A open letter to Firaxis (don't let this great game die)

[Geardy]

The game Sim City by Maxis has been a still is one of the top games of its kind. Myst is another game that still carries the title of greatest game of its kind and other versions of it are coming out later this year and early next year. We must convey to Firaxis that Alpha Centauri is one of the premier games of its class. We need to support more and newer versions of this incredible game, by letting its creators at Firaxis know the game still is and will remain a game that players will continue to enjoy for years to come. This site is the place to begin to let them know that the game still holds the potential for even newer ideas and innovations. That we don’t want Firaxis to let this game fade away with time when like the other two games mentioned above, are still, after the many years in production are involved in newer versions and ideas. Please add your thoughts and comments and how much you would like to see even more added to this great game of Alpha Centauri.
[This message has been edited by Geardy (edited September 09, 2000).]

[mark13]

Finally, someone echoing the sentiments of millions of die-hard Alpha gamers all around the globe. Each and every game Sid Meier has worked on since the original Civilisation has been nothing short of a classic.

I bought Alpha Centauri on 13th November 1998, in the hope that the same ideas from Civilisation 2 would be transferred onto a new concept, continuing the future history of mankind. I was wrong, and I am glad that I was wrong, because this game is BETTER than Civ II, and better than ny other turn-based strategy game bar none. Usually I get bored of my games within a couple of months, when something better comes along, but not this game. I am still playing smac as hard now as I was then, and enjoying it every iota as much.

So, once more, I echo the notion pressed forward by Geardy, for goodness' sake Firaxis, DON'T let this great game die

[stuntman19]

I concur, a game engine that can handle more than 7 factions would be a positive addition. Just seeing how it plays out with the added interactions of the splinter factions would be cool.

[XWaste]

Yeah, it would be good to have all the factions playing at the same time. Besides that though, I'm not sure what else can be done (more patches maybe...) that wouldn't completly change the feel of the game.
More alien races maybe...but then the game could get too star warsy. Different planets with different terrain (no more fungus)...but then the game story is so tied to Chiron that it might just make the other planets feel contrived, especially if they were made with some sort of inner mystery to be discovered.

I think firaxis have done a good job of making a great self-contained game which works well because it doesn't need a whole host of add-ons. They would probably be better of creating a new space colonisation game which is more dynamic and allows for greater variance/expansion rather than trying to force them into smac.

[Provost Harrison]

I think the point is a valid one, but I think Firaxis are trying to develop other games and move on (Civ3, dinosaurs, etc) to expand the genre further. Sometimes all some companies are doing with the multitude of expansions is flogging a dead. Respect to Firaxis for not doing this, although the extra factions idea would be nice, if extraordinarily difficult to add into the game now without a serious rewrite. I think that it would be best to keep this in mind when making Civ3...

[Alinestra Covelia]

I agree. Although a stranger complaint perhaps would be that you couldn't reenact the history of the world in the game (Civ II or Civ I).

I'd personally find it very gratifying if it were possible for fans to actually put in a sort of "Replay" style game but with new civs starting up at controlled times (eg Americans declare independence 4th July 1776) and forcing government changes (eg China declares martial law 1st October 1949) etc.

That would allow "realworld" scenarios to be more easily created, for example cutting and pasting inside this given framework.

If this doesn't sound too complex and unimplementable, I hope Firaxis might consider it. As far as I know, no other game of Civ2's historical scope has a scenmaker so relatively simple to use.

------------------
Machines: outthinkable YES outfightable NO.
Men: outfightable YES outthinkable NO.
Allie Cove: outfallable INEVITABLY

Homepage http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk (Shared)

[Adm.Naismith]

Some months ago, we argue about the "Sweep of time" trilogy (Dino+Civ+SMAC).

It's still unclear if the three games will have some real link or only a marketing relation.

Like XWaste underline, SMAC is more "self-contained" than CIV, and I have read that SMACX already tuned some parts (but left bugs too).

Until Civ 3 I'm sure there is no place (means money, market and developer team) for a proper SMAC 2: aiming for late 2002 as early release date suggest to me we don't hold breathe

Still, for the sake of this discussion, I suppose that:
- SMAC 2 will get every CIV 3 engine and main features
- it probably will not evolve the main line too much, but if it will do anyway, I bet for one of the follow historyline:

1) start to play from the starship Unity voyage, with the first game part more about tactical squad inside the ship (very low probability)

2) colonize Chiron then expand on the Alpha centauri system asteroids (low probability)

3) fight aliens race, then go to war on the aliens planet, to clean up their mother planet in a vengeance (if you play as human) or to the earth (if you play as the alien factions) (medium probability)

4) colonize Chiron then go back to solve the mistery of the earth long silence; there you discover the planet is lost in a messy war and you have the opportunity to restart life almost from scratch (a) restarting with a Dino 2 game, with concept from a S.F. story when scientist act more like gods seeding the life (medium probability),
or
(b) restarting with a Civ 3 game, but helping human tribe survived, with only knowledge of few low tech, to raise up again cleaning up the messy earth (medium probability)

5) keep the same history, add CIV 3 features and some graphics bells and whistles (high probability )

Ok, now vote the poll!

------------------
Admiral Naismith AKA mcostant
[This message has been edited by Adm.Naismith (edited September 13, 2000).]

[Helium Pond]

The games originally mentioned--Sim City and Myst--were phenomenons. They created whole genres of gaming (well, they didn't actually create them, but they proved their potential so strongly that many imitators followed). The reason those games have been kept alive, with updates to their graphics engines and new additions, but basically still the same game, is because they still sell well. Alpha Centauri, while my favorite game, has simply not sold at levels high enough to make it worth Firaxis' continued support. I'm addressing the original point of this thread, here, not more wishes about what the game should be. I would love it if the game were kept alive--if it was a staple of the gaming industry, if it was continually bug-fixed and finally balanced--but it isn't going to happen. It's much more likely that we'll see a new version of Civ II than a new version of SMAC. And I'm not being facetious: a new version of Civ II could actually happen. It wouldn't be a new version with new AI and new features; it would be a new suit of clothes on the old engine, and it would happen because the game is considered a classic, and its parent company wants to milk the franchise a little more. That's a long way off from happening to SMAC, which isn't even considered a classic yet, if it ever will be.

[Neptunus]

You there, at FIRAXIS... You've made a masterpiece and HAVE TO present a SMAC II to the world EVEN BETTER. (Sid knows the way to achieve that - he has the touch of Midas)

OK it may be after Civ III but we DO expect a SMAC II.

After all, I personally can't stand the fanfares about the new CtP II as I strongly believe there is a better and cheaper way to obtain trays for coffee mugs : just use old CDs (At least MY copy of CtP made a nice coffee mug tray).

So, Helium Pond you may be correct in your speculations about the future of SMAC (from the FIRAXIS point of view). But CtP is NOT and will NEVER be a classic even if it sells more than SMAC (which I think it did, but not to a much greater degree).

So why CtP II and not SMAC II ????????

[XWaste]

The normal premise for a sequal is the continuation of unresolved issues from the original.
Civ doesn't really have a storyline, so a sequal is really just a newer version of the same game.
Smac does have a story, and I wouldn't be interested in any sequal that repeats the story with an 'improved' games engine and some new features.
Logic would dictate then, that a smac2 would have to continue where smac left off.
This would then suggest the sort of space civ game like Masters of Orion II (one of my fav games).
There are a number of possibilites
-different start conditions dependant on how you deem you won smac (maybe the ability to play through both games - starting from smac, winning and then transfering to smac2)
-different levels of management...rather than colonising empty planets or those with submissive natives (like MoO2) some planets could have thriving civilisations, which you could intrude upon by colonising some free territory, meaning not only do you have to keep track of everything your doing in the universe, but some planets will have a civ/samc like nature to their management.
-unlimited potential for oppenents, as you could always develop new alien races.
-The progenitors are out there somewhere
-What has happened to Earth, I like the idea of some sort of evil Empire like out of Star Wars
-Did other groups of humans leave earth?
-What benifits would a sentient planet give?
-How would you win the game?

I don't like the idea of a smac2 being just a revamped smac, like the civ sequals are. If a smac2 is to be developed (which doesn't seem too likely) it should be a new game worthy of being a classic in its own right.

[Helium Pond]

Yeah, everybody's full of great ideas for the game makers.

[Khan Singh]

Smac is a great game. So Firaxis (and Big Huge) should go on to make other great games. Not the same game again.

[[LordLMP]]

For SMAC 2, why not have Humans from Alpha Centauri to come back to Earth... they get there about the same time a Proginator colonization or whatever fleet arrived there...

-LordLMP

[Dry]

I long hesitated before writing this post because what follow is about friends' opinion and not really mine and it is difficult to write a) for others b) in a foreign language.
I post it because out of 4 friends, I am the only one who still play SMAC. The 3 others refuse to play anymore: they prefer Civ2.

Reason1: ethic.
Two of my friends consider Civ2 a game about the good side of mankind. Most wonders (except KR Crusade, Manhattan) are testimonies of what beautifull things mankind can achieve when men work together. Most Secret Pojects (not all) are testimonies of what bad things man can do to other man (I was personnaly shocked by the Self Aware Colony).

Reason2: optimism/pessimism
The same 2 see Civ2 as a game where mankind progress. Mankind starts from barbarism and - with discoveries of new tech - it progress to civilisation. Man goes from despotism to democracy, from slavery to freedom.
They see Smac as a regression of Mankind: from (relative) freedom back to slavery. Man learn how to enslave more deeply other men (Thought control, Virtual reality,...).

Reason3: Torture
We all 4 where shocked by what happen to a captured leader. Even if you switch of the scene (I no more sure if we can do this, but anyhow...) you still have the message that the leader is tortured. We all tried to find if we can choose something else for captured leaders, but found nothing. For one of us it was too much and he refuses to play because of that (A message like "you *may* torture him/her" would have been enough, but you don't even have the choice!!) . For another, it is just "not compatible with his personality", he dislikes that sequence and - like me - he tried not to take the last city, to avoid that message.

I am the only one who continues playing smac because I don't care about game context, I just play, like I would play Doom. But for my friends (They also play Doom), context of a "builder" game is important, especially if it is the follower of such a great game as civ.
The one for who the torture sequence is too much had nearly a depression by playing. He now play civ2 only.

So, if there is a SmacII, can you please make it more ethical, optimistic and allow "democratic" players to bring captured leader before the court for a fair trial (or torture him for those who likes that).
Please allow players to role-play that game also as "good" leaders, not only as despots.

Once again, it is difficult to explain why others don't want to play anymore, I tried to explain what I understood from what they told me, but my request is:
Please, bring back my friends: I miss being able to talk to someone about what great game I played the day before...
[This message has been edited by Dry (edited October 03, 2000).]

[stuntman19]

You make some good points, I do grant you that. However, how can one find smac so offensive as not to be able to play, but play DOOM? In my opinion DOOM is way more violent and offensive. Don't give me the DOOM is violence against mutants, etc as this is still barbaric if even against another form of life.