD in my veins!!!

**sigh**

Then the oh-so-human guilt trip hit like a ton of bricks. Suffice to say, I reverted the game back ... and the Spanish civilization has since made peace with me and made life miserable for the Russian Empire.

CYBERAmazon

[Mao]

Guilt? You're leading thousands of troops to their deaths, and now you feel guilty?

[Chainsaw]

quote: Originally posted by inca911 on 08-08-2000 10:14 AM You've never heard of defecit spending before?!? I'm very very glad that the AI cheats as much as it does, and I wish it would cheat even more! The AI is a lame opponent even given all the nice cheating benefits it possesses. If a bit of so-called cheating is what must be programmed to make a competent AI opponent, then I'm all for it. I believe it is simply too difficult to program a compentent AI opponent without giving some easy cheat routes to improve the AI's game performance. All I want for Christmas is a better Civ3 AI!!

That´s 100% my opinion about the AI´s cheating. I guess that´s the reason some of you guys start thinking about all those funny challenges like the Nomad Game (or however it´s called) or playing the WWII Scn with the turks (heh heh).

What I DON`T like about the AI´s cheating are some of the exaggregations the AI allows itself, e.g. like the bribing affair mentioned by CA.
In my current game an barb archer took off a fortified non-vet rifleman on grassland keeping half his hitpoints... Just imagine that! Damn it, if some dumb archer appears next to such a defended city I´m just to lazy to activate my rifleman and convince the barb to leave...

[Gatekeeper]

quote: Originally posted by Mao on 08-08-2000 03:11 PM Guilt? You're leading thousands of troops to their deaths, and now you feel guilty?

***

Mao:

That's me! The evil emperor whose conscious can be flipped on and off like a light switch.

CYBERAmazon

[Mao]

I don't get mad at the AI anymore really. I start like so many games and never finish them when I'm either too far behind or too far ahead. I never find that happy median, you know?