Impact of huts on 2x or 1x

[War4ever]

yes slowwhand....that is all i meant, Rah and i were seeing it from different angles......

[rah]

After playing a 1x1x game this weekend, I'm even more convinced that huts add a highler level of luck in 1x games.

In 2x games, you can make up for bad hut luck a lot easier.

Getting that non-unit 2x mov out of that first hut is a much bigger advantage in 1x, since it takes longer to get units out on the board.

Getting that tech hut on or off the path is a big difference. It could make a 20 turn diffence to Monarchy. Getting to monarchy faster is much more important in 1x just to have 3 units per city without support costs. (besides the faster growth and better shields and arrows)

I am not arguing the merits ov 2x vs 1x. Just saying that hut luck is more important in 1x games.

Rich

[SlowwHand]

I agree, Rah. But it's stil one of those "half full or half empty" propositions.

[rah]

I don't know. In a 2x games you can many units out exploring quite quickly so while you always love to get non-units it's not critical. In 1x your cities can't support more than a unit or two without crippling any building capabilities, it and take forever to build them.
And getting the 50 bucks from a hut might save you only 3 or 4 turns in 2x spitting out that settler, but in 1x it can save 7-8 turns.

[SlowwHand]

And that's the 2 sides of the coin.
War4 is giving examples of how a person can get a good lead from huts in 2X.
The other side is that you can get set back from huts worse in 1X.

Of course, I'm basing this summary on the belief I understand you both, which is certainly a reach.

[Eyes_Of_Night]

There isn't even any comparison. 4 cities to 1 in 1x1x, game over. 4 cities to 1 in 2x2x, challenging, but the game is far from over. If a guy gets a good start in 1x1x you can't do anything about it. And if the guy has a whale in his capital on 1x1x it is a HUGE advantage. Everything in 1x1x is more unbalanced than in 2x2x. You can just run away with a lead in 1x1x, in 2x2x the game isn't over yet.

[rah]

ALL RIGHT EYES> Now it just leaves Markus. (we'll see what kind of man is he )

I was hoping to get your opinion on this one. Thanks, for not muddying the waters by talking about whether 2x or 1x is better.
AND I agree with you 100%

[SlowwHand]

Yeah well, difference of opinion is what makes a horserace.

[rah]

Believe it or not, I like dissagreements. It's the best way to challange your own beliefs. (which doesn't seem to happen as much as you get older). Others can provide arguements that I won't think of.
I can see what War4 and Markus are trying to say. But after listening, I'm not convinced yet and stand by my original opinion.
Of course, I doubt I convinced them either But maybe with a little help from others.

Rich

[markusf]

Originally posted by EyesOfNight
There isn't even any comparison. 4 cities to 1 in 1x1x, game over. 4 cities to 1 in 2x2x, challenging, but the game is far from over. If a guy gets a good start in 1x1x you can't do anything about it. And if the guy has a whale in his capital on 1x1x it is a HUGE advantage. Everything in 1x1x is more unbalanced than in 2x2x. You can just run away with a lead in 1x1x, in 2x2x the game isn't over yet.

Well for those of us that don't change the riot factor to chieften level its a lot harder.

on diety, unhappiness will kill your civ. In case people haven't noticed if you build more then 7 cities on diety there is no way those cities are going to celebrate to size 8. For every city over 7 one size 3 city can't celebrate on a med map. Once you go to rep and have celebrated up to size 8, your techs at 2-3 while someone with 15 cities is stuck at 5-12/turn because they couldn't celebrate. (assuming niether has HG) Not to mention a player with 7 or 8 big cities can then expand like crazy, and build marketplaces in size 8 cities. (~30 gold/science a city)

[rah]

Even if we limit the discussion to number of cities, The person that gets to 7 cities first has a heck of an advantage.

[markusf]

Originally posted by rah
Even if we limit the discussion to number of cities, The person that gets to 7 cities first has a heck of an advantage.

lol, you haven't played enough.. In 1x you just have no clue how well you are doing in a duel until the happy wonders are built. If your playing in a game with 3 or 4 players, happy wonders don't even matter, the onely thing that matters is economic power. If your playing with 4 players, with a 2 on 2 if 2 players use trade extensively they will complete destroy the other 2 even if they build every single wonder. In 2x if you build HG and mikes on diety there is no stopping you.

[rah]

What the heck does any of that have to do with Huts. quit changing the subject. Except that they help you get wherever you want to go/ or kill you, and he who gets lucky has one heck of an advantage.

[Eyes_Of_Night]

This is just markus trying to tell the world that he is indeed a "trade god" and that there is no stopping his trade genius. Which is why King is no longer a real settings because on King it's too easy to stop his trade strategy. Therefore Deity will now become the official way of play.

[atawa]

Originally posted by markusf
For every city over 7 one size 3 city can't celebrate on a med map.

So if I understand correctly if you have 10 city's only 4 can celebrate to size 8?