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  • Manifesto of a determined "leader"....

    Quite recently I have been called numerous names, and have been the subject of numerous adjectives. Some possibly warranted, others were attributed to me with no prior knowledge at all.

    A lot of people are confused by me, they consider me short tempered, they consider me to be too confrontational to play with.

    Here is what makes me tick, and by the way, thank you very much for reading what I have posted....

    I do not like civilization for the "normal" reasons people do, I don't particularly enjoy faceless and emotionless conflit. I don't particularly enjoy the idea of exponential growth for the sake of exponential growth, I don't particularly enjoy the idea of double movement or double production. That is what goes through my head when these things are brought to the table, I dislike them, but I will be the first to tell you; I have on many occasions played with one or more of these variables in action.

    Anyone who has actually played a game with me, I hope at least, will speak volumes of me. I am a very exceptional personality when it comes to the game of civilization, even OzzyKP, who's words to me have been silenced by my bragadocious manner will readily admit that I am an enjoyable competitor. The reason I am confrontational, the reason I speak from my heart rather than my brain is quite simple:

    I am a determined player.

    A lot of people here have blasted me for what I have done to Nap Bonaparte, a "respected" member of the Apolyton Community. I do not deny his reputation, nor do I deny his ability to play. I posted the argument for two reasons, one was an immature reason but is offset by the fact of the second. This is what I felt, and I figured that the forum of the community would be a perfect place to air this laundry.

    Apparently I was wrong. I apologize right now to Nap Bonaparte for posting what I posted, it was immature of me to do, and in essence (whether incorrectly or not) told the rest of the community that I am self-centered, "uneducated", peice of ****.

    However, I am not reneging. Nap, that is what I feel, those things I said in that particular post are my true emotions, and you have to understand that. You basically ruined something that I actually poured part of myself into. I thought for hours on petty details, small minute factors that would most likely not make much of a differance, I deliberated over small matters so the game can be an enjoyable experience for not only Nap, but the rest of the players involved.

    I made sacrifices for this game, granted none very major or earth-shattering, but sacrifices were made over this game. I am not blaming Nap for them, I am merely saying that after what occured on that night, they were all in vain, they were all for naught.

    Anyone who has ambition, and determination applies heart and soul to their words and actions. To do any less would not enthrall anyone. So here I am, telling you that I am being lambasted by the people I worked so hard for, and I am telling you the reasons why I did what I did.

    To finalize this post, which is basically a mish-mash of thoughts going through my head on this issue, I will say this:

    I apologize to those who have respected me, to those who have thought of me in a high regard, for posting what I posted and for acting the way I acted. I apologzie to Nap for showing a lot of people who respect and like you, a limited conversation that did not show what lead up to it. I apologize to the players in the game, Adam, Sun, Chris, Joe, Drake, and Nap for the time I wasted and for the amount of crap I put you through. I apologize to Apoltyon for bringing up an issue that was probably not needed for the purposes of this forum.

    So whatever, you want to continue to hate me for saying what I feel do so. Its not an issue to me, you have a right to ignore and listen to whomever you wish, but at least understand that I am not doing this out of simple immaturity or idiocy, there is a method to my madness.

    And if you were "there" when it occured, you would probably understand that I am not overexaggerating the situation as much as most of you believe.

    Thanks, The Cap'

    Ming: I still think you're a *****.
    "Our cause is in the hands of fate. We can not guarantee success. But we can do something better; we can deserve it." -John Adams


    One Love.

  • #2
    All I suggest Capo is that you stick to what you do best. Which of course is building great scenarios and playing the diplogame. You should probably stay away from organizing games in any matter. Not because you don't have good intentions in mind, but because you need a lot of patience to start a sucessful game, and you seem to lack this virtue. This isn't an insult, it's an observation and should be taken in stride.

    Civ 2 is great when you're playing with people you know well and get along with, but it's even better when you're playing with people you don't like, or don't agree with. Everyone likes a villian (even though I know thats not really you Capo). I don't think you'll have any problems joining a game for this reason. What you might have problems with is recruiting people for another one of your games. For this reason, you should leave this aspect to someone else. Just my opinion.

    I close with a suggestion for not just Capo, but for everyone: From now on, lets fight our battles with knights and catapults, like we should be. Civ is what brings us together, so lets keep our focus on the game. There's no need for things to get personal.
    I see the world through bloodshot eyes
    Streets filled with blood from distant lies.

    Comment


    • #3
      Good show Capo...

      It's easy to let ones emotions take over...
      It's difficult to see how sometimes it is the wrong thing to do.

      I don't think anybody can question your dedication and intensity to Civ.

      My respect for you has only increased.

      I look forward to crossing swords with you some day, even if you do hate double production

      ------------------
      Ming
      CivII & Off-Topic Forum Moderator
      Ming@Apolyton.net
      <font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Ming (edited January 26, 2001).]</font>
      Keep on Civin'
      RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

      Comment


      • #4
        Nice and polite apology Capo, ranting and flaming about it just doesn't work in the end.

        Perhaps we'll see you as a sub in Cavebear's diplogame...perhaps...
        Skeptics should forego any thought of convincing the unconvinced that we hold the torch of truth illuminating the darkness. A more modest, realistic, and achievable goal is to encourage the idea that one may be mistaken. Doubt is humbling and constructive; it leads to rational thought in weighing alternatives and fully reexamining options, and it opens unlimited vistas.

        Elie A. Shneour Skeptical Inquirer

        Comment


        • #5
          I wanna see blood damnit!!!
          Join the army, travel to foreign countries, meet exotic people -
          and kill them!

          Comment


          • #6
            Ming, your respect of me had no other direction to go in but up.

            By the way, I still think Nap's an idiot, if you think I am saying he isn't your are sorely mistaken. That diplogame I was planning I REALLY wanted it to happen and am now merely playing a "watered" down version with a few people from the original "cast."

            Joe, if you read this sorry but you weren't online when we planned it out.

            Frankly, I'd still like to play a diplogame, with the same thing in place (NO SDI, Facism instead of Fundy etc.) So if anyone is still around that thinks they can give me a shot then go ahead. But I have to warn you, I don't play like I act so don't be fooled by my tirade against Nap.

            Peace.

            Ming: Well, if we were to play, while your men are busy getting their swords out, mine'll be pointing their Muskets. Peace.
            "Our cause is in the hands of fate. We can not guarantee success. But we can do something better; we can deserve it." -John Adams


            One Love.

            Comment


            • #7
              Capo, i'll play in your diplogame if you try and start another one, i really wanted to play the diplogame wednesday but we had some problems

              Comment


              • #8
                Good apology Capo..... its nice to see the forums work themselves out. I am sorry you still feel Nappy is an idiot (afterall, I am still just as bad as he is with moving folders) and most don't think of me as an idiot.

                As for your diplogames...... I think Drake hit it on the head...... It sounds like your strengths are with design and roleplaying.... not with organizing... perhaps with this piece of wisdom you will make even greater strides in your games and not become as easily riled up

                I wish you best and i too look forward to my Supreme Hordes marching up on your shocked troops

                ------------------
                Back from hell....i have nothing to lose
                Boston Red Sox are 2004 World Series Champions!

                Comment


                • #9
                  <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                  <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                  </font><font size=1>Originally posted by War4ever on 01-26-2001 06:44 PM</font>(afterall, I am still just as bad as he is with moving folders) and most don't think of me as an idiot.
                  <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                  Really? I bet you can't point out anyone in the "most" category

                  Join the army, travel to foreign countries, meet exotic people -
                  and kill them!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    With all due respect to you "Capo sucks at organizing a game" people.

                    If you've ever read any of my threads in which I do set up a game you would probably change your tune, based on the simple issue that I was pissed off at a guy because he couldn't accomplish a simple instruction is not fair.

                    Even if you are bad at moving folders, or whatever, you should have seen the freakin instructions I gave this guy! Drake, someone, Sun! Back me up here!

                    They were good instructions, anyone that can read could have followed them. I am not bad at organizing games, I don't know where this idea came from.

                    Sun, what are your thoughts? Did I organize this game well or not?
                    "Our cause is in the hands of fate. We can not guarantee success. But we can do something better; we can deserve it." -John Adams


                    One Love.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I, for one, was not very impressed by Capo's initial "apology", and his subsequent posts have only reinforced that opinion.

                      Capo is aggrieved that his anger, invective, and ill-temper is not outweighed by his micromanagement and "determination". My advice to him is simple: "Get used to it".

                      As someone with years of project management experience, and as a former President and tournament organizer of a chess club, I can safely state that the best person for the job of "organizer" is neither the best player nor the most detailed clerical type. The former is not going to be the most knowledgable in the support and communications aspect of setting up the game, and the latter is not going to be likely to understand what the game (and the game players) require. It has to be a balance.

                      And the organizer must be physchologically balanced, too. Setbacks and surprises abound in getting anything complex underway, and you have to be able to deal with those. You can take out your frustration on inanimate objects, you can complain to your friends, you can even write nasty messages and then erase them. You cannot, however, go public about it.

                      You have not yet truly apologized for your outburst. You said of few of the right words, but what you mainly did was attempt to "spin" your earlier words, and that is not the same thing. As it stands, I don't think that you yet understand *why* what you posted was wrong, and that is the crux of the matter.

                      I will be very interested to see how you respond.
                      Civ2 Demo Game #1 City-Planner, President, Historian
                      Civ2 Demo Game #2 Minister of War,President, Minister of Trade, Vice President, City-Planner
                      Civ2 Demo Game #3 President, Minister of War, President
                      Civ2 Demo Game #4 Despot, City-Planner, Consul

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I apreciate what you did Capo. Thumbs up on your games

                        ------------------
                        The journey itself is the thing~Odysseus
                        The journey itself is the thing~Odysseus

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Before I respond to Cavebear's comments I want to say that the initial post here wasn't meant so much as an apology, although I did apologize to some people. As I stated in my initial post, what I said to Nap was from my heart and is what I really felt so I won't apologize for it because it was natural.

                          What Cavebear is, in essence, doing is attempting to continue to let me be the "whipping boy" of this forum for something that I have done. That's fine, like I said before hate whoever you want, ignore whoever you want, and listen to whoever you want, its not my concern that Cavebear doesn't like the Capo other than the fact that he continues to make comments and continues to say that he doesn't like me. Which is perfectly fine.

                          But the problem I have is his insistence that I can not be allowed to organize a game based on an independent incident. That is unfair to me, cavebear has never been involved in a game organized by me, he has no firsthand knowledge whatsoever of how I organize a game. Guys like Joe, guys like Chris and Sun, even guys like Adam and Nap could testify as to excatly how I *ORGANIZE* the game. Some will probably say bad things, but I bet most of those bad things will have nothing to do with the organization of the game itself.

                          Then he goes on to claim that I am attempting to spin my original post, which makes no sense because that post was a transcribed conversation. I can't spin a conversation unless I talk about the conversation itself, and since you had no other basis except the conversation as to why I would post what I posted you cannot accuse me of spinning anything, because I am not actually spinning a damn word.

                          By the way, I don't micromanage. That was the point of my post.

                          As far as your psychological balance claim, that is just stupid to say. I can't believe someone who has no direct knowledge of the events that transpired would even make such a claim, fact is you weren't there and you have no idea what was occuring.

                          I would also like to point out that after Nap did what he did, the game was over, there was no more organization going on. The second he deleted that file I was no longer organizing anything because there was nothing to organize.

                          As for the *why* part of your comment. Look man, I explained my position. I understand why YOU THINK I am wrong, but I don't agree with that. What I posted was wrong because I gave the wrong impression of myself to everyone, because I disrespected the members of the group to a degree, but it wasn't wrong becuase if I can say something to Nap in private then I can say it to everyone else, and that's my stance. I don't have to cater to the whims of Cavebear simply becuase Cavebear demands a better apology. I said what I said, I wasn't trying to reneg my post, I was trying to explain why I would do such a thing. It has nothing to do with a psychological imbalance, it has nothing to do with an inability to organize a game. When the game had a chance of going, I was very patient with Nap, but when I realized it was over that's when I laid it into him.

                          But I can see your motives, you want an argument, you dislike that I am going to "get away with this" so keep talking, you have your rights.

                          Peace.

                          "Our cause is in the hands of fate. We can not guarantee success. But we can do something better; we can deserve it." -John Adams


                          One Love.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Ming...I greatly appreciate your efforts to put a stop to Capo's unfair, irrational, and obscene remarks but it looks as if he wants to continue with the insults so maybe its time that I have my say in this.

                            I only agreed to join in Capo's diplogame after Aburtt had commited to play. Aburtt was one of the original pioneers of the diplogame concept back in 1999 and I had the pleasure of joining in that 1st diplogame with him, JB, Glohithia and others. Despite what Capo promised in his thread, I was never sent any files before the game was started. I contacted Capo while he was on ICQ the night before the game was to start and I requested both the game file and his "latest" version of the rules and new units but he dropped off ICQ without responding to me. The next day, I went online for the game at the EXACT assigned time and was met with a barrage of impatient ICQ messages regarding being late and unprepared to start the game. If Capo really wanted to play all he had to do was ICQ the unzipped file to me. I have downloaded scores of games/saves/scenarios from dozens of players before but never had to deal with a zip file. So with Capo's "simple" instructions(along with numerous put downs, insults, and obscenities) I finally struggled through AOL Download Manager and Windows Explorer for the 1st time and loaded up his precious game under my scenario folder only to have Capo throw a temper tantrum and quit before we could test the game to make sure I had moved file/folders properly. Contrary to what Capo said, I had no contact with him over the following week and I never assured him that my folder/file pathways matched his exactly(and I would have no way of knowing this unless we were to fire the game up together).

                            I honestly thought I had the game loaded properly. I was able to fire it up and play it from my scenario folder. I even ICQed the game to other players for their comment on it. I wanted other people to comment on the game because I felt that Capo had really roided up his starting position in Italy...3 grapes and a whale in his starting city and another grape and a whale for city #2 in Spain and a futher whale for #3 in southern Italy. No other civ had terrain even remotely close to that. He originally stuck me out in the middle of the Sahara desert and when I questioned it he relented and moved me back to Zululand. His #1 city could theoretically by 2000 BC be producing 12 shields and 13 trade arrows at size 3. Then he changed the tech paradigm to 15/10 to slow everyone down and allow him to run the board on early wonders. Regardless of what Capo said, Ive got this game loaded and ready to go and I will be happy to ICQ and/or play it with anyone who is interested. My ICQ# is 37676739.

                            Anyway we all showed up last Wed. night to play this thing. Just like what happened to me , Capo neglected to send the proper info on the game to Aburtt and he was having trouble joining the game. Some of the other players were upset and wanted to drop him but I argued for his inclusion in the game as I thought the way Aburtt was being treated was unfair and he was the only reason I had wanted to be in the game. I offered to host thinking that it might enhance
                            Aburtts compatiblity with the game and delayed the game a bit to give him a chance to sort things out on his computer. After a while Aburtt gave up and left and Capo dismissed him with a " f*** him, he's a f**" (asterisks not included) and then he turned his wrath and mouth on me. Ten minutes of insults, verbal abuse, and file fumbling after Aburtt left I politely requested to resign from their game. Capo wouldnt let me and started an almost non-stop tirade of obscenities and insults. The whole night was like one long obscene phone call.....no better yet make that an obscene conference call...Capo wasnt the only one(Drake for his part was both helpful and congenial towards me)... so I hung up on them. I didnt ruin their game or even their night. They can certainly play their diplogame without my presence. I play Civ for fun and enjoyment...no one can force me to be in a game with so much verbal abuse going on. I'm not sure that the other players in the game even know this but I knew I was having problems with the files and I pleaded with Capo to let me resign from the game both nights so that I wouldnt slow them down and "ruin" their night.If I cant manipulate the files and I cant resign from the game what are my options??I further resent Capo dragging my fiance into this muck.

                            To this day I dont understand why my version of the game is not compatible with Capo's...I know that I can play this scenario with other players...maybe his version has some more grapes in it. It is kinda funny though.....you should see Italy...it almost has a purple glow to it....
                            " First France......then the WORLD!"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              Ming...I greatly appreciate your efforts to put a stop to Capo's unfair, irrational, and obscene remarks but it looks as if he wants to continue with the insults so maybe its time that I have my say in this.

                              I only agreed to join in Capo's diplogame after Aburtt had commited to play. Aburtt was one of the original pioneers of the diplogame concept back in 1999 and I had the pleasure of joining in that 1st diplogame with him, JB, Glohithia and others. Despite what Capo promised in his thread, I was never sent any files before the game was started.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              That's a lie.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              I contacted Capo while he was on ICQ the night before the game was to start and I requested both the game file and his "latest" version of the rules and new units but he dropped off ICQ without responding to me.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              I am not the only one that lives here, when AOL comes on so does ICQ, that was obviously not me. I would never do something like that.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              The next day, I went online for the game at the EXACT assigned time and was met with a barrage of impatient ICQ messages regarding being late and unprepared to start the game. If Capo really wanted to play all he had to do was ICQ the unzipped file to me. I have downloaded scores of games/saves/scenarios from dozens of players before but never had to deal with a zip file. So with Capo's "simple" instructions(along with numerous put downs, insults, and obscenities) I finally struggled through AOL Download Manager and Windows Explorer for the 1st time and loaded up his precious game under my scenario folder only to have Capo throw a temper tantrum and quit before we could test the game to make sure I had moved file/folders properly.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              You can ask anyone that was there for the first session, I did not do that at all, I was very patient with him and actually had to make efforts to relax the other players involved, his entire relation of the first session is a boldfaced lie.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              Contrary to what Capo said, I had no contact with him over the following week and I never assured him that my folder/file pathways matched his exactly(and I would have no way of knowing this unless we were to fire the game up together).

                              I honestly thought I had the game loaded properly. I was able to fire it up and play it from my scenario folder. I even ICQed the game to other players for their comment on it. I wanted other people to comment on the game because I felt that Capo had really roided up his starting position in Italy...3 grapes and a whale in his starting city and another grape and a whale for city #2 in Spain and a futher whale for #3 in southern Italy. No other civ had terrain even remotely close to that.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              I did not make this map, this map was created based on the Earth and her actual resources, it was told to me by the creator that since southern Europe has grapes, so shall this Europe. I chose Rome prior to the creation of this map, if you want the map you can ask me for it, he has exaggerated the amount of grapes in my starting city Radius. Why he has done this? I do not know.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              He originally stuck me out in the middle of the Sahara desert and when I questioned it he relented and moved me back to Zululand.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              I asked him which tribe he wanted to be in Africa, because he had agreed to play as an African tribe, he said it didn't matter, since I like the history of the Mali and the Songhai, I decided to make him the old Mali empire. Where else would I put the Mali? North America? I put the tribes where they start, everyone refer to either their map or historic memory, where is Timbuktu? That is where his starting location was, I even made the effort to "soften" his terrain so he had a better spot. I certainly did not "relent" and move him to Zululand. After he told me he would rather be the Zulu I had no problems moving him down there.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              His #1 city could theoretically by 2000 BC be producing 12 shields and 13 trade arrows at size 3. Then he changed the tech paradigm to 15/10 to slow everyone down and allow him to run the board on early wonders.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              To think that I did this is ridiculous. Ask anyone that was in this game why I slowed the tech, everyone knew I was slowing the tech and had the chance to look at the game and ask me to change any part before we started, including Nap, I sent the file out to everyone at the same time!

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              Regardless of what Capo said, Ive got this game loaded and ready to go and I will be happy to ICQ and/or play it with anyone who is interested. My ICQ# is 37676739.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              I wasn't questioning his ability to play the game, it was a matter of having the game in the right directory, which even after numerous instructions were given, he failed to accomplish.


                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              Anyway we all showed up last Wed. night to play this thing. Just like what happened to me , Capo neglected to send the proper info on the game to Aburtt and he was having trouble joining the game.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              That isn't true, Aburtt had a patch that no other players had, therefore he was uncompatible with everyone else, there was NOTHING I could do about that.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              Some of the other players were upset and wanted to drop him but I argued for his inclusion in the game as I thought the way Aburtt was being treated was unfair and he was the only reason I had wanted to be in the game. I offered to host thinking that it might enhance
                              Aburtts compatiblity with the game and delayed the game a bit to give him a chance to sort things out on his computer. After a while Aburtt gave up and left and Capo dismissed him with a " f*** him, he's a f**" (asterisks not included)

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              This is true, but I only said that after he (Aburtt) continued to try and connect, screwing up Chris' connection when he was trying to be host.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              and then he turned his wrath and mouth on me. Ten minutes of insults, verbal abuse, and file fumbling after Aburtt left I politely requested to resign from their game. Capo wouldnt let me and started an almost non-stop tirade of obscenities and insults. The whole night was like one long obscene phone call.....no better yet make that an obscene conference call...Capo wasnt the only one(Drake for his part was both helpful and congenial towards me)...

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              Everyone tried to explain to him how to do this, and he still couldn't get it, even after simple cut and paste instructions he couldn't figure it out, the entire group was angry after two hours of delays and miscommunication. We didn't tell him NOT TO QUIT, or even force him, he said "I'll quit if it makes it easier" and I replied "If you quit we don't play, we need seven people." I never forced him to do anything.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
                              </font>
                              so I hung up on them. I didnt ruin their game or even their night. They can certainly play their diplogame without my presence.

                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

                              Yeah, but if you would have told us it was wrong prior to that time, and didn't waste two hours we could have found a sub and uploaded the files to him.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
                              <img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
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                              I play Civ for fun and enjoyment...no one can force me to be in a game with so much verbal abuse going on. I'm not sure that the other players in the game even know this but I knew I was having problems with the files and I pleaded with Capo to let me resign from the game both nights so that I wouldnt slow them down and "ruin" their night.If I cant manipulate the files and I cant resign from the game what are my options??I further resent Capo dragging my fiance into this muck.

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                              I have no idea what he is talking about.

                              <center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
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                              To this day I dont understand why my version of the game is not compatible with Capo's...I know that I can play this scenario with other players...maybe his version has some more grapes in it. It is kinda funny though.....you should see Italy...it almost has a purple glow to it....

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                              Well, this is another example of how people attempt to make me out as the bad guy in this mess, I can only assure everyone that all players had a chance to look over the map, that it was sent to everyone before we started, and that Nap is embelishing some parts of his story in order to shed a negative light on me. I hope some other players that were present could at least tell people that a lot of what he is saying are lies.

                              Peace.

                              EDIT: Typo
                              <font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by The Capo (edited January 27, 2001).]</font>
                              "Our cause is in the hands of fate. We can not guarantee success. But we can do something better; we can deserve it." -John Adams


                              One Love.

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