Long-term Plan of Action

[Chaos Theory]

Here is where we must discuss strategy spanning more than a few turns, and more than a few units. In particular, we have a decision right now:

Do we shoot for the HGP to alleviate bureaucracy, producing probe teams (0-1-1) that can be disbanded for 1/2 value + the stockpile energy kick?

or

Do we use doctors to control b-drones and expand right now?

or

Something else?

There's no point in having a poll here, since new strategies should be encouraged, but cannot be predicted at the start of this thread to put in the poll options.

[binTravkin]

The probe option seems somehow weird to me..
IIRC probe cost 30 mins
its 15 mins for SP
We have 6 bases
Each base will take ~ 7turns to produce a probe without much hurrying
6x15 = 90
If we had 1 AA + ~100 Ecs It'd be right what we need

And if we start this strat ASAP (e.g. in the following 3-4 turns) we are likely to finish HGP first

The question is - do we have (I have not seen the game file) an AA/are we going to have it and can we gather 100Ecs in 10 turns?

Possibly even more, as we will be hurrying the probes a bit..

Please share your opinion!

[Chaos Theory]

We have 1 AA, and we're making 7 EC/turn (more when base #6 is down). In addition, every time a probe team finishes (0-1-1s cost us 18 now, and disband for 9), we get the stockpile kick for another ~2 ECs.

[smacksim]

We also need probes for probe actions and possible defense. This is a very strong choice in many departments.

What's weird about the probe disbanding? I never used it much until I played a few crawler-less games with Blake a loooong time ago. Yeah, at first you think 'But I'm wasting minerals!' and that hurts. But think about it another way: You are gaining one of the advantages of crawlers before anyone would suspect it from you.

Strengths of the probe-building strategy are that it is useful in many dimensions, improving our offensive/defensive capabilities, diplomatic options, chance for improving techs, and chance of securing a secret project. There are no inherent weaknesses, other than the 'loss' of minerals for those probes that are disbanded.

Strengths of ICSing before we are ready to absorb the b-drones are largely cancelled out by the paralysis these new bases will incur on 'random' core bases, by the poor defense any new fringe bases will have, should they themselves become a dronepile, and by not focusing our production on an SP. (O.k., that last reason isn't inherent to ICSing early, but it is indirectly related).

The biggest PIA about 1=1 drone bases is their inability to later build rec commons, rec tanks, or crawlers without some help. Often these bases are producing only 1 mineral a turn (unless built on a mineral special). This means that for each drone base, yet another base will have to focus part of it's production on building a crawler for the 1=1 drone base, to alleviate and accellerate the mineral problem. If we happen to be at war during any of this, we become vulnerable as well.

Still, I'd agree that we need to ICS ASAP. I would subscribe to a plan of adding 1-2 more bases now IF we otherwise focus on building an SP and/or infiltrating the enemy. But far better, IMO, would be to focus entirely on a probe army (at bases that are already at full support: former+garrison).

Long term, we must clearly enjoy the beautiful continent we have landed upon and fill it with Gaians. To this end, and pause in ICSing should allow our formers to road and pre-forest where possible. Especial consideration must be given to removing some fungus from the ruins and of course, to building a road into the Uranium Flats

Probe teams and other diplomatic officers should be well informed as to their policies for dealing with encounters with other groups. Should they infiltrate, steal technology, beg, borrow, pact? Let us formulate a plan of diplomatic action now.

Further, the crew of the Unity Foil deserve their first medal. What a service they are rendering in acting as a ferry service for our exploration teams. After escorting a mindworm accross the northern straights, they should be able to turn around and ferry a probe team or two to destinations of diplomatic interest.

Defensively we are weak. However, risk analysis shows that we have already gained turn advantage by taking some risks in this department to focus on CP and Former building. We should not expect enemies to land on our soil anytime soon. Nonetheless, a scout patrol 1-1-1 shell in each base will quell drones and provide the 'cardboard cutout' defense infrastructure that will carry us into the next century.

In the very long term, we must think about offensive actions. It is very unlikely that we will win by sitting at home. Personally, I'd love to make Yang our lapdog.

[binTravkin]

Ok, then our Ecs is 7/turn now + 2 for each probe (we need 180 - 50 => 130 / 9 => 10 probes) it's 20 + 1/turn from our new base means..

Ehh..maths

If we presume, we need 10 probes for SP, then:
each probe = 18 mins
each base = 3 mins (we should have all them a bit forasted by then)
18 / 3 = 6 turns/probe

10 probes in 6 bases = 12 turns
10 probes = 20 ecs
12 turns = 8 * 12 = 96 ecs
=
116 ecs

10 probes = 90 mins
1 AA = 50 mins
40 mins left = 160 ecs
116/4 = 29 mins

11 mins left! (to be finished in 4 turns)

therefore if we start in say 2132 (which is the closest date I think), then we finish in
2132 + 12 + 4 = 2148

Which is not the maximal result, but the average..
We should get it sooner tough, otherwise there is a high risj that someone else (most likely Morganites) will grab that project.
The optimal date would be 2140-2145

So, we must pop pods like there's no tomorrow and if (thank gods) in one of them we find an AA, then put all efforts in transporting to our lands ASAP

Credit pod should also be good..

[Chaos Theory]

We can make more efficient use of our ECs - we can hurry the probe teams as they near completion. In this case, we'd want to pay the full hurry cost, not the minimal hurry cost, as soon as each probe team reaches 10 minerals, until we're dry.

[binTravkin]

Provide the math, please!
How fast then we can produce those at least 100 mins needed?

[smacksim]

Originally posted by binTravkin
therefore if we start in say 2132 (which is the closest date I think), then we finish in
2132 + 12 + 4 = 2148

Consider not starting the project until we are able to build it in one turn, and also factor in maximal last-row probe rushing at all our bases. Without the math, I'd guess that these two factors would play out to about 2-4 turns earlier, and with complete surprise (barring infiltration). Also consider that 2+ probes will be tasked to off-shore duty.

-S

[binTravkin]

I didn't pretend that we're gonna block 1 city with an SP - I just tried to estimate, how much it'd take to us to produce the needed amount of probes because after 2140 there's evergrowing chance of other faction efforts in SP building and by 2160 the chance to build HGP for us will be like 20% or less (100%/4 human facs = 25% - (AI SP possibility + if Morgan gets IA, we can't do the same with probes!))

So let's start ASAP maybe!

[Chaos Theory]

So I take it we're going to start building probe teams for hurrying SPs (0-1-1s are optimal for this)? Any firm support for this? Smacksim seems in favor, binTravkin might be in favor (ASAP maybe?), and I'm in favor. No one else has even posted in this thread (though Illuminatus topped it ). For lack of contrary opinions, I have started to implement this in the turn.

[Illuminatus]

We need to take in account that Morgan has IA so he is probably accumulating supply crawlers so it is likely he is going to get most of SPs. However, I am for support since in worst case we will end with lots of probes.

[Chaos Theory]

Morgan cannot get all the appealing early SPs if we go for one. He might get first pick, but if we get second pick of the HGP and WP, we're doing pretty well.

[smacksim]

If we find Morgan with a MW+rover or MW+MW, we could very likely threaten him to take a bad SP, or destroy a base.

Speaking of which, we really need protocol for Diplomacy. If you haven't voiced on this issue, please do so. What are we willing to trade/steal. Treaty/Pact? etc...

[binTravkin]

EDIT: deleted!

[smacksim]

Pact will give maps automatically, btw.