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  • Alien artifacts

    Let's face it:

    Playing with unity pod scatering on or off gives you two very different gaming experiences.

    On:
    Favours active, momentum-style play: Get out and get those pods.
    Favours certain factions because of their superior pod popping abilities: Gaians (keep capturing worms, and go pod-popping), Spartans (faster units, one tech away from D:flex).
    Enables the tech tree to be transversed faster, which favours the human player over the AI, since humans are better at putting new technology to use)
    Enables SPs to be produced faster, which also favours the human player.

    Off:
    Somewhat evens out the early advantage of momentum play vs builder play
    Seriously impairs Gaians in the early to mid game, and to a lesser extent Spartans in the early game
    Slows the tech advance, which makes the AI play better
    Makes it harder to build SPs, which also makes the AI play better

    For a long while I preferred playing with scattering off, thereby taking out some of the random elements of the game. Lately, however, I've been playing with scattering on. It is simply more fun.

    This has made me wonder:

    Having found one of these cherished Alien Artifacts, I have several possibilities:

    1. Link it to a network node as soon as possible, trying to gain an early tech advantage. This is what I have been doing most of the time.

    2. Save the linking of artifacts till later. The later you use it, the more research points it will net you. Cashing in artifacts in the very early game, might save , say, 40 research points, and make the achievement of regular tech advance much more expensive. If you wait , your regular advance will be much faster, and you get more bang for your buck when you link up the artifact later, saving hundreds or thousands of research points. One time I was researching a really crucial tech (I forget which, could have been Ind Aut). I was about to achieve the tech next turn, but - alas - I had three (no less!!) alien artifacts arriving at three different network nodes at the same turn, and I linked them all: press F2 and '30 turns to next tech adbvancement'. Big Bummer .

    On the other hand having all those artifacts on your hands and not using them, doesn't really get you anywhere, does it? Of course they are denied to the other factions, but still.

    This suggests another approach:

    3. Use the alien artifact to speed up the building of a Special Project. I have never tried this, how does it work? Will it simply finish the SP next turn or what?
    This might make it possible to secure the majority of the important early SPs on your hands. It will free up your production queues for the production of further infrastructure/units, giving you vast turn advantage. Taken together, these two effects might very easily achieve more than gaining an instant tech, particularly early in the game.

    In my next few games I think I will experiment with 3, while saving a few AAs for a rainy day (for instance, when somebody comes aknocking with needlejets, and I desperately need D:Airpower. Come to think of it: Preferably some time before they com aknocking )

    Anybody have any thoughts about this?
    Civilisation means European civilisation. there is no other...
    (Mustafa Kemal Pasha)

  • #2
    Beor, an artifact will contribute 50 minerals to the current project. I really haven't paid attention to the influence of industry settings on this.

    I usually use them for getting tech, but if I get one early I sometimes use it to advance an early SP.

    One thing you shouldn't do is cash an artifact when you are just one or two turns away from your current research goal, because that would seriously delay it. But if you are farther away from your goal you could just cash them and hope to get lucky and get the tech you want. But it would be best not to use them on your first couple of techs because the relative increase in science requirements is too big.

    Comment


    • #3
      Paul

      Fifty mins it is then. The benefit from getting a new tech will swiftly outdo this. That would limit the use of AAs to speed SPs to the very early game.

      That still leaves the idea of saving the AA for later. This very much depends on how the cost of tech levels are calculated.

      Does anybody know the formula for calculating the cost of techs?
      Civilisation means European civilisation. there is no other...
      (Mustafa Kemal Pasha)

      Comment


      • #4
        I personally consider it a waste to apply an artifact's mineral content toward a project. I believe that it is always advantageous to link these puppies up to the nodes.
        I have read these arguments before. Use it now? Or, wait till later, when techs are a lot more research-intensive.
        Well... just how desperate is your situation? When Santiago or Miriam or Yang within striking distance, I am linking those artifacts as fast as I can!
        BTW, does anyone know if SMAC randomizes the tech that the artifact releases?

        ------------------
        Service means Citizenship. I'm doing my part!
        Service means Citizenship. I'm doing my part!

        Comment


        • #5
          Linked AAs do yield a random tech, Mars. Prove it by saving the game just before it links, then try it several times. Of course, you can't test this when playing Ironman.

          Comment


          • #6
            I myself have found myself pondering the same questions.

            Ultimately I find myself following the sound advice of turn advantage. The sooner one can accelerate the tech discoveries ala cashing in AA's ASAP(again following the sound advice discussed above of waiting for an immediate tech discovery to pass prior to cash in) the sooner one can build momementum to further accelerate through the tech tree and/or mount the critical offensive campaign.

            Under dire emergencies (i.e. gain of critical early game SP's such as Weather Paradigm, Human genome, or Virt World) I will cash in AA's to beat another faction to the punch. However typically after Industrial Auto, Cashing in AA's is typically less advantageous than cashing in upgraded crawlers.


            Just my two milliwatts
            "Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson

            “In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy Carter

            Comment


            • #7
              I tend to wait until I've done the important beelining, then cash in the AA for a tech. I usually don't want to slow down on the way to Ind. Automation, even (in fact in particular) if I've taken an indirect route. Impact is not what I need at that point.

              For the same reasons, if I'm playing the Hive then I never pop pods at all until I have Centauri Ecology. I've had '50 turns until next breakthrough' a couple of times, and that really kills your game.
              "Wise men make proverbs, but fools repeat them."
              - Samuel Palmer

              Comment


              • #8
                I've seen AA used to speed a special project quite effectively in a multiplayer game and I think Bustamike would agree. He was one turn from completing the Command Nexus, playing Morgan, when Mistou, playing the Spartans, came out of nowhere and finished the Project before Busta. I can only assume he cashed in several AA to finish the project because, as I recall, he hadn't been working on the project for very long (five turns at best maybe even less). Of course Busta just changed to the Human Genome and finished that project next turn, but I think the Spartans having the Command Nexus is far more deadly than Morgan, especially in the first one hundred turns.

                I used this scenario to illustrate that sometimes it can pay to cash in the AA's to rush a project.

                Do you want the Virtual World or the Merchant Exchange?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Ogie hit the nail on the head.

                  If you cash in those AAs right away you will be ahead in the long run. The quicker you head up the tech tree the faster you get your min/nut/nrg resource restrictions lifted, increase your trade, get A/D/M advances and so on. In my estimation, you should always be able to use your early tech lead to crank up those research points to more than offset the difference in RPs between early and midgame that you'd save by not cashing the AA in right away.

                  I regularly use AAs to build SPs prior to getting crawler tech. Three of the SPs that I find to be the most useful, HGP, VW and WP; all get built long before Ind Auto. Sometimes I'll build EG this way too. I figure that ensuring you get these projects is even more important than an early tech or two.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    WhiteElephants,
                    "Do you want the Virtual World or the Merchant Exchange?"

                    In MP I would prefer the Merchant Exchange. Seriously! If you build the VW and someone begins an assault on you by taking the base which built it, then every base you have is likely to riot next turn. That means halved costs to mind-control them. If Zak builds it, and if you can also take his HQ, then you can buy his empire for a pitance. (Hi Paul! Enjoying the VW in our game? ) ME helps to pay for all those Holo theatres, and provides a tidy research boost.
                    Mind you, the Command Nexus is pretty useful for the Spartans. Morale is potentially as good as tech to a momentum player, so IMHO Mis made a good call.

                    RedFred,
                    You can get the restrictions lifted in 10 techs (with Cent Eco) if you are lucky, and 13 if you also do Ind. Auto. (a nice back-up, for when the tech tree is being awkward.) Random techs from pods will be unlikely to get you there faster, since you will usually end up with things like applied physics. Useful, but less so when you have a good builder start.
                    "Wise men make proverbs, but fools repeat them."
                    - Samuel Palmer

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      SimpsonII -- I don't know? It would take an awfully long time to even get near the amount of energy needed to build even one holo theartre from the Merchant Exchange alone. And I can't say from experience, but if someone is taking my cities with my Special Projects in them I probably pretty screwed already whether my bases riot or not. And who is going to leave a bunch of bases rioting with no probes in them to protect them? Better yet, whose going to leave vulnerable bases without probes in them? Not I.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        O, and how can you plan on building special projects if you just plan on losing them? How can you plan on winning if you plan on losing? It would seem the battle is lost before it has begun.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          If you use random-random tech advance (non-directed research, all or none of the priorities taken) then ALL of your tech is like cashing in an artifact. Trust me, it is a more tenuous (and realistic) way to live, since you can’t b-line and may not get Nonlinear Mathematics by the time Booger or Yang comes knocking…

                          In this cases it makes absolutely no difference when you cash in an artifact. In fact, you cash ASAP, since the worst it can do is get rid of one more tech you really don’t need (e.g. – Nonlinear Mathematics...PLEEEEAAAAASE!).

                          Hydro

                          P.S. - I occasionally cash one in for a SP, but never prototyping. 50 minerals is a lot in the early game when you might make 5 per turn, and you are energy shy.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            WE: Woa! True, it woud be a long time to get the energy to build the Holotheatres. I was thinking more in terms of maintainance.

                            IMHO, if someone picks any one base and says 'I will destroy this' then they can. You can make it very costly, but nerve gas, coupled with a total disregard for their own troops, will do it. A 30 city empire is far, far harder, since you cannot concentrate your forces. But if one city is vital to the safety of the entire empire (with VW, Citizen's Defense Force) then there is the potential for serious problems.

                            Yes, you can probe-guard. But probes fight at 1-to-1 odds, and if that doesn't favour the attacker more than their best weapons V your defenses then... 'bye-'bye. Also remember, you can't stop bases rioting until the beginning of the next turn. Half a dozen key bases (likely the ones closest to the VW-city, and likely to contain SPs themselves) could be in enemy hands, or obliterated.

                            To call VW useless would be grossly unfair. But with Theatres cheap to build, the insurance is nice. If it provided a unique advantage (which for Zak it does, to some extent,) or Theatres cost e.g. 150 mins to build then it would be excellent. As it is, I regard it a being a little mediocre. Perhaps I'm being overly safety conscious.

                            Tell you what. To test the proposition, you build the VW in WDRS, and I'll take it off you .

                            Didymus,
                            I only have Smac, so I didn't know about Spore launchers destroying AAs. Nasty.
                            I can usually trade the techs I have for the things I want from the AI. It flounders about the tree randomly, so my level threes are good exchanges for it's level twos. My bad habit of wandering all over their territory looking for pods tends to ruin that, though .

                            [This message has been edited by Simpson II (edited August 24, 2000).]
                            "Wise men make proverbs, but fools repeat them."
                            - Samuel Palmer

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Simpson II, in response to an earlier comment you made I should have clarified that, like Hydro, I normally play random tech games. Double blind. No way that I ever get all the restrictions removed in 10 techs.

                              Even if I did, there are still tree farms and Hybrid Forests to be had further up the tree which will increase your output per tile.

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