HIVE diplomatic exchanges

[Phenix]

Voltaire's response sure seems promising... let's sure hope the rest of the Hive thinks the same way

[Maniac]

Is there any more progress on the idea of we voting for them for planetary governor, and they in return giving us updated PEACE infiltration information? Us voting for them could also be seen as an extra payment if they give techs to us while we cannot repay immediately.

[Drogue]

Possibily. If Pacted, I think we will be expected to vote for them. I will try to get infiltration data, but techs would be too much IMHO. We want to be nice to the Hive, and not push it. That saves PEACE-like confrontations, and they won't like us asking for more.

No more news though. IIRC we're both discussing it.

[Maniac]

I wasn't suggesting to ask techs for our vote. I mean to suggest that if they would gave us techs while we couldn't immediately repay them, that we could present our votes as a payment for the time they would have to wait to get fully repaid by techs from us.

[DeathByTheSword]

Official message:

Dear Function Drogue and Function Delta:

After further discussion and consultation among the Hive governing and administrative bodies, I'm happy to bring you the Hive's official message:

The Hive has decided to formally issue an offer to the CyCons of a research and non-aggression pact with a high likelihood of it being developed into a joint victory permanent pact. In addition, we would like to extend an official invitation to Function Drogue and Function Delta to visit the Hive in order to work out all the issues related to a possible permanent pact. We would appreciate if you could pass this information along to the CyCon government for approval. May peace and friendship between the Hive and the CyCons last forever.

i dont seee any problems with it...but i would like to make up an 'document' of our pact...what it is. and what is stands for...also...i want options in it so that we can expand our pact to a protection and joint victory pact...(the proctect one we can try to get in when we go to war with PEACE)

[Drogue]

Ok, I have much to discuss with you. I have been in intensive MSN convo's completely off the record, with HongHu and Jamski. The reason is this:

We have been discussing a co-op victory. We seem to be for it, the Hive is mostly for it, though some remain to be convinced, and the Drones think it is too easy. However Jamski has the backing of HongHu and Kody, and so this is not completely without foundation.

We discussed how a co-op victory would work. I was asked about our war plans, and to be safe, Jamski and I traded our plans. We are not releasing them to our factions yet, since we agreed to keep it quite until our attack on PEACE is underway. I am sorry if I went beyond my authority, however we needed to discuss the future candidly with them, as we are at a crossroads. There is much good news though.

Jamski has agreed to a trade, whereby we give them the commlinks and vote for them, and they give us full infiltration on PEACE and the PUT. We then take out PEACE, with Hive information. Then we escort Hive transports to PUT isle and they take that. This is not definate at all, just an idea, but I think it is a very good one. I have been told about Hive's plans for PUT conquest.

The Hive will not break pact with the Drones, and so if we do go co-op victory, it is as a triumverate. The reason we think this is such a good idea is for fun. If we win like this, we should win about Christmas time. If not, expect 6 months of 2 or 3 factions left, while others get bored, and with just a slugging match, that ends when everyone gets bored and the game never finishes. With co-op victory, we can not repeat the old mistakes, but having an efficient totalitarian government, by the people, for the people, with instant communication. Our telepathy means that the government is always has the opinions of all the population when making actions, but without the burocracy of old Earth. All 3 factions go well together both ideologically and game wise IMHO. Also a co-op victory shows that we can get along, even with diplomacy that should give an equilibrium of stalemate war. It also means we get to stick it to PEACE well and truly

This is obviously all subject to the ratification of both sides, but as HongHu has stated, the Hive are for a long term Pact. I am sorry if you feel I have overstepped my bounds, but this being so sensitive, needed to be bought up clearly, coherantly, and in secret.

Look at it this way. 9 months is a good length of time for a DG, before people get bored (look at last one) and this should last about 7-9. We win, which is always nice. We win with factions we get on with. We get to stick it to PEACE well and truly. IMHO this is perfect. It may be a little easy, but wby diplomacy we have made it that, and in co-operating, have not repeated old mistakes, making the Unity experiment a success

When we have attacked PEACE, I will give you a little more detailed information, and then we can discuss properly a co-op victory, but I thought I should tell you this now, to give you the jist of where I and Jamski intend on going with this. It may affect whether we go for long term pact or not.

Please feel free to discuss and comment. In a few turns (I insisted that our plans for war remain completely secret until we have launched our attack) I can release the MSN convo that I've saved. However almost all the info is written above.

So, we have 3 choices:

• Go it alone, and try to win that way (doubtful victory as looking at other players and how the game is now).
• Sign a co-op Pact until PEACE and the PUT are destroyed, then fight it our between the three of us (against doubtful victory as the Hive is in a much stronger position, and the Drones have buster).
• Sign a co-op victory Pact with Hive and Drones (almost assured win).

Seems pretty obvious choice to me. And also it means we get to stop PEACE who are annoying, and Archaic who kept explaining before how their team had the best chance of winning. The 2 big RP factions, and the wildcard but very good team together seems a great match.

Now... I've said my piece. Feel free to discuss at will

[Googlie]

As the CMN I have no problem with it (although in retrospect I wish I'd disabled Co_op victory - the diplo part of the game would then have been much more variable)

Right from when the game was being set up I was being told that the Hive and the Uni would fight, that there was too much bad blood between Voltaire and Archaic spilled over from ACDG I.

So a "builders" vs. "researchers" alignment seemed like a neat thing to do, with PEACE being the joker/honest broker. But they withheld PUT's commlink from you and tried to play you off against each other, souring your relations with them.

So it's their loss - and PUT's as well, though they don't know it as yet.

Pity, 'cos no-one likes a 3 vs 1 set-up.

But that's the way the cookie crumbled ..............

G.

[Nubclear]

This pleases the Council of Heaven. The three most favoured children of the Garden of Communism (you wouldn't know of it unless you've read parts of the Hiverian Bible) are beginning to unite with themselves and with Heaven....And once all of Planet is united, then Planet will ascend into the heavens.....

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Googlie
Right from when the game was being set up I was being told that the Hive and the Uni would fight, that there was too much bad blood between Voltaire and Archaic spilled over from ACDG I.

Really? I mean, Archaic and I didn't like each other from ACDGI, and Herc and I were good friends. Shows how things change.

Originally posted by Googlie
Pity, 'cos no-one likes a 3 vs 1 set-up.

You do when you're in the 3

[Maniac]

Drogue, to be frank I don't really like it you're not telling us what you discussed with Jamski and HongHu. This is supposed to be a democracy team game, not a single player PBEM game. How are non-government members supposed to comment and contribute to the game if they don't know what a core group is planning and deciding over their heads?

Anyway, I of course don't have any problems at all with cooperative victory with the Hive, though I don't really fancy co-opping with the Drones, as they haven't roleplayed much.
On the other side, the sooner this ACDTG is done, the more roleplay and policy discussion attention the ACPSG will hopefully get, which doesn't seem to get off the ground right now.

[Nubclear]

Hmm....How about we coup you Maniac?

[Drogue]

Maniac: I would love to tell you, indeed, I have told you everything but the small details they have thought about their production plan. The reason it was done like this is because for it to work, I had to tell Jamski about our plans against PEACE (just that we were planning on a war - he'd guessed that anyway). I asked him not to disclose that fact to the rest of the Hive until we had attacked PEACE, since some members of the Hive are not sure about a permapact yet. Basically, the rest of the information is all just speculation by Jamski, and has no relevance at all at the moment.

This was a private conversation, like yours with Chaunk, or others that may have gone on, and I have to have permission to post what was said, as you did with Chaunk. This is all Jamski's personal opinion, of what he is trying to decide. I thought of waiting until I could disclose all (as I said, this is almost all anyway) but then I thought this had repercussions on what we decide now.

I will tell you, but in order to make sure that our plans were not spread, I had to agree to keep some of their details secret.#

I am aware this is a democracy game, and that is why I have bought this to you, and why during the conversation I stressed that what I said was all my own opinion only. I am not deciding anything. I said before that my opinion was that the EAF and PF discuss foreign policy with other factions and then we poll for the decision. If DBTS or Corellion were online (and on MSN) at the time I would have loved them to join in, but Jamski asked to discuss a few things privately, an no-one else was online.

What else could I have done. I could have not divulged anything, but then we wouldn't know the Hive position, and would not be able to see the opportunities. I am sorry if you feel I went to far. I did not agree to anything, and have presented you with all the options that we came up with, and all the main points of the conversation. I did not feel that a private chat with the main pro-CyCon Hive member was something to pass up, when we have been saying for a while that we wanted to know their position. That is Jamski's position, and he is gaining support. Kody and HongHu agree with him, and he is going to mention it to Voltaire when we attack PEACE (and the info is less sensitive).

I have PMed Jamski to ask if I can release the chatlog of our convo.

I want to stress, that I have decided nothing, and planned no more than I did with my giant terraforming and science plans. I work something out and then bring it to the faction for discussion. Then once we have discussed and/or polled, then we decide what to do. That is all I have done. With foreign policy, it involves working things out with another faction. The convo was only last night, and so I am bringing this information to the faction quickly, to discuss. I have told you what I discussed with Jamski and HongHu. However as will all private mails, I do not wish to release exactly what someone has said when they have not given me permission to, as you did with Chaunks PM.

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar
Hmm....How about we coup you Maniac?

You can try, it wouldn't work.
I'm still amazed that the FNG already has 6 members A few more and we equal the CCCP of ACDG I

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Maniac
Anyway, I of course don't have any problems at all with cooperative victory with the Hive, though I don't really fancy co-opping with the Drones, as they haven't roleplayed much.

It has been strongly hinted, as I posted, that it is both or neither. Many Hive members will not break the Pact with the Drones, so either we go to war with the Drones, with the Hive watching (or maybe influencing ) or we co-op.

[Corellion]

I have no problem with your ends or your means. You took a risk in informing Jamski of our plans, but the possibility of a backstab seems low, and the potential rewards are great. I have no problem with a 3-way pact (it's quite logical, as we have compatible ideologies) and would be in favour of helping the Hive take out the PUT (take THAT you irrational scientists!). If we could be filled in on the chatlog, it would be great, but if not it's no big loss.