MOD: The Ancient Mediterranean MOD 0.2.2

[watorrey]

I can't find anything wrong with the TAM 2.5i Fertile Crescent.biq

Could you give me more setup parameters that you used or maybe a .sav?

[Arrian]

Watorrey,

All I did was load the mod (chose conquests, picked fertile crescent 2.5), pick Babylon, and hit enter. I didn't change anything else.

I can get you save when I get home tonight.

-Arrian

[watorrey]

I have an answer for you: Always make sure culturally linked start positions is checked when playing a premade map. (just click 'default rules' during setup)

Turning off Culturally Linked Start Positions' seems to override the preplaced start postitions and civs. It then places random civs in random start positions.

It probably has something to do with overriding the default rules which are specified as such in the editor.

It may be a bug in the 1.22 editor or it has been there all along and nobody noticed or i just haven't heard of it. I'll do some more testing to see if it affects turning on victory points, wonder victories, etc.

[Arrian]

I bet that was it. When I play the stock game, I always play with cultural linking off.

-Arrian

[conmcb25]

Originally posted by watorrey
You should read up on modding and get comfortable working with the editor first.

Basically, find a map you like and import it into the random map biq rules. You'll have to replace all the resources if you want them accurate or you could just let the editor randomize them for you.

Maps can be found at many of the fan sites.

Keep in mind there are lots of things that can go wrong so you should have a good understanding of how it all works.

Thanks

Your last sentence makes me think maybe I should just do the random map and 8 Civs with my son

Im old and info age challenged

Good to see your playing TAM Arrian, Im beginning to prefer it over Standard epic.

I didn't run into the Persian problem, most of my games have been with Western European Civs on the big map but 9 atack that early does sound a bit much.

[Arrian]

Actually, since I was playing AS Persia last night, I should correct that - it's an 8 attack. Still, that's hardcore. 8.3.2, every 10 turns.

It helped that I got an early MGL. 3x Guard Cavalry army... by my calculations that's a 12.4.3.

Down went Babylon (repop, heh), Assyria (now an OCC, not long for the world), and I was able to deal with a Median incursion w/o much trouble (and got MGL #3 for 3x Guard Cav army #2 ). Media at least made me sweat with those 7.2.2. Elite Horsemen. MGL #2 rushed the Parthenon in Babylon.

It's kinda like being handed the Statue of Zeus... only it might be even better.

Con,

I suppose it depends on what type of game you and your son want to play. When I've played with a friend of mine, we typically restart until we're on seperate continents. We've started near each other before, and that simple = ancient warfare. The only question is the unit mix. It might be cool to have a game where you cannot even get at each other (reliably) until near the end, with Galliots (req. Exploration, IIRC).

-Arrian

[conmcb25]

Hey Arrian

My son is 13 and the subtleties of CIV still escape him.

He likes it when we are close and gang up on the AI.

Its not much of a challenge for me but he likes it and I help him along as we play.

And he likes the Ancient stuff the best, so he really likes this mod.

The kid is 13 and he routinely reads books about ancient Rome and Greece. I guess its a good thing he takes after mom

[Arrian]

Sounds like a cool kid!

I forgot he was only 13... at that age, I was trying to figure out how the AI was getting wonders first in the original Civ.

-Arrian

[scaeva]

i think Im a cool kid.

I like the ancient stuff in this mod and enjoy playing it with my dad.

[Arrian]

Wow, the AI is aggressive in this Mod.

I've been playing out my Persian game (on the Fertile Cresent map). I am maybe 2/3 of the way through the Hellenistic Age.

Thus far, the following civs have attacked me:

Babylon
Assyria
Media
Egypt
Nubia
Kolchis

6 out of 9 opponents.

I'm psyched to do a little government comparison next time I play. I've saved the game on the last turn of anarchy, so that all I need to do is press enter and select a new government. My empire is large, a tad oddly shaped. I'm particularly interested to see what city-states would be like. I'm expecting republic to be the best overall (especially since I also have representation and thus can build the roman forum small wonder), but maybe I'll be wrong.

-Arrian

[watorrey]

It's good to hear you are having fun
I'm curious to see what you come up with in a goverment comparison on that map.

[Arrian]

I can post the save too, so others can compare if they wish. The only governments missing, I believe, will be Empire and Feudalism.

...

Unrelated thought: what do you think of adding "produces veteran units" to some of the small wonders (I'm thinking mainly of the forbidden palace type small wonders. Parthenon, etc.)?

Producing hordes of regular units is driving me nuts, but that's not really the main issue. I understand you guys deliberately set things up that way. Besides, having 1-2 more cities that produce vets won't change much. What I'm after is upgrading. With a large empire, it's REALLY a pain in the butt to have to do any and all upgrading in the capital (Persopolis). From a "fun" perspective, being able to upgrade them in Babylon (my Parthenon city) too would really be nice.

-Arrian

[conmcb25]

Originally posted by Arrian
Unrelated thought: what do you think of adding "produces veteran units" to some of the small wonders (I'm thinking mainly of the forbidden palace type small wonders. Parthenon, etc.)?

Producing hordes of regular units is driving me nuts, but that's not really the main issue. I understand you guys deliberately set things up that way. Besides, having 1-2 more cities that produce vets won't change much. What I'm after is upgrading. With a large empire, it's REALLY a pain in the butt to have to do any and all upgrading in the capital (Persopolis). From a "fun" perspective, being able to upgrade them in Babylon (my Parthenon city) too would really be nice.

-Arrian

I like this idea. I find it a tad bit to restricting as well, and have been playing Rome just for that reason although I prefer to play one of Agricultural Civs.

[watorrey]

You need a slightly different mindset for TAM. Try upgrading only the units close by and sending the old units into battle first. Less emphasis on upgrading, more on replacement.

Just a thought

[Arrian]

Try upgrading only the units close by and sending the old units into battle first.

Because, strategically, that's... um... not very smart. It's a waste. If the option to upgrade is there, I will use it! If the intent of the mod is to emphasize replacement instead of upgrading, you should either:

1) increase upgrade cost such that it becomes more cost-effective to build new units from scratch; or
2) break the upgrade chains periodically.

Not that I'd be particularly pleased with that, personally, but hey, it's your Mod.

The result of the current setup is that I will end up rotating my troops around in order to get them upgraded w/o leaving myself defenseless during the upgrade process.

Luckily for me, most of my units at this point are horsemen, and thus can move 8 tiles/turn on my roads. Upgrading my spears to pikes will be more annoying.

-Arrian