2136 End Turn and 2137 Discussion

[jtsisyoda]

Turn's here. I'll play it in maybe 12 hours.

[jtsisyoda]

Populations:

G: 11
H: 40
A: 7
M: 10
S: 10

No developments on other factions' tech progress.

CP's were rushed at Money V and Imp Pol, as planned. The one at Money V can take the northwest road. The one at Imp Pol was rushed as far as possible, to get a head start on minerals that will eventually go toard HGP. That CP can head west, to either just past Mor Ind, or toward the northwest pod.

RFR can rush a CP next turn (2137). That should head to the spot the Imp Pol CP doesn't take.

We can found a base in the east next turn. A) We may have to assign a doctor or two because of b-drones, or go with 20% psych again until HGP is built. B) That base has a scout in that square already. Should we build another with its free mins to fight off the MW? Our other scout is in position to defend Mor Vul next turn if needed.

We can start HGP (for real this time) in 2138 -- cash in six crawlers and spend about 36 ec's. (No problem since we're at 60/40 and making about 35 ec/turn, not including stockpile.) We can't do HGP next turn because it would take more like 52 ec's.

To address Mead's topic from last year, re: the lawyer down south... We could continue with our current slow probe, or build a new, fast one. If we did the latter, we could continue to use the slow one to block the chokepoint.

Edit: One more thing... I had Mor Vul start the VW. Maybe if Zak can be nudged once, he can be nudged again. There's a chance he'll switch to VW, since even the AI Zak likes to build VW. Mor Vul can switch back to a crawler next turn.

[jtsisyoda]

End-turn file...

[jtsisyoda]

I hope you guys don't mind... I'd like to go ahead and post the turn to maintain a good pace. There haven't been many turnplay suggestions after posting the mid/end-turn file. It would be preferable to make suggestions before we get the next turn anyway.

To facilitate that process, here's a summary of plans for next turn...

CP's go along roads.
Eastern CP founds base: Vander Eudaimonics. Analyze b-drones created. Go with either doctors or 20% psych (40/20/40), whichever nets the most resources for the faction (I suspect psych). Build scout or maybe former if the MW stays away.
Rush CP at RFR. Possibly rush crawler at Mor Ind if there's enough cash left after RFR.
Start crawlers at Money V and Imp Pol. (Imp Pol can switch to HGP the turn after that without penalty.)
Two formers in the west go north to continue the road.
Other western fomer goes SE to rainy flat-- build a road and farm to prevent forest from taking away that important two-nut square.
Most northwesterly (is that a word?) former goes two squares SW along the river and starts a road. (This will connect the two new base sites to each other and allow the former team to get to the min bonus quickly, to forest it.)

Almost forgot-- doctor at SSR next turn! (Unnecessary if psych creates a talent.)

[jtsisyoda]

FYI... I'll be unavailable for the next 48 hours.

[Whoha]

no complaints, noble leader.

[Mead]

Once we get formers in the area (it may be a little while until then), we should road the square between RFR and Impaler Polymers.


Mead

[arginine]

I guessed the hivecity's location based on the border.

Starting from the square with the hive synthemel garrison, go one square east,then 4 squares south. I am probably off by 1 square.

I would like to buy the closest Hive base if it provides a good chokepoint. Also, hive bases come with a free perimeter defense (a 100 EC value). In order to build perimeter defenses we will need Doctrine: Loyalty?

[arginine]

If we attack the MW w/ our good scout... Start 3 vs 2 We have -30% planet. We will get a +12% bonus bonus for being vet. The MW will prob get -10% lifecycle bonus. That will make it ~2.3 vs 1.8 . That is close, and I'd prefer it to attack base instead where we'd be assured a win.


I guess this is a future plan of sorts:

We will end up building 1 base in the SE and 3 bases in the NW because the SW and South have not been terraformed yet.

There are different ways we can go after we complete the HGP. We can crank out nothing but crawlers until we reach 10 crawlers, at which point we will be able to go for the PTS, if we are lucky, or the PEG soon. We have 2 crawlers right now.

We can build 2 def, 1 attack foils for 20 min.

[arginine]

By 2138 we will have 10 bases, the HGP ready next turn, 2 crawlers, and 2? near completion. 2 CPs will be ready or soon be ready. One of the CPs could go to the NW, but we don't know what to do with the other CP yet.

By 2140? 2141? We will have doc: flex. That will put us on course to get by 2153 (assuming 6 turns / tech) the tech for PEG.

If we build the foil and launch from about two bases west of Morgan Industries in 2141, I'd expect to meet the Uni or PK by 2146. Hopefully we will be able to trade for HE Chem and other important techs at that time.

We signed a blood truce back in 2121? They last from 15 to 20 years. I'd expect ours to end soon. I think it would be a good idea to stay out of Hive territory until we get the transport foil for insertion. Heck, it might be a good idea to lose contact with that Hive garrison soon.

1 base built in the vicinity of 2 squares west of Morgan Industries should be the last of the 3 cities built in the NW, as it will built about the time we get Doc: Flex. so we can build a foil immediately and send it west to discover the Uni/PKs. The soon to be east most base should build a foil when convenient to send east and find our neighbor (do we want to reach them quickly, or meet them in a way that they can't tell where we are from?). I suggest sending the foil to the west to the other coast, then head south until we have contact with both PKs & Uni. Then head east to other coast and move along it until we find the SW player. For the east foil, if there is a passage (like for us) between their continent and the middle, we can send the foil east between the straits, and then down along the coast to eventually reach the SE player.

We could also build a transport foil in RFR to quickly transport a CP onto the southern lands, and to move our armored probe deeper into Hive territory. The Hive can expel our armored probe team in their territory, or legally declare war. The transport will also be used to insert probe teams into enemy territory for infiltration (we might want to make a move 2 probe team for future infiltrations) We might want to hire out the services of another faction. Especially if the other faction has higher probe team rankings (angels?). Stealing lots of techs can cost quite a few probe teams.

Our top priority I guess will to be getting the 10 crawlers ASAP, unless someone beats us (as we expect) to the PTS.

1 transport will cost us one crawler. Both foils will be worth another crawler. Will we go for the transport and extra foil or the crawlers?

I think our strategy for the next ~15 years will be to get up to ~24 sized 1 cities (to maximize our faction energy bonus and the HGP) and crank out crawlers with our unallocated production. Some of the cities will be pop boomed, and others relocated to make room. Ideally, we will get plasma armor and impactor weapons from uni and/or peacekeepers in preparation for the inevitable war with the Hive. We will have to work on developing a defense force and a few military cities (I would like to get the command Nexus to screw the spartans, and prevent us from building a few command centers ourselves).

We should determine which cities will eventually be popboomed, and which will be sh*t cities. I think that Impaler Polymers and Money Valley could be designated sh*t cities, and all the other cities up now could pop boom.

Defending the chokepoint: Ideally the city will have a comm center for instant troop healing, a perimeter defense for the 100% def bonus, a sensor array within range, ~3 HE chem garisons, no connecting roads on the enemy side and maybe 2 ships to act as artillery.

[Mead]

Originally posted by arginine
If we attack the MW w/ our good scout... Start 3 vs 2 We have -30% planet. We will get a +12% bonus bonus for being vet. The MW will prob get -10% lifecycle bonus. That will make it ~2.3 vs 1.8 . That is close, and I'd prefer it to attack base instead where we'd be assured a win.

We'll be able to see the odds before we attack.

***

There are different ways we can go after we complete the HGP. We can crank out nothing but crawlers until we reach 10 crawlers, at which point we will be able to go for the PTS, if we are lucky, or the PEG soon. We have 2 crawlers right now.

Let's go for the PTS, if we can get it. If we lose out on it I don't mind getting the WP.

We can build 2 def, 1 attack foils for 20 min.

I'm not sure we want to spend any effort on foil production (except, of course, probe foils) until we have to. With Free Market, as soon non-probe foils leave our territory they will cause us some serious drone issues. Plus I am not sure what they will do for use, and they will consume support.


Mead

[Mead]

Originally posted by arginine
By 2138 we will have 10 bases, the HGP ready next turn, 2 crawlers, and 2? near completion. 2 CPs will be ready or soon be ready. One of the CPs could go to the NW, but we don't know what to do with the other CP yet.

By 2140? 2141? We will have doc: flex. That will put us on course to get by 2153 (assuming 6 turns / tech) the tech for PEG.

If we build the foil and launch from about two bases west of Morgan Industries in 2141, I'd expect to meet the Uni or PK by 2146. Hopefully we will be able to trade for HE Chem and other important techs at that time.

We signed a blood truce back in 2121? They last from 15 to 20 years. I'd expect ours to end soon. I think it would be a good idea to stay out of Hive territory until we get the transport foil for insertion. Heck, it might be a good idea to lose contact with that Hive garrison soon.

We need to park an armoured probe in the fungus near the choke point, or better yet, send two units to blockade the chock point with zones of control.

1 base built in the vicinity of 2 squares west of Morgan Industries should be the last of the 3 cities built in the NW, as it will built about the time we get Doc: Flex. so we can build a foil immediately and send it west to discover the Uni/PKs. The soon to be east most base should build a foil when convenient to send east and find our neighbor (do we want to reach them quickly, or meet them in a way that they can't tell where we are from?).

Does the AI figure out where you are from where they spot the contact?

I suggest sending the foil to the west to the other coast, then head south until we have contact with both PKs & Uni.

I assume you mean that we will not infiltrate them? (which would send our foil home)

Then head east to other coast and move along it until we find the SW player. For the east foil, if there is a passage (like for us) between their continent and the middle, we can send the foil east between the straits, and then down along the coast to eventually reach the SE player.

Now the human players are folks who I would like to mislead as to our location. Meeting them would be good however. Although realize with the rule we are playing under, no cooperative victory allowed, we will need to be very careful with dealing with the other human teams.

We could also build a transport foil in RFR to quickly transport a CP onto the southern lands, and to move our armored probe deeper into Hive territory. The Hive can expel our armored probe team in their territory, or legally declare war. The transport will also be used to insert probe teams into enemy territory for infiltration (we might want to make a move 2 probe team for future infiltrations) We might want to hire out the services of another faction. Especially if the other faction has higher probe team rankings (angels?). Stealing lots of techs can cost quite a few probe teams.

I'm not sure about the transport just yet. For the near term future, I would prefer to use our production capabilty for other things (crawlers for SPs and other mineral production, probe foils, formers, CPs, and regular probes).

Our top priority I guess will to be getting the 10 crawlers ASAP, unless someone beats us (as we expect) to the PTS.

1 transport will cost us one crawler. Both foils will be worth another crawler. Will we go for the transport and extra foil or the crawlers?

I think our strategy for the next ~15 years will be to get up to ~24 sized 1 cities (to maximize our faction energy bonus and the HGP) and crank out crawlers with our unallocated production.

If we get the PTS we won't have many 1 pop cities.

Some of the cities will be pop boomed, and others relocated to make room. Ideally, we will get plasma armor and impactor weapons from uni and/or peacekeepers in preparation for the inevitable war with the Hive. We will have to work on developing a defense force and a few military cities (I would like to get the command Nexus to screw the spartans, and prevent us from building a few command centers ourselves).

We should determine which cities will eventually be popboomed, and which will be sh*t cities. I think that Impaler Polymers and Money Valley could be designated sh*t cities, and all the other cities up now could pop boom.

Defending the chokepoint: Ideally the city will have a comm center for instant troop healing, a perimeter defense for the 100% def bonus, a sensor array within range, ~3 HE chem garisons, no connecting roads on the enemy side and maybe 2 ships to act as artillery.

Why do we want ships as artillery for the city? Aren't infantry ones cheaper, and more defensible in a city (no penalty for being in port.)


Arginene you are putting forth some good analysis of where we should be going. Let me know if we are missing anything.



Mead


PS

I wonder what the pleasant surprise the Gainas were talking about in the 'turn' thread is.

[arginine]

Keep in mind I assume we get the HGP. Since SPs happiness effects are calculated after pacificism, with the HGP each size 1 base is effectively immune to drone roits, including overseas military units.

I figure the Gaians go WP and the angels go PTS. It could go vice versa, but who knows. The angels will definately have more crawlers after we get HGP, and the gaians will prob be on par with us.

By foil, I mean a cheapo 2 row 1 attack 2 def foil. Probe foils are 5 min rows, I want contact to get some trades and commerce.

By lose contact with the Hive, I am assuming their garrison is leaving our territory, and we merely leave our defense team in place. At the worst we back our unit up one. We'll still retain our guard of the area.

A transport from RFR will serve to ferry the 5th CP to the south to start a base, bypassing the fungus. With the new base up with garrison, our armored defense team will be transported next to the Hive base, maybe with another unit to prevent expulsion from Hive territory and infiltrate the base. Hopefully the base will be small, and the probe team survives, and is transported again to the base for a buyout (if it's cheap). New base hopefully becomes are garrison chokepoint, and war with the Hive will officially begins. The buyout will hopefully occur after we have traded for HE chem.

I think an unarmored impact ship will cost 3 rows. Impact artillery will cost 2 rows. The base will hopefully be coastal and thus the surrounding areas will be in range of our ship's guns. I think our early defense strategy will be defs against MW, a good chokepoint defs against the Hive, and a moderate navy against other humans.

Size 3 cities would be preferable, but I don't expect us to get the PTS due to competition. It would be nice.

By sending a foil by a human, they could guess where it came from. We could spend the time to move the foil into a different place, and have it pass the human coming from a direction they will think is not ours. We don't know how long until other human ships reach us.

I wonder what the gaian's surprise is myself. It might be psycological warfare. It might be grabbing the first project, but that'd cost them some money...