2154: Pre-planning discussion and build/movement orders

[Googlie]

Some decisions to be made right off the bat when we open the turn:

1) Next base site:

Should we proceed with the Hernes & cargo to the 2-nut site (Base established in 2155) or take 1 turn longer to settle on the Manifold Nexus (2156)

Threat Evaluation:

The Uni have no colony pods in transit nor in production

The Hive has no colony pods homed to their nearest bases to us, but does have one on the prowl homed to Great Collective

The Peacekeepers have 2 clony pods on the loose, but one is homed to their easternmost base, while the other is homed to thweir southernmost base

I reckon the Hive encroachment to be slightly more of a problem (although IMO not huge right now) whereas the Nexus site doesn't seem to be in any danger of getting filled any time soon.

So on balance, I favor the original plan of settling between the 2 nut tiles on the coast south of the Great Fungal Wall

2) Pod Popping

after switching to a speeder crawler in both Rio Grande and SC3, I suggest we let the Hunter pop both those pods off the Morgan coastline (or just the first, if we do get a minerals completion goody again)

And as a rule of thumb, if we encounter a seapod with one of our 2 foils, and it has at least 3 mp's left, I suggest changing the nearest base production to a speeder crawler and popping the pod (so long as it's attacking from the seaward side, as any IOD's will make for the nearest land)

[Googlie]

Then there's the question: "Do we accept Zak's surrender after we capture Okt-Dis?"

As Maniac says - we only get one kick at the cat, so if we do, we're forfeiting MonStat (unless we bully him into transferring control)

but as M also displays, we can plonk a base closeby that will get use of both those boreholes (and it'll be mega-minerals and mega-energy!!)

(As an aside, if we do capture Okt_Dis, and Zak calls, what happens if we refuse to take his call, and go on to capture Mon Stat. Will he then call again and offer surrender?)

And as another aside, in ten simulation runs, our longstrider destroyed the perim defense in 8 (but was lost in 4, including both the unsuccessful ones)

[Modo44]

Re: 2154: Pre-planning discussion and build/movement orders

Originally posted by Googlie
1) Next base site:

Should we proceed with the Hernes & cargo to the 2-nut site (Base established in 2155) or take 1 turn longer to settle on the Manifold Nexus (2156)

Would we be able to capture Worms, if we had the Manifold Nexus? Are we allowed to make a cash factory out of them? If yes, let's settle in the Manigfold Nexus. Otherwise, let's keep Yang from expanding, by settling near his curent border.


I'd accept Zak's surrender, but only with Monitoring Station captured. It's within reach, and a very powerful base, so we should get it.

[Kassiopeia]

(As an aside, if we do capture Okt_Dis, and Zak calls, what happens if we refuse to take his call, and go on to capture Mon Stat. Will he then call again and offer surrender?)

He will give the usual "I won't give up no matter what you say" speech, the same he'd give after refusing an offer of submission, which leads me to believe that if he calls us after we take OktDis, it's then or never.

I'd accept Zak's surrender, but only with Monitoring Station captured. It's within reach, and a very powerful base, so we should get it.

I don't think it's worth the risk of prolonged military engagement. Our interests may shift quickly elsewhere. If we refuse submission once Zak offers it, we can't get it again. Then we'll have to go all the way through total conquest and annexation.

Of course, were we to take MonitStat before OtkDis, this could be arranged, but the current military plans we have can't really be adapted to that without endangering the whole operation.

[Modo44]

I don't understand one thing. Why are we so conservative with Monitoring Station? Yes, taking it by force will probably cause us to lose one or two Elite units. But this base can make Commando replacements in no time, or am I missing something? Same goes for it's potential to rebuild structures. If we're planning to end the war with Zak anyway, I think we should bite the bullet, and take the big prize. Or am I missing a detail that spoils the cake?

[Kassiopeia]

I don't think I'm being conservative. I just don't think the prize is worth a prolonged war, that is all. I'd bend over backwards to get us Monitoring Station if it still meant we wouldn't have to invest much in Arcadia. Every turn we spend at war with them is another turn we risk having a two-front war. Zak will be useful enough as a submissive pact mate.

I do think this discussion is premature, I have my doubts about Zak offering us submission right after OtkDis.

[Googlie]

Re: Re: 2154: Pre-planning discussion and build/movement orders

Originally posted by Modo44
Would we be able to capture Worms, if we had the Manifold Nexus?

Yes - we'd move to a +1 Planet rating

[Kassiopeia]

Damn, got to love those bonuses. The "Breakthroughs: 84 turns" part makes me feel a bit uneasy, being a Builder by nature and all, but since we're on "War mode" it's bearable... it's not like we actually do any research anyway!

[Googlie]

Hmm - Interesting

With the simulator I can capture Otk-Dis, whereupon Zak calls and offers surrender. I accept his submission, then tell him that he must turn over one of his bases to me - Mon Stat.

When he asks "And what do you offer" and I reply "Name your price", he says "160 ec's" (2/3rds of my reserves!!). I pay and the base is mine.

2nd iteration, when he asks, I say "Or I will cancel this pact" whereupon he says "It's your's - I never did want this worthless base"

So it's worth a try next turn after we take Otk-Dis.

Being an AI diplomacy test (next turn, that is) we should have someone parallel play that sequence to ensure that Zak does agree to transfer control of the base and that the asking doesn't screw up the submission

[Kassiopeia]

I have ready access to SMAX, and will most likely be awake and available when needed, so I can be the parallel player.

Zak submitting AND giving us MonitStation would be the best of both worlds, of course.

[Googlie]

I'll save the gameturn just before entering the empty base so that the test can be run from that point (The game can't be saved while the diplo window is open, unfortunately)

[Maniac]

Some micromanaging suggestions and observations thought of while looking at the turn:

The artifact and three elite hoplites & scout patrol could move out of VV to the eastern tip and board the SNC Mercury, waiting in (70.10). That way the transport will be back sooner in Arcadia University.

For formers Tomcat-OA1 and Tomcat-VV1 Googlie suggested before to let them plant a forest on (65.13). Seems useful to me.

Gythium Harbour needs to work the 3-1-0 tile in order not to shrink back to size 3. This means the SC2 worker will have to be relocated back to a 2-1-0 tile.

After capturing Otkrietia-Discovery we can rehome some troops.

We could:

Hurry Fort Buster crawler for 15 credits, if the base produces 15 mins after harvesting the rocky minerals mine.

Hurry SC1 Crypteia production with 1 mineral = 6 credits. Next year it will then have 10 minerals accumulated and it could be hurried further at a lower cost. This to speed up probe protection in Vladivostok.

Hurry OA crawler with 3 credits.

We’re swimming in credits. And due to the materials pod we now need less to upgrade crawlers and invest in the Citizen’s Defence Force. So if we wanted we could also hurry production in for example Argos, SC2 or SC3. Or do we want to save for future unit upgrades?

[Maniac]

Originally posted by Googlie
And as another aside, in ten simulation runs, our longstrider destroyed the perim defense in 8 (but was lost in 4, including both the unsuccessful ones)

If we aren't offered or don't accept submission next year, we could perhaps move AU's Crypteia south, in range of Monitoring Station. That way we'd have two shots to destroy the perimeter defence.

after switching to a speeder crawler in both Rio Grande and SC3, I suggest we let the Hunter pop both those pods off the Morgan coastline (or just the first, if we do get a minerals completion goody again)

I certainly agree with popping the nearest one. But the second one is on fungus. SCC Hunter's turn would be ended after moving onto it. So if we pop an IoD, we're toast. Wouldn't waiting a turn to pop that pod be safer?

And as a rule of thumb, if we encounter a seapod with one of our 2 foils, and it has at least 3 mp's left, I suggest changing the nearest base production to a speeder crawler and popping the pod (so long as it's attacking from the seaward side, as any IOD's will make for the nearest land)

For the record, IoDs going for the landside doesn't always seem to be the case. Earlier in the ACDG, the SCC Invincible was attacked by an IoD popped from a pod, while I moved seawards, despite their being land nearby. The reason was probably because there was a Peacekeeper base nearby.

[Googlie]

Originally posted by Kassiopeia
The "Breakthroughs: 84 turns" part makes me feel a bit uneasy, being a Builder by nature and all, but since we're on "War mode" it's bearable... it's not like we actually do any research anyway!

Ah - that's from the simulator, which I haven't updated re the research rate for a couple of turns.

The actual situation is worse!!

[Maniac]

Originally posted by Googlie


Ah - that's from the simulator, which I haven't updated re the research rate for a couple of turns.

The actual situation is worse!!