New Patch Impact on Creators

[SpencerH]

Sorry, I misunderstood. I'm no expert, but I doubt it since the 1.21 bic and savegames contain more/new code. I certainly havent seen any posts about such an editor (that could remove the new code). Why do you want to use the 1.17 editor? Is it strictly a 1.17 mod?

[W.I.N.T.E.R]

Uhm- not really, but the game I saved under the 1.21 patch cannot be edited with the 1.17 version. Well, at least the safegame cannot changed with it: In 1.17 "mode" the safegame cannot be loaded, and in the 1.21 "mode" the changes made with the 1.17 bic file are not implemented (sh**e)

Seems like I'll have 2 wait until sb. comez along and gives such a program a go ...

[The_Aussie_Lurker]

Hi Guys,
You forgot a major impact in the creation of new units, and that is "Multiple AI Strategies".
You guys might remember that a lot of potential new unit suggestions got knocked back by modders because they said that the AI wouldn't no how to use them properly! So now, we can have those legions which can build roads and forts, we can have Fighter/bombers and we can have missile cruisers capable of carrying cruise missiles, because the AI will actually be able to use them as intended!
Now, if only they can add a couple of new flags-Air defense and Air attack for ground and naval units, or else allow ground/naval units to have the intercept flag currently available to air units, then I'll be happy!!

Yours,
The_Aussie_Lurker.

[Random Passerby]

Unfortunately the limited terraform (legionares building roads, for example) was not just an issue of not being able to select multiple options; you can't even select the terraform option at all unless you have all worker terraform abilities flagged. There's a chance that the AI might now be smart enough to use them to build roads anyways, but don't hold your breath.

Not that giving all terraform abilities to most or all infantry units wouldn't be an interesting idea...

[Random Passerby]

Hrm... things seem pretty bad. I tried playing around with various combinations of AI strategies and worker/terraform actions. All units other than workers had their cost increased by 1, and workers' pop cost eliminated (this is to make it so there's still some point to build workers). I was the only Expansionist civ, so I made scouts free and with 100 moves and all terrain as roads, plus all espionage actions had cost 1, I gave myself several tens of thousands of gold, all techs and made intelligence agency free. A few behaviors I noticed:

-Workers did get built by the AI, even though all worker functions were available to many military units.

-Warriors had Offense, Defense, Explore, Terraform. No unusual behavior seen from the AI; when I accidentally provoked a war with the aztecs, my own automated warriors simply marched off towards the aztec territory, and otherwise just explored.

-Archers had Offense, Defense, Explore, no Terraform. The aztecs built one as their initial defensive unit--I don't know if militaristic civs would ever do this without the defense flag on archers, but it seems about right. Once they started turning out jag warriors and later spearmen, the archer started wandering off exploring.

-Swordsmen had Offense, Defense, Terraform. The AI didn't build them by the time I decided to give up; I tried building one and automating it, and it simply wandered around defending random spots in my territory for a turn, then moving on.

I wasn't watching every move, but as far as I can tell, no terraforming was done by any military units by the AI.

[Kuciwalker]

The Automate ability works for things other than terraforming?! Yes! If only there were a way to make a unit have to use automate, so the human couldn't directly control it. That would be great for explorers, but think about doing that to nukes!

[Random Passerby]

OK, tried it with a few changes: Turned all costs down to the original levels. Warriors' AI trimmed to Offense and Terraform, Archers modified to Terraform only, Spearmen Defense and Terraform.

-Predictably, Spearmen just defended.

-Warriors behaved exactly the same as before, when they had Explore on.

-Archers functioned exactly as workers, but none of the AIs ever built any.

This still hardly qualifies as rigorous testing, but it does not look good... apparently just about everything has priority over terraforming. It's possible that this changes later on, but I got bored.

Other tidbits:

-No old-style settlers that terraform; if you give settlers terraform and settle, the AI will never ever build its first city. And since it doesn't have any cities to improve, neither its worker nor settler will do anything...

-The AI really really sucks at picking fights. Just for fun I made modern armor require no resources, require no shields, have 100/100/100, 15 bonus HP, all terrain as roads, blitz, etc., and I built a half dozen of them in the first few centuries. The AI still happily marched up to one of my armor-defended cities with three warriors and declared war.

[Mellian]

Since i am not home until late August, i can't exactly try my suggestion....

Isn't it possible to use the old hacked editor and create new units, and then use the new one to edit them?

-Mellian

[Willem]

Originally posted by Lemmy
the problem is we have to make these governments ourselves, they should've been in the unmodded version of civ...

Why?

[Willem]

Originally posted by Mellian
Since i am not home until late August, i can't exactly try my suggestion....

Isn't it possible to use the old hacked editor and create new units, and then use the new one to edit them?

-Mellian

Using the MultiTool is much more convenient for creating new units than the back door into the editor ever was. The only use for it I found was for adding resources. Gramphos' utility is far better for adding anything else. All you have to do is add the graphics/sfx to the proper folder, then alter a few lines in the .ini file. Much better than doing everything manually, which is what you have to do using the editor.