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Rush Buying - Maximise your EC today!

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  • Rush Buying - Maximise your EC today!

    So you want to maximise your ECs?

    In this dog eat dog world of Chiron being money smart can save you and your goons from a unnessacry trip to the punishment sphere. However, where does one start with EC spending?

    The answer is what exactly are you aiming for? There are trade offs between getting a quick bang for your buck and more prolonged investments.

    Starting a production. (Mineral Costs)
    So you've got some money and a few people working for you. However, you don't know where to invest your money since you spent most of your early years wasting it on fast vechicles and women.

    Well Contruction Expert Nethog has compiled some useful data on the ins and outs of the construction industry.
    Excel Rush Build Costs - Nethog's Pricing Analysis
    PDF Rush Build Costs - Nethog's Pricing Analysis

    One thing to note is that Nethog has made the assumption that everyone entering the construction industry will understand that it's not a good idea to rush productions under 10 minerals.

    Since there are many economic freshmen here I'll elaborate on the assumption. For an example a drop rover may cost 100 ECs to rush when you only have 6 minerals queued. That same rover may only cost around 35 ECs once you have gathered 10 minerals for the production.

    The reason for this is that during the early stages of production the incompetant managers haven't yet been fired or shot. Consequently, until 10 minerals are queued spending money on the production will result in huge quanities of money lining the pockets of second rate companies that the work has been outsourced to.

    For unit costs the rush cost is roughly doubled when under 10 minerals queued, including the exponential curve for more expensive rushes. Hence the observed 3 times decrease in the rush cost. (common sense meaning of exponential, mathematically x^2 so not really exponential)

    For facilities that have a under 10 minerals, the cost of all the minerals is 4 ECs per mineral rather than the usual 2 ECs per mineral after you have acquired 10 minerals.

    For Secret Projects, such as the "selling cookies so we can afford to buy a padlock for our treehouse to keep girls out", the cost is expensive like 16 ECs per mineral when under 10 minerals queued. If you can afford to buy minerals at 16 ECs each for an entire Secret Project then you really don't need any economic advice.

    So if you want to rush buy something you should always try and spend the money on productions that have at least 10 minerals queued. Facilities cost 2 ECs each mineral at or over 10 minerals, or unit productions that are nearing completion and are at or over 10 minerals each. Remember that when you looked at Nethog's work unit productions got exponentially cheaper the closer a unit was to completing. (common sense meaning of exponential, mathematically x^2 so not really exponential)

    Investing in the future. (How to keep a steady production)

    You will often find that you will become short of money even if you only go looking for bargain buys. Even if you're Morgan you will sometimes find yourself short on money and this is especially the case for an energy poor faction like the Hive.

    There is such a thing as partial rush buying. This allows you to increase the number of minerals in a production queue without paying for the last couple of minerals that will be filled in by your workers. However, you may not always want to make use of the feature as you miss out on the handy government rebate scheme.

    Taking advantage of government rebates, is fairly easy. When you finish a production the government allows you up to 10 minerals of production to be carried over to a new project. This is only production carried over from the workers not from the production queue (the lazy worker sods skim off any extra resources in the build queue when it completes) and the production carried over cannot exceed 10 minerals.

    Notice how by carrying over 10 minerals to your next build you set yourself up for an immediate rush buying of the new red convertible you wanted built for your next birthday.

    Even if you don't want to immediately rush anything the following turn it can be useful not to use partial rush buying. Looking at the economic characteristics of rush buying it can be seen that the last couple of minerals for units are always the cheapest. For prolonged investment in your productions it will always be better to always invest either in facilities, or paying for the last few minerals to complete a unit. Even if it doesn't speed the current production, by buying the minerals now it speeds the following production due to the possible carry over of minerals to the next production.

    However, sometimes you do want to do partial rush buying. If you are trying to meet some deadline like a simultaneous military parade in several cities, and you do not have enough ECs to pay fully for all the festivities then you can only rush everything to near completion instead of full completion. This saves you money in the short run, but in the future your productions will take longer to complete.

    A definite use for partial rush buying is if you absolutely need that diamond studded gold slippers for your wife and you have less than 10 minerals. Due to the increase costs of rush buying when under 10 minerals it'll be far better to let the workers finish the last few minerals for production. You can reinvest that money later when minerals cost far less.

    Bleeding Edge Technologies (Prototypes)

    Investing in bleeding edge technologies are an interesting case. The prototypes cost a little bit more than usual, but you need to remember that you gain advantage by having that new equipment out and about, if only for the prestige of flying around in a gravship while your neighbours have to take clunky planes or choppers.

    The main point to remember is never upgrade an old unit to a prototype. The costs are horrendous as your bungling goons write off new computers, sport watches and other frivolous expenses off as part of the upgrade. Rather make an unit first so you know exactly what things cost before upgrading your old units.

    The thing to remember with prototype costs is that they only happen once. Even if each cities claims that they need more resources in reality after the first prototype rolls off the selves the others will complete things at normal costs. The lazy bums in your factory don't work all the time during the year. Rather they'll wait for the previous city to finish their production before deciding that you'll get mad at them for wasting time. So there's the unusual effect of cities having a sudden burst of work completed as the inspectors come along to compile their reports. That means cities will finish their productions in the same order as your F4 screen.

    You can take this into account by having a city high in your production lists build a "skunk works". Skunk works are facilities where they breed skunks and spray anyone that asks for more resources to build prototypes. So you don't have to pay prototype costs in that city. If you finish a prototype in that city the following cities can build that unit without paying prototype costs in the same turn.

    An interesting point is that a new prototype generally has a slightly better morale, as military units tend to take pride in having bleeding edge technology. However, that's a different story.

    With production of prototypes it is possible to cash a handy supply crawler in to ship extra minerals to pay for that prototype. Fortunately you don't lose any minerals by doing this and it can be a tactic to build up supply crawlers to suddenly build an army of any particular prototype in one turn.

    This makes sense as keeping an army that sits around is expensive and it's far better to have supply crawlers puttering around on standby for military construction. This is because if you increase your production capability with supply crawlers then that pays extra dividens to you. It works like complex interest, and the idiots that build large militaries which only sit around eating up supplies will quickly fall behind in their industrial development.


    Cheating the tax man. (Stockpile energy bug)

    The dreaded tax man eats away at your money costing you a small fortune. You can shoot them in the head, but they're rich enough to afford clinical immortality and coming back to haunt you.

    Introducing Negative Gearing (*cough* known in the game as stockpile energy bug)!

    Negative Gearing is when you put stockpile energy in the production queue after each production item. Production is meant to go into the energy grid and you are paid in tax rebates for doing that. However, Negative Gearing is when you only pretend to put production potential into the energy grid. Due to a loophole in our wonderful tax system when the tax man sees you will finish a production and that you plan on stockpiling energy into the grid he will credit you as if you had stockpiled energy for that entire turn.

    That's right they pay you as if you're actually adding all your production energy into the grid when really you've lost nothing at all. Your minerals still queue up and finish production, and after your production completes the stockpile comes up in your records. You get paid as if all of that turn's production went into stockpile (including the minerals that were already used to finish your previous production) and after the tax inspector leaves you switch production to another production item regaining any minerals that were carried over.

    Of course you further abuse the system by planning your industrial production to have as much of your production also stockpiling as possible. So a few rush buys here and there to increase the number of times your productions completes, and rehoming some crawlers so that minerals tend to go to cities that are finishing their production further adding the effect of the negative gearing.

    Buy low, sell high! (Resource Reallocation)

    Sometimes you just HAVE to have that production finished to meet an important deadline. For example what if your friendly neighbour Believer came around to collect an outstanding debt. You don't quite have what you owe, but if you can finish an alternative present you won't have to worry about paying off that debt.

    We have a guest speaker Dr JohnMuller who is an construction industry expert, professional business consultant, part time referee and at the under 12's soccer club and writer of the book One hundred and one ways to exploit government rebates..

    Interviewer: So in your opinion how can you stay thrifty while speeding up a new production that is under the 10 mineral?

    Dr JohnMuller: One can save some money by switching to a facility before adding the mins - and paying 4 ec apiece instead of at least 5 apiece - and then switching back to the desired build afterward; since you are only building up to the 10 min level, the subsequent switchback is free. I feel like I'm ……

    Interviewer: We'll be right back after this commercial break…...

    Dr JohnMuller: I feel like I'm exploiting an imperfection in the government rebate system whenever I do this, so I often forego this possibility, or try to preclude it by rushing an appropriate carry-forward the prior turn to have at least completed the minimum build amount and not be in this situation in the first place. Once in a very great while, when I have money to burn and/or a burning desire to get the item built, I might rush beyond the 10 min cutoff, paying the half-the-excess-over-ten switchback cost for an effective cost of about 6 ec per min (or even an initial switching too, if I was desperate and/or rich enough).

    Interviewer: We'll be right back after this commercial break…...

    Dr JohnMuller: When I have a high-min-production base and am producing nearly, but not quite enough mins to finish ……

    Interviewer: And that's all we have time for.

    Unfortunately we underestimated the amount of film we needed while taking that interview, 30 seconds wasn't enough.

    Another question that should be asked is whether you can gather extra resources to speed up that important production? Sometimes the answer isn't to rush buy the minerals directly, but to either transport more minerals in or reallocate workers to harvest more minerals. An nearby supply crawler from another base may be working on a less than critical production, for example your ex-mother-in-law's house. You can rehome that supply crawler and use it to redirect those minerals to something important.

    Also a common practise during the Victorian era of Britain was to sacrifice food to gain a higher production. It's okay if people go hungry as long as they don't actually die. Starving people to death should be avoided due to workers stopping work in protest. That means workers that were previously harvesting food could be put to slave labour on a mine if you really need a production completed. Or a food supply crawler might have had one of your goons issue orders to start transporting minerals from a mine. After you have successfully completed that important production you can sacrifice the scrape goat to the lynch mob.

    Investments in the transport industry? (Crawler upgrading verus crawler rushing)

    There's a new buzz word on the street called "crawler upgrading" (Okay it's actually a buzz phrase). Basically the idea is to upgrade a crawler then trade it in for an expensive Nuclear Missile or Secret Project.

    Secret projects at the best of times cost 4 ECs per mineral sometimes more (see nethog's pricing analysis) so directly pouring money in is expensive. However, there are many countries out there like the old soviet countries with an over abundance of nuclear missile parts and old secret projects that had their funding dry up. By upgrading a supply crawler to contain food and clean water you can trade it in for a kick start to your nuclear missile or secret project.

    There's a catch though and this isn't the moral issues of over pricing your food and water when you trade it to a poor soviet country. No the catch is the cost of upgrading the supply crawler varies.

    During the early years that you are setting up your empire that is secretly bent on world domination (yes I believe you when you say you only have peaceful intentions and will stay on the small strip of land you started out with). The cost to upgrade supply crawlers on an EC per mineral basis is higher. That's because you don't have improvements like trance and clean and high level armour to give that supply crawler (which is really just a food container) a novelty factor. When buyers look at an supply crawler they only judge it on it's exterior armour and the features list. If you can make a clean supply crawler it can make the price when you trade it skyrocket, nevermind making a clean supply crawler doesn't make the supply inside any better. However, during the early years you usually haven't figured out how to put on the bells and whistles, so you can't cheat the those poor soviet countries as much as you would like to.

    Furthermore your own industry rating changes the cost effectiveness, since the supply crawler upgraders are outsourced to a third party. Never mind that because of your industry rating the supply crawlers require less minerals to build. Since it's outsourced they charge everyone the same amount.

    Consequently, if your faction has a good industry rating it will be better to spend your money rushing multiple crawlers than upgrading crawlers. A recent study conducted on two successful industrial companies known as Drones and Hive, both with high industry rating found that careful investment of money during the construction of supply crawlers netted significantly higher returns. The money spent on rushing was about 2.3 ECs per mineral, while the cost of upgrading during the first 50 years was 3 to 2 ECs per mineral. While crawler rushing was 2.3 ECs per mineral the cost effective turn around point for crawlering upgrading was actually around 1.7 ECs per mineral with good management of supply crawler rush buying. This is was due to a combination of increased stockpile due to the more frequent build completions and the crawlers being produced contributing to the harvesting of more minerals. With mediocre management the turn around point was 2 ECs per mineral for crawler upgrading.

    Ofcourse in the later game as the upgrade costs drop it will be more efficient to upgrade. If you manage to build the Nanfactory which halves upgrade costs then there's no question what the best solution is.

    The EC Paradigm

    Making the most of your credits is really about investing it. Credits don't gain interest in the bank, unless you happen to be on an planet called Earth. There is a lobby to reduce the 100% Chiron bank interest tax, but in the meantime the best place for your credits is invested back in your cities.

    The earlier you can invest your credits the sooner it can start working for you. The real question is where to spend it and that involves a complex formula of whether you need to save up credits for a war, whether you're currently working on a secret project, whether you're building military, or trying to increase either your economic, labs or mineral output, how many vices you have, and how much you lost at the last mindworm cup.

  • #2
    There are a couple of occasions where I might rush buy some mins while within the 1st 10 (double cost) mins penalty area.

    - 1 - When I have a low-min-production - probably new - base, and I want to get it up to the 10 min level so I can engage in some serious rushing on the next turn.
    {One can save some money by switching to a facility before adding the mins - and paying 4 ec apiece instead of at least 5 apiece - and then switching back to the desired build afterward; since you are only building up to the 10 min level, the subsequent switchback is free. I feel like I'm exploiting an imperfection in the game whenever I do this, so I often forego this possibility, or try to preclude it by rushing an appropriate carry-forward the prior turn to have at least completed the minimum build amount and not be in this situation in the first place. Once in a very great while, when I have money to burn and/or a burning desire to get the item built, I might rush beyond the 10 min cutoff, paying the half-the-excess-over-ten switchback cost for an effective cost of about 6 ec per min (or even an initial switching too, if I was desperate and/or rich enough).}

    - 2 - When I have a high-min-production base and am producing nearly, but not quite enough mins to finish the build in the first turn; in this case, if I did nothing, it would finish the build the next turn, but waste a lot of mins due to the 10 min carry-forward limitation. Thus, even though I was paying double for a couple or three mins, I could still be getting a good deal (and get the build a turn earlier too).

    Comment


    • #3
      Yup, good points too.

      Hrmm I didn't realise it would get so long....
      Still got another two sections to write.

      Comment


      • #4
        Both interesting and useful though. Keep it up.
        I'm building a wagon! On some other part of the internets, obviously (but not that other site).

        Comment


        • #5
          Yes, do please continue, Kody. I'm looking forward to reading the finished work.
          Who is Barinthus?

          Comment


          • #6
            Bah it's got severals gaps in it, but I really don't care anymore.

            Comment


            • #7
              Dr Kody's work will be a requirement for all those are interested in government work at the Hive.
              Be good, and if at first you don't succeed, perhaps failure will be back in fashion soon. -- teh Spamski

              Grapefruit Garden

              Comment


              • #8
                It´s great, I love it !!!
                Especially the style it´s written in... That way even the anti-numbercrunchers will like to learn about SMAC-production economics

                Dr. Kody, please continue this most appreciated work!
                Heinrich, King of Germany, Duke of Saxony in Cyclotron's amazing Holy Roman Empire NES
                Let me eat your yummy brain!
                "be like Micha!" - Cyclotron

                Comment


                • #9
                  Just to fill in one gap:

                  The cost for Secret Projects is normally 4 credits per mineral. This is subject to the usual doubling if you have less than 10 minerals in the box. SPs are also subject to one more rule: double the cost (again) if you have less than four rows of minerals in the box. That cutoff depends on your Industry rating: 40 shields normally, 36 if you have +1 Industry, and so on.

                  So if you have less than 10 minerals in the box, an SP will cost 16 credits per mineral. I'm not aware of any scenario in which it gets up to 32.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    *nods*

                    I just checked nethog's rush buying sheet, it says 16 ECs per mineral too. I've never really memorised that cost as I don't ever see myself rushing an SP for that rate.

                    Here's the paste from the sheet, which agrees with you.
                    Energy Costs for Rush Building Secret Projects:
                    •4 energy per remaining mineral if at least 4 rows of minerals have been accumulated.
                    •8 energy per remaining mineral if less than 4 rows of minerals, but 10 or greater minerals have been accumulated.
                    •16 energy per remaining mineral if less then 10 minerals have been accumulated.

                    As for the new style, whenever I wrote long explaination posts it only seemed to get read by people that were already aware of the details. Also I was tried of fully technical explanations.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I am on a mission to see how much coffee it takes to actually achieve time travel.

                      Comment


                      • #12


                        This has already helped improve my gaming.
                        I'm building a wagon! On some other part of the internets, obviously (but not that other site).

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Very cool.
                          No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Kody. I'm not gay, but I love you

                            -Jam
                            1) The crappy metaspam is an affront to the true manner of the artform. - Dauphin
                            That's like trying to overninja a ninja when you aren't a mammal. CAN'T BE DONE. - Kassi on doublecrossing Ljube-ljcvetko
                            Check out the ALL NEW Galactic Overlord Website for v2.0 and the Napoleonic Overlord Website or even the Galactic Captians Website Thanks Geocities!
                            Taht 'ventisular link be woo to clyck.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Excellent Work Kody.

                              I wondered if you have any comparative industrial cost figures ( ecs per min) for crawler building v upgrades for industrially challenged factions. Such as the Cult or Spartans. Would the same general principles apply.

                              Edit: Just re read it. So if poor industry rating its better to upgrade.
                              On the ISDG 2012 team at the heart of CiviLIZation

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