Consensus on Cheating?

[Ned]

Helium Pond, I sorry if I did, Helium. BTW, what does Helium Pond mean?

On the "road" question, I went back and tried building a road directly on fungus after researching Centauri Empathy, and it worked!

Still, I am sure that one can build roads right across fungus from day one.

[Helium Pond]

Ned, Helium Pond is a nonsensical juxtaposition of terms that amused me when I thought it up and is by now tiresome. But there you go. I've added to the list "Double Terraforming," because I think that it's another one of those things everybody should know about.

Now, is this roads thing confirmed? Will terraformers build roads across fungus if they're on auto? How do you do it? If you tell them to build roads to a destination that takes them across fungus, is that when it happens? Or is it only when you have them set to "Auto-build Roads?" Once I get all the info, I'll add this to the list, if it's indeed confirmed.

[Ned]

As to the roads, I'll have to check. The main reason I included it is that one day I tried to build a road directly on Fungus and received an error message. However, I could build the same road by doing Ctrl-R and pointing at a destination elsewhere. The road was built.

Ned

[Helium Pond]

I'm bumping this, just to see if it gets any new responses. Is it wrong to bump one's own thread?

[Misotu]

I don't see why

[mark13]

HP, how many responses do you want? This being the longest thread currently in the forum at the moment....

[Misotu]

Well, he's gathering all the info and then he's going to submit a suggested set of Apolyton rules - I hope. Otherwise, there's too much debate *still*

BTW Mark13, Florian asserts that you are a lady. (anneharrison?) Own up - is it true?

[WhiteElephants]

My two cents, it sounds like building roads over fungus before the available tech is definetly a no-go in my book. Though I've never tried it to see if it actually works or not.

I've heard if you bump your own thread too many times you'll go blind.

[Helium Pond]

Mis,
I'm not trolling for responses, I just thought this list would be interesting to the new players. I could cut and paste it into a new thread, if that'd be more convenient. Maybe I should, then people wouldn't feel they had to read all the debates. You think I should send the list to Tau Ceti? There are some things here not included in the Tournee rules.

As to anneharrison,
My assumption was that mark13 is using his mother's computer and email account. Thinking about it, that's a big assumption. Come to think of it, it could be a wife--or even daughter's--account. Hm. Or mark could be a girl. You never know. Or mark could be a guy pretending to be a girl. Or mark could be a transsexual pretending to be a transnational pretending to be a transcontinental. Oh wait, that's a railroad. Nevermind.

[mark13]

Nope, g/f's e-mail account unfortunately. Maybe I should get one of my own, I'm sick and tired of that question being asked...

Maybe we should stick every single issue of debate on these forums and put them into a great big rule book - wouldn't be a bad idea actually...

[Helium Pond]

Well, as you'll see if you read all the posts in this thread (and there's no reason why you should), my intent wasn't to generate debate about these things, just to catalogue all the things people *could* have debates about, so that everyone going into an MP game would know what to watch out for. My feeling is that I play the way I feel is honorable, but if a specific action hasn't been outlawed beforehand (for instance, the Tournament rules don't prohibit Pod-Booming, or Fleecing, or Super-Crawlers) then it's legal. It's not enough for other people to *think* it's cheating, or *assume* it's cheating--they have to have said so *before* you do it. I want this list to exist so that no one has the excuse "well, I didn't know you could do that, otherwise I would've said at the start that it was off-limits".

[Misotu]

HP, I didn't think there was any harm in bumping this thread at all, especially since we're back on the "is this a cheat?" merry-go-round.

I read this thread when it was originally started, so I'm a bit hazy as to where it got to. I remember thinking there were some good points, and some things that were either trivial or somewhat constricting. Just spotted the road in fungus thing, for example, and I had no idea you could do this! Cor. This might be something that could be ruled on as part of a more detailed set of rules ...

Yes, I think it would be good to put together a list of things that are considered *serious* cheats by the majority and which the current rules don't cover. I agree that there are a few omissions currently that I'd probably consider serious. A final opportunity for comments, and then why not offer it to Tau Ceti?

If there are *important* areas where there's still some debate, I think it wouldn't be unreasonable to try to arrive at a ruling, or ask Tau Ceti for a ruling, since these things are, I guess, bound to come up at some point in the games. Actually, Tau is pretty good at coming up with rulings I must say. Not that I always agree with him but he's pretty thorough on backing his opinions up and that's a good thing.

All I'd say is that it would probably be best not to try to rule on everything (grin) Right now, at least the rules are fairly straightforward. If it ends up being a 64-point document, a lot of people just won't read it at all and it'll cause more problems than it solves ...

Or maybe something like a top-line basic rules doc (slightly expanded version of what we have now), with a link to a more detailed list of rulings for people wanting to look something up that's a little more obscure? So it's not too intimidating?

Just my opinion, as always.

Mark: Well, I must admit I always thought you were really a Mark of the masculine variety, so I was surprised to read elsewhere that anne was your real name Since I'm the only regular girlie player in the tourny, I thought a bit of sisterhood might be on the cards - but I guess that's out of the question now

It's a lonely life, that of a girlie gamer ...

[mark13]

quote: Or maybe something like a top-line basic rules doc (slightly expanded version of what we have now), with a link to a more detailed list of rulings for people wanting to look something up that's a little more obscure? So it's not too intimidating?

This is, I believe, the best way to do this, as intimidation is one of the major factors in driving players away, something we do *not* want.

HP, I apologise if I may have put across notions that you were hunting for replies - something I may well inadvertantly have done. There is no harm in bumping a thread related to a discussed topic - and I whole-heartedly support this idea.

I shall attempt to compile a list of all the 'cheats' that should be discussed, probably sometime tomorrow. It may be a good idea for a couple of other people to do likewise - something one person may have missed, the other will have included, and vice-versa.

Mark13

[Aredhran]

Quick thread hijack... sorry

quote: Originally posted by Misotu on 11-11-2000 05:25 PM It's a lonely life, that of a girlie gamer ...

There's are female SMAC players at ACOL. PhatLady for sure, maybe AnnC if she still plays (not sure). Nell stopped posting when she became pregnant so I don't know if she still plays.

Aredhran

[Helium Pond]

mark13, the first message on the first page of this thread has just such a list.