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Column #137; By Tim Bromige

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  • #1

    Column #137; By Tim Bromige

    Tim Bromige examines the playing field of the turn-based strategy genre today in his article entitled "<A HREF="http://apolyton.net/misc/column/137_danger.shtml">Is Turn-Based Strategy in Danger?</A>".

    Comments/questions welcomed in this thread, or you may contact Bromige directly.

    ----------------
    Dan; Apolyton CS
    Tags: None
  • #2
    I think it is in danger. Everything now is pretty much real time. Not that they require strategy.

    ------------------
    "Freedom, Trade, Christantine!"

    The Official Webpage of the Chrisonian Republic

    The Viking Archives

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    "I agree with everything i've heard you recently say-I hereby applaud Christantine The Great's rapid succession of good calls."-isaac brock
    "This has to be one of the most impressive accomplishments in the history of Apolyton, well done Chris"-monkspider (Refering to my Megamix summary)
    "You are redoing history by replaying the civs that made history."-Me

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    • #3
      TBS will always be around, but will be in a minority. Look at games like Civ 2 or Imperialism 2. Compare these with Star wars Supremecy. This is the choice, and you would have to be visionary genius or an idiot to think that certain games would be better played RTS than TBS- you cannot simulate 100s of years in real time.

      As long as there is a market for these games there will be a supply of TBS.
      "The free market is ugly and stupid, like going to the mall; the unfree market is just as ugly and just as stupid, except there is nothing in the mall and if you don't go there they shoot you." - P.J. O'Rourke

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      • #4
        I am starting to think that Tim and I are on the same wavelength. I submitted an article for the column on this very subject a few days ago, and now I see Tim echoing my thoughts!
        I went a different direction, going with personal experience instead of examining the market, But I came to the same conclusion. I prefer TBS.
        A review of Civilization: Call To Power at mobygames said that one of the big problems was that they put an RTS interface into a TBS game. Maybe, Maybe not, but CTP has not been very loved around here.

        But TBS dying out? are we all playing civ or AOE, after all. I know some of us do play AOE, but we're still here.
        Any man can be a Father, but it takes someone special to be a BEAST

        I was just about to point out that Horsie is simply making excuses in advance for why he will suck at Civ III...
        ...but Father Beast beat me to it! - Randomturn

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        • #5
          I've always favored turn based over real time. Not so much that I like turns per se, its more because I like having some control over the tempo of the game. I've always been a bit of a micromanager and the better real time games take this in account; they can be played as if it was either a turn based [i]or[/] a real time game. Take a game like warcraft (and its sequels) - its a real time game, but you can slow down the game play at key times to offer better control over where all your units will go, just like a turn based game. Of course for the computer games, giving me the choice to do every command either with the mouse or the keyboard also is nice, since I am much more in control with the keys (and therefore can play faster) vs the mouse.

          I think there always will be some variation of turn based games out there. After all, isn't the World Series essentially a turn based game (typically 9)? There are definite pauses between innings and any player can call time out at any time. Since it is multiplayer, they have some limits on how long the time outs are (with a couple exceptions - say a pitcher gets injured and can't continue when no one was warming up in the bull pen - the reliever is allowed as much time as he needs to warm up), but essentially, every turn takes as much time to finish as that side needs, whether it is 3 first pitch fly outs or a prolonged 10 run rally with 5 pitching changes.

          So I guess I agree with Tim Bromige on this one, I just worry that there will just be fewer and fewer good new turn based games as real time games continue to make accountants drool...

          ------------------
          Sleep is a luxury and I don't have Shakespeare's Theatre in my back yard.
          Insert witty phrase here

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          • #6
            Star Wars Rebellion (Supremacy in U.K.) is the only RTS game I play once in a while. I got the first edition of Age of Empires and hated it. Too much clicking.

            ------------------
            "Freedom, Trade, Christantine!"

            The Official Webpage of the Chrisonian Republic

            The Viking Archives

            The MGE Succession Game Team. Sign Up Today!
            "I agree with everything i've heard you recently say-I hereby applaud Christantine The Great's rapid succession of good calls."-isaac brock
            "This has to be one of the most impressive accomplishments in the history of Apolyton, well done Chris"-monkspider (Refering to my Megamix summary)
            "You are redoing history by replaying the civs that made history."-Me

            Comment

            • #7
              If tbs games die then so will my pipeline of money to makers.I've played alot of Myth and Close Combat and while they are good games,they come down to who has the best keyboard dexterity.Not who has the best plan etc.

              Also real times games give me pain and stiffness in my shoulders/neck area.Feels like someone is jabbing a needle in me.This takes some of the enjoyment away.

              I prefer chess to checkers.
              The only thing that matters to me in a MP game is getting a good ally.Nothing else is as important.......Xin Yu

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              • #8
                Here are a few trends that seem to go counter to a demand for TBS games.

                1. Increasing popularity of multi-player. Although developers acknowledge that most PC game purchasers play against the computer, they seem to be increasingly gearing their games towards internet play.

                2. A demand for the latest in graphics. Graphics are not the TBS games' forte.

                3. A demand for simplicity. Younger gamers don't have the patience to learn the intricacies of a game like Civ II.

                I'm confident that PC games will continue to evolve and eventually, there'll be a breakthrough game that will redefine the RTS or TBS genre. In the meantime, I'm hoping that Civ III will be a worthy game -- if so, it may keep me happy for another four years.

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                • #9
                  I'm afraid for us true believers of TBS games.

                  The general trend these days seems to be for flashy graphics and fast action. That seems to be what developers think we want.

                  I don't know about you guys, but if Civ III or the next version of MOO were to come out as RTS games, I would have no interest in even trying them.

                  Hopefully they will figure out that strategy games are different! When a "strategy" game can be won by the quickest person to move, it stops being a strategy game
                  Keep on Civin'
                  RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

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                  • #10
                    quote:

                    Originally posted by Ming on 10-24-2000 08:42 AM
                    I'm afraid for us true believers of TBS games.

                    The general trend these days seems to be for flashy graphics and fast action. That seems to be what developers think we want.

                    I don't know about you guys, but if Civ III or the next version of MOO were to come out as RTS games, I would have no interest in even trying them.




                    Ming, I know what you mean. Indeed, my previous article (which sucked in a fair amount of flak) covered some of your points, especially about how CivIII is going to turn out. However, TBS can still use the latest technology and trends (vide Shogun) without losing its integrity. Like you, I want CivIII to be another step in the evolution of the Civ series, rather than a revolution. If Sid and the boys go too far off the path defined by Civ and CivII, then the game won't be CivIII, but Something-else I.

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