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Ranged Unit Mod

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  • Ranged Unit Mod

    Back on Civ3 General, the suggestion was made to make units that have bows and guns into bombard unit. The thread itself degenerated into a pissing contest about who knows the most military history, so I thought I'd grab the ideas I liked best, list them here, and talk about some positive game effects I think they'd have.

    The best idea, in my opinion, was to give such units a zero range bombard ability with the strength of its attack value. This may not satisfy the historical realists (who want to use archers as they were "historically used"), but it does give them some realistic defense ability. I would think that an archer would be capable of getting off at least one free shot before the swordsmen came in and cut them down. Same with the musketmen, which are already nice defenders, but with a two strength single shot defensive bombard, it makes them even better. This would address the problem of those that think the added production cost over pikemen isn't worthwhile: it would make them slightly better defensive units than their defense value would indicate.

    Just to make sure there's no confusion, this does not mean I get rid of their regular attack value. They are still attackers, but they just get the one free shot on defense.
    I'm not sure if I'd go so far as to extend this analogy beyond the medieval units. From the industrial age onward, EVERYONE has guns, so it might be overkill... or it might be a way of preventing a warrior from accidentally defeating a tank. So yes, I just may do this.

    The main effect this would have is to make certain units more useful. Both archers and longbowmen would now have some value in defense, making the AI's love affair with them more sensible (particularly those pesky longbowmen). However, then there's the unique unit effects.

    Consider the Babylonian bowman. In the ancient age, there is the question: should I build bowmen, or should I build spearmen? Bowmen have that added attack value... but I'm never going to actually use it, and spearmen have the upgrade path. Bowmen become used chiefly, in my game, as barbarian hunting units (and they are very good at this). However, with that one shot bombard, the bowman becomes the best defensive units in the ancient era (next to the Greek hoplite). Babylonian bowmen suddenly become useful.

    Consider the Egyptian war chariot. If you look at the graphic, these guys are shooting arrows from their chariot... an excuse to give them a two strength, one shot, zero range bombard. As is, they are one of the most useless UUs in the game. With this addition, it gives them just a bit of added defensive punch, and becomes more of the mobile archer it should be than a stronger chariot.

    Consider the French musketeer. Yea, a highly defensive unit gains an attack of three. Whoo-****ing-hoo. However, if you give them a zero range three strength bombard along with that three attack, they gain a slightly better chance of damaging an attacker with that free shot. The effect isn't as dramatic as with the Babylonians, but it is similar, and, once again, makes an otherwise useless UU slightly more useful.

    This, combined with the disabling of trading "contact with" other civs, may make my first foray into rules editing. Once I've won my existing game (on Monarch, as the Chinese: I'm in the middle of a medieval free-for-all involving Riders, Samurai, and Elephants), I'll test these out, and let you guys know how the changes work.
    To those who understand,
    I extend my hand.
    To the doubtful I demand,
    Take me as I am.

  • #2
    This is exactly what I've done in my own personal mod, and it works splendidly.

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    • #3
      I think giving all ranged units a defensive bombard it a bit extreme. The defense oriented Musketman/Musketeer makes the late medieval/early industrial era even more focused upon defense. And besides, every time you attack a stack with any ranged unit, then the other units get to assist. Sure this might be realistic, but shouldn't the attacker also be able to be assisted by the rest of his stack? I just think that gives too much of an advantage on defense (that isn't already a problem with railroads being as they are ).

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      • #4
        Trip, there's definitely no doubt that Civ3 is woefully inadequate at handling ranged units or any kind of combined arms attack. (Unlike CtP2 --now that was awesome). However, we've got to work with what we've got. I've tried it, and it does NOT seem overpowerful. It works quite well.

        Oh well. To each his own.

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        • #5
          Well, I've tried one game with it (quit during the middle ages due to a bad start and a losing streak). I was playing the Americans (love that Industrious trait, and was looking forward to opening the map quickly) on Monarch, and started on a relatively poor peninsula blocked off by mountains, near jungles, desert, and rivered grasslands which were inhabited by Persians. Yeah, that start sucked, but I played for a while anyway.

          It was interesting to see the defensive value of the archers. It wasn't overpowering (I had to go against an archer covered by a few spearmen on a few occasions), but it did put the odds slightly more in favor of the defender on those occasions. Also interesting was the fact that swordsmen, who's graphic carries a shield, were more resistant to that initial flight of arrows.

          I had the opportunity to go against a group of babylonian bowmen (the whole world was at war with me at this point, due to my weakness, despite my successful, and relatively just, war against the Persians). They were nasty; this is good. The Babylonians didn't have a decent UU before... now they do. I'd still rather fight Bowmen than Hoplites, but that extra firepower is useful for the Babs.

          The only problem is that the computer doesn't really know how valuable having an archer around for defense is. When I captured Persepolis, their archer was outside the city, heading for the Aztec border (we were allied with them). Then again, the computer doesn't really know how to use their units all that well, anyway, but this does give the player a trick that the AI won't deliberately exploit (but they do get lucky often enough).

          I also disabled contact trading... but it was irrelevant on this map. It was a Pangean map, and thus everybody knew everybody else pretty quickly anyway. I am still going to be using entirely random maps, though, because I like the fact that there's actually decisions to make about what to beeline for (mapmaking on an archepelago, iron working and horse riding on pangea). I made the mistake of assuming I was living on a small island because of the rather slim land I started on, and thus ended up with the almost useless ability to build triremes when the armies came knocking.

          The reason I disable contact trading is to potentially slow down
          technological progress in the early game, and make voyages of discovery more profitable (in terms of exclusive trading rights) during the middle ages.
          To those who understand,
          I extend my hand.
          To the doubtful I demand,
          Take me as I am.

          Comment

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