Civilization studio lays off 20

[OzzyKP]

Actually I missed the studio.

That was all on Friday, right? I wasn't around that day.

[MxM]

Depends if you believe in comparative advantage.

You are right that free trade and outsourcing means that less jobs in THOSE industries will exist in the US. However, since you concede that business and wealth generation go up this means that goods are cheaper in the United States.

If goods are cheaper in the US (think $2 gas v. $4 gas); consumers have extra money to spend on services... and if more is spent on services, then more local jobs are created. The problem would come when service jobs are exported to other countries and the US has less and less comparative advantage positions. Whether or not that point has been reached is debateable- with rising gas and transport prices, I figure that there will always be some things that are cheaper to produce locally rather than to source.

Obviously there is an optimum (like with everything in life), when you have cooperative advantage without loss of too much jobs, so you get both wealth generation and employment. If you are too protectionist from the optimal point, then wealth generation will suffer, if you are too aggressive in outsourcing/free trade, then employment will suffer.

Looking at the actual state of the employment, and at projections of it (quite bad actually), I have no doubts that we are well above the optimal point. Business in US is doing quite fine, employment is not.

[Felch]

The optimum is totally free trade. Leave things alone and they'll reach their own equilibrium. Lazy fatass Americans won't always be as rich as they once were, but the average human being on planet Earth will benefit.

[SpencerH]

While I understand that this is a joke, it has some truth, I think. And not only due to crisis that that created bad employment situation today, but mostly due to what suspect Firaxis outsources more and more to Firaxis china, especially the game polishing and translation to different platforms, which are the final stages of the game. (That's what they do with revolution). Bush (and republicans in general) are supporters and big proponents of outsourcing and free trade which is helpful for business and wealth generation but not for employment.

Overall the question is quite complex and I do not want to create political discussion here, but overall, I agree with you, without joke.

OMFG! I'll say no more, I dont miss OT at all.

[Hauldren Collider]

OMFG! I'll say no more, I dont miss OT at all.

Luckily he doesn't seem to post there. I think Drake would probably tear him a new debatable *******. Or more likely just call him a **** like the rest of us.

[wodan11]

The optimum is totally free trade. Leave things alone and they'll reach their own equilibrium. Lazy fatass Americans won't always be as rich as they once were, but the average human being on planet Earth will benefit.

/getting on soapbox

I have a BIG problem with the idea of government regulation, to include labor laws, unemployment insurance, social security, safety regulations, and even so far as minimum wage, while at the same time desiring free trade. So we're enlightened, modern nations and have all that oversight. How do we compete with nations (particularly China, India, and Pakistan) who do not have all that? Answer: we can't.

We can't have both, period. It's not sustainable. Either we deregulate (yeah right, that's going to happen) and go back to a 19th-century level (in terms of labor laws) as China/India/Pakistan are, or else the economy will slowly get worse and worse as jobs and manufacturing are moved to those nations. You already can't find anything in Wal-Mart that isn't made in China or Pakistan. Eventually, we *have* (there's literally no choice) to enact import duties which are based upon the level of that "labor law" burden in place in the country of design/manufacture.

In effect, we currently do *not* have free trade, so such import duties will make it a fair market again.

/off soapbox

Related to Civ, sourcing design overseas is a problem, as well. When a company is literally multinational, the amount of labor sourced overseas needs to be taxed (which is basically what all of the "labor law" burden amounts to... a bunch of taxes) at a percentage equal to the amount sourced overseas. That will make it a fair market for that company vs a company 100% domestic and vs a company 100% foreign (which would have the full tax).

[Hauldren Collider]

Guys that belongs in the OT. Whether or not YOU belong in the OT is another question (probably not) but leave your pathetic, uninformed political ramblings OUT of game gossip threads

[MxM]

Sorry, but what is OT?

[Boracks]

OT = off topic

[ColdPhoenix]

Sorry, but what is OT?

It's full of mad people.

[DaShi]

Well, this has made me completely reconsider buying the game.

[wodan11]

Guys that belongs in the OT. Whether or not YOU belong in the OT is another question (probably not) but leave your pathetic, uninformed political ramblings OUT of game gossip threads

It belongs in this thread just as much as your personal attack does.

Actually, it belongs more, because I tied it back into Civ. Whereas a personal attack is a personal attack.

[SpencerH]

Luckily he doesn't seem to post there. I think Drake would probably tear him a new debatable *******. Or more likely just call him a **** like the rest of us.

Stern rebuke of patent nonsense was edited by author so as not to alienate the new members and guests.

[BigFree]

The optimum is totally free trade. Leave things alone and they'll reach their own equilibrium. Lazy fatass Americans won't always be as rich as they once were, but the average human being on planet Earth will benefit.

While this is true, it takes an awfully long time for the equilibrium point to be reached. While in transition, the average american's quality of life declines and the once less fortunates live's get a little better if their leaders don't steal from them.