What would you change...

[Quezacotl06]

...About the weaker factions of SMAC/X to make them stronger? And what would you do to some of the stronger factions to make them a bit weaker/more balenced?

I personaly would have given Cult 25% PSI attack bonus, Pirates +1 Commerce, Morgan a -1 population limit instead of -2, Spartans +1 Support and give the Hive robust efficiency, rather than totaly immunity to negatives.

[Dis]

hive is weak?

for some reason in the game I was playing last night Hive was #1. I couldn't figure out why.

What are the weaker factions? I don't have smacX.

For my games it seems to be the spartans and morganites. The believers start out strong, but they start to fade by midgame.

[Mr. President]

The computer-controlled Hive tends to build hundreds of bases and thousands of units and overwhelm people. As a result they often end up with entire continents under their sway and when you challenge them you have to grind through base after heavily defended base.

The computer-controlled Morgans are a pile of crap. I've been considering modifying their faction attributes and / or abilities to make them a little tougher.

[Darsnan]

Re: What would you change...

Originally posted by Quezacotl06
...About the weaker factions of SMAC/X to make them stronger? And what would you do to some of the stronger factions to make them a bit weaker/more balenced?

Heah Queztacoatl06,

from my experience some Factions are weak under certain circumstances, while being strong under others, and vice versa. Personally when setting up an SP game I choose a map and populate it with Factions that do well under the circumstances I have selected, thus presenting more of a challenge.
However, I also make a lot of games designed specifically for others to play, and manipulate the playing environment to favour desired Factions.
So, to summarize, IMO the base 14 Factions are not necessarily weak, if employed correctly. I think we were given a shotgun spread of Factions, which if selected coherently, can give very good gameplay over a broad spectrum of games/ circumstances: we just have to employ them properly.



D

[Dis]

there are so many variable factors that change.

In my latest game hive got wiped out by the spartans. And they started on those 3 thermal boreholes.

[RX2000]

Yea I've seen just about every faction do good in a game and every faction do bad. I think a lot of it just depends on blind luck.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Dissident
there are so many variable factors that change.

In my latest game hive got wiped out by the spartans. And they started on those 3 thermal boreholes.

That's not much of an advantage if they never manage to get restrictions lifted.

[Flubber]

I agree with Darsnan

Take the cult-- On large or huge maps or if you play with lesser life forms, they have a tough time since those are really "builder" settings. But try the cult on a tiny to standard map and just for fun have abundant natives and see how they do.
Ditto with the spartans and believers

Think about it this way . . . would you want to play the university on a tiny map ?? Probably not.


I think that most discussions of weaker factions usually end up being biased in that we are thinking larger maps and builder style games-- If you think of all the possibilities, you can see many situations where the factions you see as weaker can shine

[Jamski]

Think about it this way . . . would you want to play the university on a tiny map ?? Probably not.

Don't see why not. In these conditions you can trancsend by 2180.

-Jam

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Jamski


Don't see why not. In these conditions you can trancsend by 2180.

-Jam

Or be trounced by hordes of Hive units in 2125 . . . or a wave of elite spartans or data angel probe teams etc etc.

[livid imp]

Originally posted by Flubber
I agree with Darsnan

Take the cult-- On large or huge maps or if you play with lesser life forms, they have a tough time since those are really "builder" settings. But try the cult on a tiny to standard map and just for fun have abundant natives and see how they do.
Ditto with the spartans and believers

Think about it this way . . . would you want to play the university on a tiny map ?? Probably not.


I think that most discussions of weaker factions usually end up being biased in that we are thinking larger maps and builder style games-- If you think of all the possibilities, you can see many situations where the factions you see as weaker can shine

So by this logic, wouldn't only be fair to usually play standard maps in MP game to give the momentum factions a chance?

And I totally agree weak can dominate under differing conditions, but the stronger factions will do well even in conditions which are less than optimal.

If the Cult began with Brood Pits (a la Hive with perimeter defense) rather than gaining them with the prereq tech (which is too far into the game to matter), they could be a stronger faction.

The Pirates could be a resonable faction if they got a subsea trunkline for free as well.

Morgan either needs the hab limit raised or the support penalty eliminated so he can run democracy without units costing double support.

Spartans could use +1 support to help with all the police and offensive units they will have. But I am not sure they really need it that much as I have yet to run them as all specialists.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by livid imp


So by this logic, wouldn't only be fair to usually play standard maps in MP game to give the momentum factions a chance?

Nope-- players choose whatever faction they want based on the game settings .. .If the map chosen were tiny, I'm betting that the spartans and believers would have more fans.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by livid imp


And I totally agree weak can dominate under differing conditions, but the stronger factions will do well even in conditions which are less than optimal.

See!! this is the builder bias we all have. A smaller fungusy map is seen as less than optimal LOL.

Seriously . . . I think certain factions are more suitable to specific conditions. Some other factions, The hive and gaians come to mind remain, to me, equally playable regardless of map size.

Some others like the university and Morgan seem to do better on larger maps .. . I'm not saying they are unplayable on small maps, just tougher against intelligent opposition

[livid imp]

You took that wrong, let me reiterate:

And I totally agree weak can dominate under differing conditions, but the stronger factions will do well even in conditions which are less than optimal for the particular faction in question.

[livid imp]

Originally posted by Flubber


Nope-- players choose whatever faction they want based on the game settings .. .If the map chosen were tiny, I'm betting that the spartans and believers would have more fans.

Sorry, I was under the assumption that the factions were picked first. Disregard my previous statement.