Another odd game

[RedFred]

I rarely play either Progenitor faction, but Marr came up the other day in a random faction game and what with Basil's thread I decided to give them another whirl.

The odd thing is that I am not always getting my free recycling tanks when I plant a new city. Sometimes I'll get something else. For example I've gotten a rec commons in one city and a net node in another.

I kind of like the uncertainty of it all so I am continuing to play. I know from other threads that people have gotten the wrong improvement in each city from an SP, but I haven't heard of this particular bug.

What about strategy? I've had a look at Velociryx's strat guide, but it doesn't seem to go into great depth. We have had great discussions here on every human faction, but I haven't seen too much on the aliens. Does anyone have some thoughts on this?

I'm still trying to get my mind around the unusual way income is calculated. An improvement with zero upkeep cost like the Thermocline Transducer actually makes you money in addition to the extra energy. I'm not exactly sure how the 50% econ bonus for an Energy Grid works for aliens, but I just built the PEG SP and it sure did something, big time.

[kt_butts]

I have similiar questions concerning the energy grid. Are SP generated base facilities counted when determining the Energy Grid? For example, if Marr builds both the Command Nexus and the Cloudbase Academy, does he get +1 Energy at each base for the facilities as well as the +5 for the two SP's?

[mark13]

I'm pretty certain the PEG only gives bonuses for those facilities that were actually built. If you have 2 facilities of the same type, however, the PEG will take one into account, as that was actually built. I'm not certain about this, however.

[kt_butts]

I started a SP Marr game just to check it out. His advantages are ridiculous. He begins the game with a massive turn advantage. The automatic Rec Tanks and the instantly available formers, get production off to a huge start. Also, with the extra colony pod, a Special Project can begin ASAP without hampering early expansion. The Ogre allows for early rushes on neighbors. He starts with a significant tech advantage. To top things off, his Miriam-esque attack bonus (not just in air combat as the datalinks state) makes him a terror. In short, I think it's hard to screw up with him.
The only downside of playing as an Alien is that you are begging to be nerve-gassed. As such, Marr cannot play builder. If he lets human faction get close to him, he is extemely vulnerable. The easy solution to this is needlejet interceptors, and lots of them. A couple kept on alert in each city will prevent any x-njet penetrators for doing much damage, and a constant patrol of the surounding "hinterlands" will prevent any ground or sea forces from getting close.

[Alinestra Covelia]

What defences can you install against Choppers? Do they suffer when you have an aerospace complex?

[WhiteElephants]

I know you can add AAA, and put down a sensor, as well as an areospace complex. I wonder if tychon fields add to air defense? I know that perimeter defenses don't help agains the air attack. If you have SMAX you can build a flechette defense system, which I believe, also adds to air defense. There is also that ability in SMAX that negates any ability of the attacker. From what I understand X-penetrators are nearly unstoppable in SMAC, but don't quote me.

[WhiteElephants]

I think kt means x-gas does NOT effect mindworms.

[kt_butts]

All of those things help defending against air (inluding chopper) attacks. However, when dealing with nerve gas the trick is to eliminate any chance of attack. Never let an enemy base within 12 squares of your territory. If you zealously patrol your borders, you should be able to detect an attack.
Also, keep mindworms in your cities. Nerve gas does effect them or do damage to your population if they are killed.

[kt_butts]

All of those things help defending against air (inluding chopper) attacks. However, when dealing with nerve gas the trick is to eliminate any chance of attack. Never let an enemy base within 12 squares of your territory. If you zealously patrol your borders, you should be able to detect an attack.
Also, keep mindworms in your cities. Nerve gas does effect them or do damage to your population if they are killed.

[RedFred]

Nerve gas? I've always been pretty lucky in SP. I've played a ton of games and in games that I have not used gas, I have only been gassed once.

I'm finding that the marine control feature is even more important than before. All those sea colony pods are juicy targets when I take over a human sea city.

Has anyone been able to figure out the energy calc for aliens?

[Dry]

I don't think I saw more 10 AI choppers (other than the <1>-1-8) in all my SP games.
But I well saw a stack of 32 hive's needlejets in my last game (it was some 10 turns after I bought the city with the stack of 12).

[Misotu]

Generally speaking, if you use interceptors to defend against nerve gas jets, you are dead meat (assuming tech parity). A missile xjet will mince a missile interceptor in a base - and take half your population with it. Actually, IIRC, my high-morale impact xjets weren't losing many battles against defending missile interceptors.

To defend against nerve gas, you have two options: empty your bases of troops if your enemy doesn't have drop capability and you can prevent land/sea units from taking the empty base. Alternatively build sentries with best armour/AAA and combine them with aerospace, creche and sensor. Perimeters do not help, but tachyons do.

Ran a test in the scenario editor, just to get the stats. The attacked base had aerospace, sensor, tachyon and creche. Armour and weapons were set to one in all cases.

The 1-<1>-1 sentry received the following boosts:
Tach: 100%
Aerospace: 100%
Sensor: 25%
AAA: 100%
Creche: +

The 1-<1>-10 interceptor received the following boosts:
Creche: +

Once you equip the attacking jet with nerve gas, the interceptor doesn't stand a chance. Even if it does manage to hold on by the skin of its teeth, a second air attack will certainly finish it with horrible consequences for the base.

The AAA sentry, however, will do a sterling job even with relatively poor armour.

It's true that mind worms negate the effects of gas, but they're not particularly strong defenders and they're pretty expensive.

I don't much like nerve gas, but in MP it's often necessary to use it. If it gets to that point, I always head straight for the bases with interceptors stationed in them, for an easy kill.

On the question of range, 12 squares may be enough against the AI, but not against a human player. I will quite happily send my jets out on a one-way trip to halve your base size - so my jets start with a range of 20 squares and this increases with reactor level

[Misotu]

quote: Originally posted by Alinestra Covelia on 09-21-2000 09:54 PM What defences can you install against Choppers? Do they suffer when you have an aerospace complex?

Yes. The defensive bonuses from aerospace/sensor/tachyon etc are the same against choppers and jets.

[Mech Assassin]

How about GravShips? Do you recieve same bonuses against them? When you get them, you are going to kick some ass...

[WhiteElephants]

I have been under the impression that MP games don't last long enough to get to grav ships and the like...