eco damage

[Gothar]

ok how can I stop it cause it is out of control. Hybrid tree farms preserves and temples aren't helping. What should I do. I have the cloning vats so I'm pop boming and I have 6 or 7 size 16 bases producing around 60 minerals per turn (I built to many Nessus minning opps). Is there anything I can too cause I've allready caused global warming once and I get worms spawning everyturn (I've taken to patroling with my custom trance copters. I get heaps from planet pearls though.

[Skanderbeg]

It's a difficult situation. You have caught Yourself in a trap of ecodamage building nessus orbs too much and too fast. Or do You have used nerve gas against human factions? This will cause giant ecodamage.
If You have just build all possible eco-enhancements
(tree farms, hybrid forests, centauri reservats etc.),
the only possibility to reduce ecodamage is to reduce Your mineral production. Reorganize Your crawlers to pick energy instead of minerals, and switch some of Your producing population from workers to empaths. This should reduce Your damage, and the increasing income should partly equalize the decreasing mineral production. Buying instead of building.

[Aredhran]

• Use all ecodamage-reducing facilities
• Increase your Planet rating (ie. switch to Green)
• Reduce the mineral production at your bases (take workers off the offending squares, use crawlers for food if necessary to maintain base population)
• Scrap mineral-enhancing facilities (Genejack factory, etc)
• Use fewer high-pollution terraforming enhancements, especially boreholes
• Don't use nerve gas

Aredhran

(typos corrected)
[This message has been edited by Aredhran (edited December 04, 2000).]

[Gothar]

quote: Originally posted by Aredhran on 12-04-2000 04:46 AM Use all ecodamage-reducing facilities Increase your Planet rating (ie. switch to Green) [.]

Did that thanks for your help. I captured a base on the manifold nexus too.

[Chowlett]

AFAIK, Nessus minerals are "clean", ie don't produce any eco-damage. At least that's what Prima says, and I know a lot of people don't trust them, but it seems to be the case in this situation. Can anyone confirm or ridicule this?

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The best way to avoid errors is not to do anything - Dr Beardon (Maths)

("Something is worth doing"=>"It is worth doing properly")<=>("Something is not worth doing properly"=>"It is not worth doing") - A truth first expounded by Murgatroyd

[Googlie]

Here's the formula from concepts.txt (my bolding):

#ADVCONCEPT2

The ecological damage formula is complex:

^(1) For each base total the number of Mines, Solar Collectors, Farms, Soil Enrichers, Roads, Mag Tubes, Condensers, Mirrors and Boreholes.

Items in squares which are actually being worked count double.

^(2) Add an extra +8 for each Borehole, +6 for each Mirror, and +4 for each Condenser.
^(3) Subract 1 for each Forest.
^(4) Halve if base has Tree Farm, and Eliminate if also has Hybrid Forest.
^(5) Divide this value by 8, and reduce by up to 16 plus # of previous damages. Set this number aside.
^(6) Take the number of minerals produced this turn (but not from Orbit)
^(7) If result from 5 was reduced by less than 16+#, reduce result 6 by remaining amount.
^(8) Divide minerals by 1 plus # of Centauri Preserve, Temple of Planet, Nanoreplicator.
^(9) Sum the values of (5) and (8), and add +5 for each major atrocity.
^(10) If Alpha Prime is at perihelion (20 years out of every 80), double your value.
^
^Ecology% = (ValueFromStep10) * Difficulty * Technologies * (3-PLANET) * LIFE / 300^
^Difficulty = Normally 3, but 5 on two highest two difficulty levels.
^Technologies = Number of technologies discovered
^PLANET = Social Engineering PLANET value
^LIFE = Native life level (1-3) from Custom Start

It seems Prima is correct.

Googlie



[This message has been edited by Googlie (edited December 04, 2000).]

[Chowlett]

The only problem there is that you shouldn't get any eco-damage if PLANET is 3 or more. I think we decided that wasn't true.

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The best way to avoid errors is not to do anything - Dr Beardon (Maths)

("Something is worth doing"=>"It is worth doing properly")<=>("Something is not worth doing properly"=>"It is not worth doing") - A truth first expounded by Murgatroyd

[VoodooChild]

do terrian enchancements before tree farms count only if worked or if they lie within the base radius? the reason why I ask is that i will many times place a borehole/mirror/condensor within 2 or 3 bases so I can alternated use based on current needs.

[VoodooChild]

sory just read the not so fine print in Googlie's reply... now for the follow up question. the terrain will count for being in the base radius, but will only be doubled for the base that is currently working it, correct?

[Sikander]

So, if all of your bases have tree farms and centauri preserves, then the only thing you need to worry about is atrocities and the total amount of mineral production.

What exactly do the Centauri Preserves etc. do? I read somewhere that they have no effect on the base level per se, but effect the overall effect of your pollution on planet. If this is true, then the number in step 8 would be the total number of these facilities in all of your bases. Is this correct? This would allow an enormous amount of production in large empires, which seems suspect. If this is not true (ie these facilities in fact are factored into only the local base equation) then these facilities would allow for the pollution free production of up to 4 times normal. Neither of these things seem quite right. Can someone explain this part of the equation to me?

[Kirnwaffen]

A while back in the Bragging thread, Black Sunrise had something like 500 bases, one of which was producing around 600 min with no eco damage, with all the eco facilities in every base. In my games, I run into eco damage after the hundred mark, when I have 20 bases give or take, with eco facilities in all. That seems to indicate (at least to me) that the effects are cumulative, since in my relatively small empire (with +4 planet, Librarian), I was producing eco damage at a much lower min production rate.

[Gothar]

I was running free market ie.-3planet. plus I built the bulk matter transmitter and the singularity inductor. I also have the prima guide (came with smacx) but missed the bit about nessus mine ops being clean minerals. After reading the guide especially the part about the singularity inductor I reliased where the damage was coming from. However I was too late as global warming occured and I couldn't launch a solar shade because I was under the effects of the sunspot random event. So two of my decent mineral producing bases with loads of sp's became sea bases.

[mark13]

Now you come to mention it, I was playing an OCC as the Gaians - +5 planet rating, no atrocities, no more than 60 mins/turn - yet eco-damage was well into the hundreds. However, I did have echelons/boreholes everywhere - crawlers in their hundreds working energy farms. To be honest, I gave up trying to find a worthwhile formula long ago, and learned to just live with it.
[This message has been edited by mark13 (edited December 06, 2000).]

[Transcend]

+3 planet rating will remove all eco damages related to TERRAFORMING. Mineral productions above a certain limit will always produce eco damage.
Tree Farms and Hybrid Forests combined eliminate terraforming eco damages;
Centauri Preserve, Temple of Planet, and Pholus Mutagen combined reduce mineral production effects on environment by 75%.
Committing minor atrocities(nerve gas, nerve stapling, factiona cleasings) will cause eco damages if UN charter is in place. Using PBs will always cause eco damages.

I hope that clears up.

[DilithiumDad]

The Nessus satellites are clean minerals, but the real culprit is often the Space Elevator. It doubles your mineral production while making orbitals, which results in outrageous eco-damage. Once I have the Elevator, I only build orbitals from small bases with low mineral production.


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Creator of the Ultimate Builder Map, based on the Huge Map of Planet