I find it amazing!

[arenor]

I've only recently begun to play Civ2 (as can be noted in a couple of other posts here) and I just find it amazing that you "pros" out there can defeat the game so easily.

I sat down last nite determined to "follow in the footsteps of the Civ2 Forum gods". It's a King game, with Raging Hordes on Earth. I started in mid-Africa with one settler and Pottery & Alphabet as additional techs. As of right now, it's the year 780AD and I've got twelve cities with four of them building wonders. I've had serious Barbarian problems (I've lost two cities to barbs and destroyed one trying to take it back - bribing didn't work!). I cannot find ANYONE to trade with except the Babylonians, even though I've traveled extensively and the best trade route I've gotten from the Babylonians is 24g (they are in Europe).

How do you guys do it? I was reading the "Mad, Mad Succession" thread and in Straybow's initial post, he says something to the effect of "no Science Wonders just to give the AI a chance". I HAVE to build them in my games or I have no chance at all.

What the heck am I doing wrong????? Thanx so much.

Arenor Pendragon

[El Civ]

Like you I am still learning this game and haven't yet approached the competence level of the others. Bear in mind that these brave men have been playing the game for years and as they learned, they shared with others. That is why we have the Great Library on site as well as other sources of knowledge. Visit the GL and surf around to other Civ 2 sites and read the advice and tips available. If you stay with it you will eventually be a good player yourself. Besides, the game is wholly addicting and you will want to increase your ability to continue getting enjoyment from playing it.

[DaveV]

I think this thread is the best ever for studying how some deity-level players manage their games. Turn-by-turn saves are a great way to follow along with someone else and learn from what they're doing.

[Messer Niccolò]

Arenor, welcome!
Some hints:
"Camel Power" how to use caravans is really important in civ II. They can be used for:
i) help building wonders
ii) give money when commodities are delivered
iii) give science beakers
iv) create trade ruotes

"Balance your strenghts"
explore, defend with few mobile units, use diplos/spies

"Expand"
build cities, build cities build cities or build cities and improve them!

"Government"
Carefully analyze the gov't forms!

Elaborate the strategy before (how do I want to win? space, domination) and apply the correct tactic (government, military strenght, tech path...)!!!

.... and, have fun of course!

[Marquis de Sodaq]

First, it is a long road to being able to win deity. I remember being quite pleased the first time I won on prince with a title better than "forkbeard".

From the sound of things, you have not settled enough cities. By that stage of the game, you should have expanded more. More cities = more workers = more arrows = more science.

Also, 4 of your cities are building wonders! Instead of that, try hording camels. If you need a 400 shield wonder, start production and send 8 camels to complete it the same turn. This frees up changes in production without a penalty. Importantly, the city building the wonder can use those 25 turns building other things, instead of just a wonder. Incremental rush buying caravans is a fantastic way to build quick, cheap wonders.

Switch one of your wonders to Marco Polo's Embassy. You don't need to scour the earth for the other civs, you get automatic contact and embassy. Trade for techs and maps.

Have you tried representative gov't? You need to prepare by building roads and mines and irrigation, but it pays off quickly.

Don't build too many improvements. Only build what you need. Set up trade routes among your own cities, that pays off, too!

[Vlad Antlerkov]

Niccolo, sorry if I sound like an idiot (since I SHOULD know this already), but how do caravans provide beakers? Aside from the trade from trade routes, of course.

[arenor]

Wow - wasn't expecting all that! Thanx much to everyone for the ideas; I'll start a new game tonite and see if I can put all this information to good use!

Arenor

[Scouse Gits]

Originally posted by Vlad Antlerkov Niccolo, sorry if I sound like an idiot (since I SHOULD know this already), but how do caravans provide beakers? Aside from the trade from trade routes, of course.

If you deliver a caravan and receive a bonus of 100 gold, you will also enjoy a science boost of the same number of beakers. However if F6 is full this science bonus will be wasted. Always check F6 prior to sending freight.

DaveV

I followed your link...and to my horror it was the Laugh at an SG thread. (Some haven't stopped) That was the worst game we ever played! I remember a bungled attack on some AI city - no wonder we faded out of things quickly Can't believe 63 downloads Perhaps we should start another one and at least attempt to finish it.

Off topic...I found our Rome Game gathering dust in my inbox. I will send it tomorrow.

---------------

SG(2)

[Rasbelin]

Re: I find it amazing!

Originally posted by arenor
I've only recently begun to play Civ2 (as can be noted in a couple of other posts here) and I just find it amazing that you "pros" out there can defeat the game so easily.

Welcome to the club! Just 6 years late, but better now than never ( don't worry, neither did I start playing Civ II in 1996 ).

How do you guys do it?

You mean beating the AI? By playing I suppose. And, yes, using different strategies worked out inside your head. At least I've mostly used my own tactics instead ones found on i.e. Poly.

What the heck am I doing wrong?????

Why shouldn't you be allowed to build science wonders? Just go ahead and do that. You're the one who decide your strategy, not we here. But refering to what they said, my five cents are that a more advanced civer can so easily defeat the AI, so it's a worthy idea to give it the opportunity build some WOW's that improve their science. Otherwise they would be so awkward in technology and warfare compared to you. But if you're still at an early stage of playing Civ II (as you apparently are), then just stick to strategies you prefer and want to use. That's the best way to learn civing.

But some feedback could still be relevant. First of all you claimed that those barbarians had captured two of you're cities and that you had tried to re-capture it, but not managed to complete that mission. I suspect your defense wasn't 1. up to date or 2. strong enough. One quite good rule of thumb is to have at least 2 defensive units per city. And if you're weaponry was outdated, you should boost you're science production and primarily develop new military units (and of course build some when able to). Oh, and did you actually try to re-capture the city with your army? If not, then you should have done that. But as I already guessed, your army wasn't so large at the time. That's something you should try to avoid in future games. Or too bad connections to that city, so no forces would have made it in time to defend it? Build up your road network ASAP; it's worth it. Faster movement and better abilities to fight back any invading troops (barbarian or foreign, doesn't matter).

And feel free to ask if help is needed.

[Xin Yu]

Some suggestions:

First, research path set to Monarchy. This government is much better than Despotism.

Second, research path set to trade. Immediately build 4 caravans (you can even pre-work them by building settlers then switching to caravans. Needs a good timing though). Use the 4 caravans to build the Marco Polo's Embassy.

Third, check every other civ's information (Do not make contact yet). Then carefully plan trading of techs so that you'll get most out of it. If you give a civ 4 techs as gift you may get at least to exchange maps, or even an alliance.

Fourth, locate a large foreign city which has a lot of ocean squares inside city radius. Then send all your caravans there for a better bonus. Before each delivery, make sure all workers in the source city are working on trade squares (ocean, roaded grass, river, etc.). You can change workers back to other squares after trading. You may need the lighthouse wonder if your triemies cannot go to there safely.

Now you can finance your economy and boost your science from the trade bonus. Use the money to rush buy everything, and your empire will grow a lot faster than before.

[Scouse Gits]

Keep at it
Listen to the wise (Xin for example)
Keep at it
Read the Great Library
Keep at it
Look at games with logs (the succession Games for example) they are not all good, but most are successful at Deity - which is ahead of where you are now

and

Keep on civin & enjoyin...

SG[1]

[ramses II.]

The Great Library -
written words of wisdom, wrath an war
from weird wise whitehaired men
wearing warm pullovers
waiting for you

[arenor]

Ramses II - I had no idea a person could get that many W's in one sentence!!!

Again, thanx for all the tips - this Forum experience has been wonderful compared to a lot of other places I've been. It's great to find guys (& gals?) that, although they are good at the game, they don't lord it over you! It's appreciated.

Didn't get to start a new game last nite due to family duties (hey, married with three kids; whaddya expect?!), but I'm planning on giving it a whirl tonite while the wife is out!

Thanx again!

Arenor

[ramses II.]

@arenor
Thx, arenor - but I feel a newbie like you.
The expert guys in this forum are very friendly with the learning ones, cause they feel (and I also do) as a part of the civilization community that wants the game keep alive.
And that's only possible if you spread the game and make it familiar to us civ-babies and civ-teens

[Jac de Molay]

Exactly. I dont play as much civ 2 as I used to. But I'm a huge fan of Alpha centauri, play it quite often, and got help for the same reasons - it's a community that revolves around the shared love for a game, no matter what skill level and/or ability.

Dave