Should players be allowed to build cities on Mountain hexes?

[The Mad Monk]

I thoroughly enjoy AH's threads, especially the inane ones.

[Ming]

Hey, any thread in an On Topic forum that discusses something about games and is also POPULAR... go team go.

And especially when AH brings his particular brand of humor... How can one not offer up an opinion on this topic. And it is entertaining too.

May we have more of these kind of game related threads

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Ming
CivII & Off-Topic Forum Moderator
Ming@Apolyton.net

[mindseye]

Andz83, welcome to Apolyton!

quote: 1. You aren't right. In an MP Game, there could be some players who are able to build cities on mountains because they have got mountain terain inside of their countries. But there could also be players who are not able to build cities on mountains or even hills because their whole empire is situated in flat land (theoretically). 2. So we can say that also this point is not answered with your arguments. If there's really a player who has mountain terrain and can build cities on it, then he has an advantage over a player who isn't able to do it.

Andz83, I don't agree with your logic. Some players may have relatively few rivers in their area, or maybe they start out on a small island (please don't anyone mention Gilligan ). Would you then argue that no one should be allowed to build cities on rivers since some players may not have the same opportunity? Luck is an important part of the game, just like in Real Life(tm).

Ming's point about realism stands. The game is an abstraction of reality. As such, some of it accurately reflects reality, other parts do not. Where the line is drawn determines a good game. By and large, with Civ2, the line is about were it should be (unless someone wants to complain about games not really lasting thousands of years as they should.

- mindseye
PS: is there any way to restrict rail movement?


[This message has been edited by mindseye (edited March 25, 2000).]

[Seeker]

Hmmm...?! What was that about tanks?!

[Ming]

First, the option is available to ALL players in an MP game, so there is no advantage or disadvantge.

Second, the game allows you to do it. Now, some would argue that the game lets you do a lot that is considered cheating, but I still have seen no evidence here that it should be considered cheating. You get defensive advantages for building on rivers, in forests, on hills... what's the difference.
It seems like it has only become an issue because somebody tried to an attack a city, and lost

And again, I don't even want to hear the "realism" line. Whether there are real cities built on mountains in real life doesn't really matter. There are tons of things that aren't realistic in civ. How about the unlimited movement on railroads... now that's realistic. I haven't heard people say that using railroads is cheating or shouldn't be allowed.

So next time you run across a city in a mountain...
Bribe it.
Nuke it.
Attack with better units.
Or go around it if you can.

[Andz83]

Ming:

1. You aren't right. In an MP Game, there could be some players who are able to build cities on mountains because they have got mountain terain inside of their countries. But there could also be players who are not able to build cities on mountains or even hills because their whole mepire is situated in flat land (theoretically).

2. So we can say that also this point is not answered with your arguments. If there's really a player who has mountain terrain and can build cities on it, then he has an advantage over a player who isn't able to do it. Also I never claimed that building cities on mountains should be considered cheating.

However, it IS a difference, whether the defense bonus is 50% (river/ forest) or 200%(mountain).

3. I don't understand why not talking about realism in computer games, but I think you#ve heard enough about it and when that's your opinion, so let's stop discussing about realism for this time...

Another question:
How can I set such a little smiley icon within my text?

[KhanMan]

Nothing...SS was just emulating the great AH...


-KM

[Lancer]

Certainly noone could build a city on the Materhorn (sp) but there have been mountain cities,the Aztecs built a few. I think that generally though most mountains could not produce the single food that the game gives them and many mountains would freeze their citizens the first winter. So I think that in Civ 2 mountain cities should not be permitted even though mountain cities do exist in fact. It's just too convienient to be able to drop a city on any ol mountain for strategic reasons when in real life odds are so great against any particular mountain being able to support life.
I think in Civ 3 there should be several types of mountains that are climate orriented. Some few mountains in temperate and tropical regions should be able to support life but these mountains should be as rare as gold is in Civ2.

[Andz83]

mindseye:

1. Surely, if any player is disadvantaged in a game in any way, all participants of the game might consider limitations. But I think, as you say, that it would go to far in connection with rivers and hills. Surely, if one player gots bad luck, he has to make the best of it

2. Uh oh, I think we should stop this discussion about realism. But the fact that Civ2 isn't very realistic, should be a reason for a discussion about limitations like this. But obviously we'll never agree in this point

3. I don't know whether there's a possibility to restrict the movement rate of a railroad via changing the game files, if you are talking about this. When you mean how to restrict rail movement in an MP-Game: forget it...

[The Mad Monk]

Any opinions on how large a square in the game is? I generally assume a square is twenty to fifty miles on a side, which is why I've never had a problem with mountain cities--you've got to assume there's livable terrain in there somewhere.

[Alexander's Horse]

Eh? WTF happened here people?


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Founder of the People's Republic of Topics (PROT)

Convenor of the Threadjacking Appreciation Society (new members welcome)

[Wezil]

I have problems with mountain cities in 'no bribe' games. Pretty dubious tactic in that case.

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"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." H.S.T.

[Andz83]

Nice to meet you personally, AH

[Alexander's Horse]

quote: Originally posted by Wezil on 03-25-2000 10:40 AM I have problems with mountain cities in 'no bribe' games. Pretty dubious tactic in that case.

EXACTLY, Its so unsporting.




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Founder of the People's Republic of Topics (PROT)

Convenor of the Threadjacking Appreciation Society (new members welcome)

[War4ever]

so what then..... you can only bribe cities with mountains ...... what about a one square island....... are you allowed to bribe that too