Dreaming a History for a World yet to hit shelves

[belinda9]

Don't take it that way, then

Sorry if you overvalued the comment -- I realized after I saw it in print it didn't come out exactly the same without the tone of voice,

I base that comment SOLELY on the assumption/insistance that the Americas be "left open" for colonization by the other powers (Euro, Asian, etc etc) rather than having 'real' (ie, human-run)civs placed there also...as you yourself stated it, the "colonial" aspect.

That's all

[Rasputin]

Problem

A major probl;em with all this planning is that it looks like the Aussie version of game wont be out till Chrismtas at earliest maybe later, if so, you guys are going to get a huge lead on us poor aussies in knolwedge of the game.

I hope I cna find a good WAREZ site to get it from in October !!!!

[Rasputin]

Bigger problem No MP in civ 3

http://www.apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26042&perpage=30&pagenumber=1

Go read !!!!!

[OzzyKP]

NNNOOOOooooooooo!!!!!!!

THOSE BASTARDS!!!!

They can't do this!!!!

How dare they do this to us again. They made us pay 3 times for Civ2, i'm not doing it again for Civ3 too!!!

Damn it!!! Money grubbing bastards!

We need multiplayer in October! I don't want to wait till freaking May for HOTW3 to happen! This really sucks.

Make your voices heard! Tell Firaxis you are royally pissed off about this.

[Rasputin]

Well lets not let it totally destroy HOTW3 plans, if worse comes to worse Capo and such wil jsut have make a ModPAck to suit our needs.... Not that that is what we all want...

[OzzyKP]

It seems we will have to wait till the freaking spring to start this game.... ugh...

We better make sure it is perfect then.

I was glad to see CapTVK post in the diplo FAQ thread, he is still around and interested in diplo games, i'd absolutly love to have him in on HOTW3. Cap, if you read this please consider joining this. It'll be the first diplo game in Civ3, and hopefully one of the best ever.

Any other dream team possibles?

If Cap plays perhaps he can hook us up with some of the old school originals.

[OzzyKP]

Number of Civs and American AI

Much of the talk in here was about having American AI, but from what i've heard about the game it seems we'll only have 8 civs as our max rather than 16 or something.

So i suggest we just have 8 humans in the "old world" and then perhaps get capo to up the number of barbarians in the Americas. That'd work too and solve most of our problems provided they are strong enough.

[Rasputin]

Suggestions

1. Perhaps as this thread is about a MP game for civ3 we should get it moved to Civ3 General to show markg how inteest in mp is buildsing. Also might get others itnerested.

2. I think for the americas it would be good to have regular barb activity , each turn an extra raiding party added until the whole continent is civilised. Would make people think twice aobut just sending a few explorers and settlers to the americas. Perhpas no barbarian leaders though to prevernt any one jsut goibng for the ransom gold.

[Rasputin]

*Bump*

Any further ideas guys , or we al given up now Civ3 MP delayed...

would there be any interest in starting another Diplo game of civ 2 after this one finished...

I think HOTW2 is almost definatley going to be finished before christmas .. Nukes are only a Wonder away as is Space !!

[drake]

Hmmm

I think 5 solid players is better than 8 iffy players as far as game quality. 7 people is alreasy hard and long enough. Do we really want to play with 8 people???

[Rasputin]

do we want to include AI ??? most seem to say no based on Civ2 AI.. we might learn more of the AI in coming months, might be worth while palying with 5-6 regulars with extra spaces filled with AI ....

[drake]

Well I'm not really with using any AI myself. Even if they are smarter in civ 3, they're still probably going to be a non-factor in the game, besides to maybe fill space and offer a little resisitance for the explorers from the old world.....

But thats just my opinion.

[belinda9]

OK I know this is probably a waste of time, but here goes anyway.
This is a case for using a non-known-world map

I know everyone says they like to use a world map because then "everyone knows where you're talking about"
But to me, that's just the point -- where's the imagination in that?
Maybe it's just because the exploration and 'uncovering of the black' is my absolute favorite part of the game, but I just think it takes something out of it when everyone already knows where everything is when they first boot up the game.
You know you're in Europe and if you go south you'll hit the Med and if you go west you'll hit the Atlantic and if you sail off that way you'll find America

My contention is that it changes the fundamental element of diplomacy when YOU DON'T ALREADY KNOW WHERE EVERYTHING IS! If you always use a world map, you're always essentially replaying the same game over and over.
With an unknown map (and it doesn't even have to be random -- you can get someone to make it for you), it's way different. If you run into another civ, you don't know where they actually are in relation to you: you could be right smack up against them or they could not have a city for 1/2 a continent away. Would this not affect how you initially deal with them as opposed to if you know right off the bat where they're from and about where in the world they are? Are you not necessarily going to go for Mapmaking if you don't even know when (or if) you'll ever hit a coast, as opposed to knowing up front that there will be a race for America?
Isn't always playing on a world map essentially just recreating the same history over and over with only minor variations?

And if you're just reading the posts, I would think it would engage the imagination some to try to visualize what thay're talking about instead of immediately being able to know that the Romans are fussing with the Arabs over the Suez Canal. You post maps anyhow.
Also, the trading of maps becomes a much more important aspect of diplomacy, especially early in game. If I've explored alot, my maps might be worth two techs to you. It can become a trade commodity.

OK so I've never actually been able to get in on a diplo game from the get-go. And I'm not getting Civ3 anytime soon because I'd have to upgrade my computer to do so and I'm not doing that in the foreseeable future. But if Civ3 ain't having an MP capability anyhow, and someone wanted to do another Civ2 diplo game, I personally would love to see, JUST ONCE, one that wasn't another replay of the history of the known world.

Just food for thought

[OzzyKP]

I am open to the idea of a non-real world map. All the Diplogames I have been involved in have been real maps, and while they have many good points there are also some bad points about them as Belinda pointed out.

In fact the more I think about it I think I really want this game to be on a random map or a map made by someone else. Although it would dismantle all the discussion we've had about the AI in America, hehe, but I think it would certainly make for a different and interesting experience. Allow for more creativity, we could name our own land forms and continents and mountian ranges.

Though of course the entire game is based on Earth history so we can't really get away from that unless we design a scenario from stratch and really get creative on it, but I don't think we want to bother with that. So in many ways we will always be just recreating history that already happened.

I'm open to discussion. Lets hear ya all.

[Frank Johnson]

If you are trying to have large numbers of people play, recruit large numbers of interested players, even if some are new. Try a team method, maybe have 2-3 players available for each slot. Then players could swap off each week, or back each other up to fill empty time blocks. If this is unrealistic, then at least collect a list from each player of what player(s) they would like to sub for them if it comes down to it. Nothing stomps on a Diplo game more than a questionable sub out. Besides that, there should be a creed amongst the players, specificly the subs, to play their hearts out no matter what, and follow what the owner would like most (if they provided that info), at least for the first session.

Other possible ways of making NA and SA less quickly colonizable include, tweaking the map to make the terrain in the new world a bit more hostile than maybe even historicly it was. This would make resources in the new world harder to develop.

Civs or barbarians in this places are possible, but controling them to make them do what is desired, limit the first racers to the new world...may be difficult. Maybe you could make the natives more hostile to those with larger colonies or military presences in the new world.

A combination is probably best, you arrive in the new world to find it a hostile place, only to have the best parts inhabited by hordes of natives......its probably the most accurate.....

Want to stunt the growth of these native civs? One way would be to deny them the ability to remove forests, jungles, etc. SO they cannon develop much.