Atrocities! (Why does nobody like me?)

[Alinestra Covelia]

I'm playing SMAX and I've successfully repealed the Atrocity prohibition. It couldn't have come at a better time, as I've just finished my Cloning Vats SP and nerve staplings are on the house! (And the only way I can really keep order.)

However, nearly all the other factions have terminated pacts with me and one even went so far as to declare outright vendetta with me. What's going on? Are they protesting the atrocities despite the lifting of the ban, or are they just naturally jealous now that my MightGraph rating has gone orbital?



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Machines: outthinkable YES outfightable NO.
Men: outfightable YES outthinkable NO.
Allie Cove: outfallable INEVITABLY

Homepage http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk (Shared)

[Jasonian]

Probably just because of the power graph. The AI factions tend to go nuts when a faction has a definite lead over them.

If the Charter is repealed, I wouldn't be suprised if they are stapling their own citizens as well! Hey, why not?

[Kinjiru]

I like you Alinestra...

[Fitz]

I love you! *bats eyes at Allie*

I didn't know you played D&D.

Um, to stay on topic, did you use any atrocities against any other factions, or were they all internal?
[This message has been edited by Fitz (edited August 16, 2000).]

[Adam_Smith]

It's your power.

[Alinestra Covelia]

Come to think of it, I think I might have then nerve stapled some citizens in bases that didn't look like my faction's but were mine.

If that doesn't make sense, then here's the situation. I captured a few enemy bases, and they remained in the style of the (for argument's sake) Burbblechuff faction, not my faction.

After a while (I think it's about 50 years or so) that changes and the bases become mine in looks as well as allegiance. Also I noticed that that means that in the "Psyche" window for the base, the "captured base -1" penalty doesn't appear.

However, if I nerve staple a captured base AND THE ATROCITIES ARE LEGAL, then does this still make the original owner hate me?

Anyhow, this question is all a bit academic now, because I've just built the Telepathic Matrix. Now *there's* a psychotically powerful Secret Project if ever I've seen one!


Fitz: D&D, eh? Where did you hear about that?

If you're interested, there's an entire chunk of webpage about my D&D world. It's right here.


Kinjiru and Fitz: Who says dictators can't be lovers? Eh? Eh? Ha!


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Machines: outthinkable YES outfightable NO.
Men: outfightable YES outthinkable NO.
Allie Cove: outfallable INEVITABLY

Homepage http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk (Shared)

[Tau Ceti]

Your latest theory is correct. Nerve Stapling a captured base makes the original owner hate you forever, regardless of UN Charter status. Actually, so does committing any other atrocity on them; it only means your standing with other factions is not damaged.

[Simpson II]

It sounds like a combination of the two problems mentioned.

If you nerve-staple a captured base, the former owner will inevitably declare Vendetta - even if they are a submissive.

Also, the diplomacy works so that while the two top factions are relatively even in power, people tend to pact with one or the other, forming big power blocks. However, when one player becomes twice as powerful as anyone else, everyone gangs up on them, while trying to form pacts with number 2.

I guess that you had both problems at once, with various people.

by the way; D&D WtF?!?! Where do you go mushroom picking? I want to drop by there some time.

[Alinestra Covelia]

Thanks all for clearing this up. You might (?) be happy to know that I solved the DataTech problem by gassing them too.

So that's nice.

SimpsonII: for my mushroom patch, check out this page!

[Neptunus]

Allie Cove... Keep on nerve-stapling. If you're ahead, why bother if nobody likes you (in the game of course) Even if you never do any atrocities and stay noble until the end, sooner or later all will turn against you...

By the way... which faction are you playing in SMAX (if not the Hive again) ?

[Alinestra Covelia]

Neptunus: Well, I'm going to have to be very boring and say that I am, indeed, playing as Everybody's Favorite Chairman again. All the enemy factions are SMAX factions, though, and my own faction replaces the Pirates.

If it's of interest to anybody, the faction I found to put up the most fight (even despite my generous outlay of Nerve Gas Pods) were the Manifold Caretakers.

Annoyingly, in the end, it was the Cybernetic Consciousness who took the credit for their demise. I had driven the Caretakers to found a desperate last base over on "Dragon Continent" (westernmost continent on normal map of Planet) and the Consciousness just flattened them.

In retaliation, I probed the Caretaker leader H'minee back out of Alpha Prime base, and lo and behold, Aka Zeta1 declared vendetta on me. Not only that, but H'minee herself told me I would burn for all my atrocities against her people. This, when she had NO bases to call her own!

The very next turn, without me having to do anything, H'minee was eradicated.

Evidently, there are faction leaders whose hatred of me will go farther than logic (or self-preservation) dictates...



------------------
Machines: outthinkable YES outfightable NO.
Men: outfightable YES outthinkable NO.
Allie Cove: outfallable INEVITABLY

Homepage http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk (Shared)

[Neptunus]

It's good to see some people have really steady values

I just wonder... if you probe free a captured leader then ONE base is automatically created somewhere in the map for his/her faction. Strange that H'minee was eradicated having no bases...

In my case the greatest satisfaction in the game is when you leave your opponent so exhausted after a blitzkrieg that is forced to surrender and then you ask for ALL of his/her bases and he/she gives them to you. Of course that faction is eradicated the next turn. This happens quite often and in most cases two or three faction are eradicated this way.

By the way, for me, the most hatred faction is the Usurpers...

[Adam_Smith]

Is this in SMACX or SMAC. I tried to get a base from one of my subs in SMACX and she didn't give it to me. I don't know if I'd want to take them all anyway. I'm usually trying to keep my subs alive.

[Neptunus]

Adam_Smith it happens to both SMAC and SMAX. And it's easier than you may thing. For example Deirdre is left with three bases. I ask for all three of them, one after the other, which she gives. This is also very easy for Morgan, Roze, Aki and Lal. It also happened with Miriam (with her 4 last bases), Yang and Santiago. But the way it happens looks more rather a bug of the game than a free decision from a surrendered (and exhausted) opponent...

However, after a long peaceful game, with just a few fierce years of fighting (usually against all factions), I enjoy leaving just ONE base from ONE opponent (usually the most tough to beat during the game) as eternal punishment. Then I may transcend in peace...

[Alinestra Covelia]

I have never had a situation arise where, upon freeing a captured faction leader, a base is instantaneously created and/or handed over to that leader.

In each case, I've had to give a base to that leader. In this particular case, Caretaker Guardian H'minee declared vendetta on me the moment I set her free, so she never got any bases and was presumably very quickly dealt with by the Probe Team I sent out to her.

Bloody squid-heads... can't tell when a monkey-evolved biped is being nice to them.

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Machines: outthinkable YES outfightable NO.
Men: outfightable YES outthinkable NO.
Allie Cove: outfallable INEVITABLY

Homepage http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk (Shared)