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**DilithiumDad** · July 15, 2000, 20:23

Tech Share Challenge: Game 1

Gaians on Large Realistic Map from Apolyton vault. Landed near Manifold Nexus, but Miriam is directly to the south and Lal is in Monsoon Jungle with a landbridge connection caused by an earthquake. Keep Miriam stoked with tech, give her tech whenever she demands it, and she is "seething" but does not attack (I have my border bases well-garrisoned, which helps). Miriam gets Command Nexus and Lal gets Weather Paradigm and Hunter-Seeker. I make some settlements over on the Garland Crater continent, which is unoccupied. Finally, I make sure they are updated to my current tech (8-4-12*2) and attack both the Believers and the Peacekeepers on the same turn (in other words, everything you're not supposed to do!). Take 3 bases from each of them the first turn and then 1-2 bases a turn from both of them in the ext 5 turns. Captue all their SP's and amass enough votes to achieve Supreme Leader with the help of pactmates Morgan and Santiago in 2238.

Verdict: Still too easy! The AI gets very mellow when you keep giving them all your tech. Might have to choose the "more Aggressive" option.

(It goes with out saying that this was on Transcend level, naturally!)

**DilithiumDad** · July 15, 2000, 20:34

Tech Share Challenge: Game 2

U of P on Huge Random, Abundant Native, Dense Clouds, Average Erosive (all of which favors the AI).

No landmarks at very fungusy start site, but later found the manifold Nexus on an isolated island. Found myself completely surrounded by the Peacekeepers. Built the Empath Guild and spread my tech around the planet. Just as I was about to attack the Peacekeepers with my early missle needlejets, they offered me a pact to attack the Believers. Well, I figured, if we have a pact and they were sharing their tech with me (except for those with SP's attached, of course), then wasn't that just as good as a submissive pact? Yang was beating up Morgan, so I intervened and made Yang my submissive and Morgan very grateful. I let Santiago beat up on Lal and take a few of his bases to keep him small. Miriam went wild with all the weapons tech I gave her and started beating on everyone else, especially Santiago and Deirdre.
Miriam was on the opposite end of the planet (which is odd --usually the university and believers are seeded next to each other) so it wasn't until late in the game that I was able to reach her with Hovertanks and Locusts of Chiron. By then all I had to do was bribe Morgan to support me for Supreme Leader with help from submissive pactmates Yang and Santiago.

Conclusion: a little tougher. One thing I found was that I was getting tech back sometimes in trade, which accelerates the climb up the tech tree relative to my usualy stingy tactics. Also, probe actions are much more significant because your opponents will actually have soemthing to steal once in a while.

**Googlie** · July 17, 2000, 00:21

Took up the challenge as the believers, and am I ever getting my a$$ kicked.

Only saving grace is that I am so "pathetic" that I have garnered the sympathy of the women, and am pacted with both Deirdre and Santiago (who have been intermittently at vendetta against each other, but whom I persuade to kiss and make up from time to time).

So I beg or buy techs from one and then trade with the other, since they don't talk to each other.

I'm in vendetta with everyone else, as are Dee and Corazon.

Hive is #1, with Marr at #2.

Dee is keeping Yang occupied, and Santiago is fighting a fabulas battle of give & take with Marr.

I lost NJ to Cha early on, but scrapped for it back, and now am steadily overrunning his small continent.

One interesting feature.

The AI does use aircraft interdiction - before i begged for airpower from Sparta, Cha was putting troops right up against my base, with air cover - of course I couldn't attack, so just had to sit and take the defense damage. That's how I lost NJ.

Don't have a single SP to my name.

What a great game.

(Oh, I changed alphax.txt to make crawlers contiongent on SuperLubes, and copters on Quantum Machinery, and have reached neither yet. definitely makes the AI stronger - I recommend it to anyone to try an SP game that way )

Googlie

**Ogie Oglethorpe** · July 17, 2000, 10:12

Awhile ago someone posted modifying faction txt files to include the free ability "clean reactors" to the AI upon discovery of requisite tech. My thinking is incorporate this into the challenge as well and the AI will then no longer be hindered by over unit production as it normally does.

Thoughts?

**DilithiumDad** · July 17, 2000, 15:32

There are lots of hacks into alpha.txt that can rebalance the game. What I am talking about is something simple that can be done within a normal game to make it more challenging and more like multiplayer.

It's very simple: you are not allowed to have a tech advantage, except for during vendettas and sunspots. Add to that the prohibition against using the 'copter chassis and the banning of certain Secret Projects and voila --a more challening and enjoyable experience.

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Creator of the Ultimate Builder Map, based on the Huge Map of Planet

**DilithiumDad** · July 19, 2000, 15:47

Tech Share Callenge: Game 3

I thought that playing as the Believers would lend itself well to this challenge, since you'll have less tech to have to share. Also, playing a huge map (late contact, no tech to trade for or steal) with abundant native life would be especially tough. Boy was I wrong! It ended up being one of my earliest diplomatic victories (2224).

Landed near the south polar region with no nearby neighbors and no landmarks, other than a mountain that later proved valuable as an energy park. First 25 years were spent making scouts and colony pods, then after finally discovering Centauri Ecology, the next 20 years were spent building terraformers. Got Deirdre's commlink from a pod. She had been eradicated by worms (!) and restarted to my east. Turned out that The Ruins lay in between us. Lal was north sitting pretty with a rainy and fertile Uranium Flats. Morgan was still farther north on the same landmass with no landmark. Santiago was west. Zach and Yang were on a separate land mass to the northeast.

Built up the usual recon/impact rover rush with some 1-2t-2 and 1-3t-2 units for defensive cover and sent them on a tour of The Ruins to gain quick combat experience. A brief Green period allowed cpature of several of the beasties before Deirdre made it part of her territory. I was just about to sent my horde against Lal when he offered me a pact to fight Santiago. I figured a pact with freee tech sharing was almost as good as a submissive pact, so I veered west to Santiago. I surrounded Sparta Command and Santiago surrendered without my capturing a single base! I turned my forces for the long march to Peacekeeper territory. Just then I discovered Air Power and Silksteel, which I of course shared with all factions, including the PK's. I gave all my tech to Lal and then attacked on the next turn, which seemed to take him by surprise. His AAA Silksteel garrisons gave my chaos needlejets trouble at first, until I shifted back to Power values. A few sucide attacks were required, but I quickly took 5 huge well-developed PK bases and he surrendered. A bribe for Morgan sealed the vote for Supreme Leader with help from my submissives.

Conclusion: Tech Share rules do make things more challenging, but sometimes quick victory presents itself despite all the odds. There seems to be two types of seeding on random maps. Either all factions get a landmark or none of them do. In this game, Lal was the only one to get a landmark. Landmarks like Garfield Crater, Monsoon Jungle and Mt. Planet really help the AI because of their poor terraforming.

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Creator of the Ultimate Builder Map, based on the Huge Map of Planet

**joer** · July 26, 2000, 03:13

I started the Techshare challenge yesterday. I choose the Drones -- perhaps a little too easy -- with all random, all randomized AI factions. Ended up on a huge map of Planet, with /lots/ of fungus in my area. And ended up in a somewhat boring build&terraform-myself-to-death. I set up the rule for myself to not do any crawler-upgrades to finish SP's earlier, a technique I usually take big time advantage of.

Unfortunately, the game dropped me on a spot with absolutely /no/ AI around me. I started at the southeastern side of the Freshwater sea, and had the whole continent for myself. Since I didn't know about it, I did my usual rapid base expansion spaced 3 squares apart (usually). I slowed down around 15 or so bases, because new bases started automatically with one Drone already. I was nowhere near exploiting the confines of my area.

Since I didn't meet anybody, I had to do all the research myself, which is quite tedious for the Drones. In most cases, I didn't really knot what to build, so I just pumped out another pod or so. After the obligatory techs for formers, rec tanks and rec commons, I beelined for Ind. Auto, and soon went Demo+FM+Wealth. I stayed in that configuration most of the time, except during a few periods of Planned for pop booming. I got the WP and VW without much problems, but Morgan beat me out on HGP. After my first pop boom phase, I cranked out more colony pods, so I was around 18-20 bases near 2180.

The first AI contact was when I built the EG sometime around 2170, at which point I was just finishing up Eco. Engineering. I contacted the Spartans first, who were very eager to trade lots of their tech (mostly militairy and a bit research, vs. my builder tech), but they didn't want to make a treated.
Morgan agreed to a treaty, got one tech for me, but didn't want to share Optical Computers. Aki and Sven didn't want anything and we remained in truce, and I didn't bother to contact the pathetically weak aliens, who were apparently both stuck on a very small Island and didn't have the chance to expand. Aki had quite a few interesting techs, but didn't want to share. She didn't even want mine.

After that, I just built on and terraformed myself to death. Around 2197, I had over 50 formers and 20 land units. And I still produced more and more formers. Around 2210, I produced my first prototype -- a transport cruiser that has by now gotten a few probe teams to Aki. My first militairy prototype was a 1-3t-1 garrison in 2215. I am now in 2217, with around 25 bases, and out of my 140 units total 120 are civilian units, amng those over thirty crawlers and close to 70 formers. The crawlers go up and down a lot for finishing each SP I /can/ build within 1-2 turns.

So what about tech sharing? Most of the factions have been ignoring my contact ever since the first one. The CT at least talk to me and demand two techs every time I contact them...I might stop that. I am in Vendetta with everybody right now, and they demand outrageous amounts of money. However, it's not really a hot war, since we can't reach each other. Nobody bothers to invade my continent. And I have little incentive to wage a war on them, when I can grow bigger on my own.

My research has no chance to keep up with my building -- I am so frustrated and clueless what to build that most of my bases have got a biolab by now. Tech coming in 4-6 rounds. Drones are extremely powerful, but odd...

Aki will beat me with the Supercollider, but at least I will get Hybrid forests in 4 turns. Since nearly all of my bases have tree farms by now, I will at least have something to do. Even though micromanaging my crawler&former-army is a bit tiresome.

To be continued.
-joer.

**DilithiumDad** · July 27, 2000, 18:18

How are you sharing your tech?

You need to select "Allow me to offer you a token of my esteem". The select "Some of my tech." The only faction that doesn't accept, usually, is Miriam. If they don't accept, you should choose "Give you ALL my tech." This will usually make them magnanamous, even if they started out obstinate. But it won't last, so get a treaty right away.

You don't mention where your power graph is right now, but I'll bet you're two times your nearest competitor or more. Your tech advantage is contributing to that. You want to have completed tech share before your power bar is so high that everyone is declaring Vendetta.

I always have the "what to build" problem with the Drones. Network Node is a must, of course, and Biology Labs are +4 research if you have a Node and a Hospital, which is not bad for a maintenance cost of 1. Build a bunch of Empath Rovers and go fight worms for planet pearls.

I'd keep on making bases and just deal with the extra Drones with facilities and specialists.

Anywya, you need to be more aggressive about sharing tech right from first contact to do the Tech Share Challenge right.

**shimmin** · July 30, 2000, 15:59

The "aggressive" tech share bit seems a little bit ill-defined. To make the challenge harder (and more suitable for comparison games) why not run it this way?

The ONLY means by which you are allowed to acquire tech is through trade. (or if you play with Unity Pods, then of course you can get tech through them.)

**Aredhran** · July 30, 2000, 19:46

quote:

Originally posted by DilithiumDad on 07-19-2000 03:47 PM

Landmarks like Garfield Crater

LOL was that intentional ?

Looks like an interesting challenge, maybe I'll give it a shot.

Aredhran

**DilithiumDad** · August 1, 2000, 10:44

OK, here's some guidelines for "aggressive tech sharing":

1. You must give the AI any tech they demand.

2. If they will not buy your tech, you must gift it. If they won't accept single techs, do "all my tech".

3. Vendettas make things tougher. Sometimes you can give an enemy tech indirectly through a neutral faction. For example, I was fighting the Gaians and Cyborgs. They had pacts with each other and with the Drones, with whom I had a treaty. All the tech I sold the Drones showed up with the Gaians and Cyborgs the very next year. So, by keeping the Drones up to date, I was also funneling tech to my opponents. (I realize this is topsy-turvey from the normal strategy for winning, but that's the point). This gambit was so successful that the Gaian/Cyborg/Drone alliance got to Silksteel before me, and halted my advance cold with 1-<4>-1*2 garrisons (I only had 6r and then 8 attack).

If there is no other way to get tech to an enemy, you will have to agree for their demand for tech in exchange for a Truce even if you are winning the battle. Go ahead and give them all your tech, then provoke an renewed Venetta once the AI faction has had time to upgrade to the new tech.

**joer** · August 2, 2000, 06:16

One problem I had with giving the AI my tech was that, after meeting their initial demands and trying to trade my tech for any price, they kicked me out of the conversation and ignored any communication attempts afterwards. Once I got back in communication with them, I was already so far advanced in my infrastructure development that it had absolutely no impact whether they had equal weapons or not.

Often enough, they declared war outright with me, and in order to give them my tech, I'd have to also give them A LOT of money for a truce I didn't want. One pretty good example of such an absurdity was paying 400 energy units just to make truth with Morgan, give him Fusion power for 25 and declare vendetta on him the next turn. Oh well.

And, in the end, when you have a continent on your own and had enough time to expand before meeting them, they having equal weapons does not make a difference, since the AI is incapable of leading an effective cross-continental war.

My graph was already runaway at the time I built the EG, maybe two times as high as the next. By now, it's much much more than that, mostly due to my excessive population -- nearly all of my cities are maxed out.

I am not sure if I am going to continue this game (micromanaging crawlers and formers is a bit boring), but with or without tech share, I can't see anythign stopping me from transcending soon. And if I need an enemy city, I just by it up and don't bother digging through their defenses.

I can imagine tech share being -very- difficult with early enemies, but once you established yourself, the computer doesn't manage to pull his act together and find a good strategy to conquer you...at least that's the experience I had in this game.
-joer.

**Kinjiru** · August 2, 2000, 08:07

Just a thought, since the AI is not always inclided to accept your tech and since Vendettas are a problem, why not just alter the faction files so that every faction gains any tech that any other faction has discovered?

I must admit though, while this does make the game more challenging, it is not a great solution either. The essence of the MP game (besides the metagame) is the exploitation of small advantages, i.e. I may have a specific tech 2-4 turns before you, so how can I best make use of that situation. Total sharing of tech disallows this facet of the game.

But again, I understand what you are trying to achieve DilithiumDad and agree that total tech share can provide a greater challenge.

**DilithiumDad** · August 2, 2000, 10:45

Map and faction choice are also important. A predefined map like Map of Planet aids the AI. Random maps good for the AI are:

1. Dense clouds (less need for intelligent terraforming)

2. Average erosive forces (not too rocky, not too flat, plenty of rolling for minerals)

3. Abundant Native Life (the AI sees all and knows all, so they deal with natives much better than you)

4. Low ocean coverage (The AI can't deal with transports or expanding across oceans. The Pirates do OK with low ocean, since they favor coastal sea bases anyway.)

5. Large or Huge maps (Gives them room to expand and foils rover rush. Disadvantage is that you may be too strong at first contact.)

Faction choice: You want the strongest AI factions. Morgan is out, and so is Miriam. Cha Dawn is pathetic, even with abundant native life, and he will mostly attack the other AI factions and make things easier for you. Roze is not played well by the AI. Here are my top choices for strong opponents on the map described above:

1. Deirdre
2. Yang
3. Zacharov
4. Svensgaard
5. Domai
6. Aki-Zeta
7. Lal

The Aliens are very strong, of course, and tech share would make them even stronger. I personally just find it depressing to have to gas them all to death in order to get diplomatic or economic victory.

Your faction should be a weaker or more difficult one. Drones and University are probably too overpowered. Gaians are too strong with abundant native life. Good choices for a tough game are Believers, Spartans, Hive, Morgan, Data Angels, Cult or possibly Pirates.

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Creator of the Ultimate Builder Map, based on the Huge Map of Planet

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