MOD: Copper, Zinc and Nickel Resources

[CountZero]

That is the wonderfull thing about mods, if you have a subset of players who LIKE to play it complicated, then they can. If you do not like the changes, no one is forcing anyone to use them.

Some mods have a goal of Balance, other historical accuracy, others, just change it up for the fun of it. Whatever the case may be, if you are interested in a particular mod, then post suggestions, but if a mod does not interest you, or if you do not agree with the goal of the mod, then there is no need to post.

In otherwords, if someone wants to tie every single unit/building to a different reasource, then they have every right to, reguardless of the vision or goals or intentions of Firaxis.

CountZero

[vladIV]

Another possibility for bringing in the copper idea but not making it overimportant in the earliest part of the game is to bring it in around currency, a point in the game where many cities have been established. I was wondering why the game had no references to things like copper nec. for marketplaces or papyrus/ paper for libraries. The coolest idea i think that i spotted in this thread was the timber idea...is their any way to link the forest overlay on a tile to prerequisites for units/buildings. Can buildings have resource requirements for that matter? (I'm still afraid that the scenario editor will be in effect a one way door from which ill never return, ive been systematically avoiding it due to recent civ related social concerns... )

[Cossack]

Originally posted by CountZero
That is the wonderfull thing about mods, if you have a subset of players who LIKE to play it complicated, then they can. If you do not like the changes, no one is forcing anyone to use them.

Some mods have a goal of Balance, other historical accuracy, others, just change it up for the fun of it. Whatever the case may be, if you are interested in a particular mod, then post suggestions, but if a mod does not interest you, or if you do not agree with the goal of the mod, then there is no need to post.

In otherwords, if someone wants to tie every single unit/building to a different reasource, then they have every right to, reguardless of the vision or goals or intentions of Firaxis.

CountZero

Thanks for the support CountZero,

Obviously everyone can use the scenario editor to change which units require what and what abundance each resource should have, in this respect the editor is very easy to use.

Anyway I am in the process of reducing the copper requirements for early age units this will be included in an updated resources updated mod to be posted soon.

Tried to introduce tin however, there appears to be a problem getting it to appear on the map, this is a graphics problem, and I have encountered the same situation with the silver resource. Plutarch has told me that he will look into it when he has some free time. Until we locate the problem it appears that I can only add the copper and zinc resource pictures.

With regards to tin, players have the same resource complaint regarding abundance of and accessing the ore to build the units that require it in the ancient era period, the same complaint that was put forward about copper. However, tin's usage since this period has dropped dramatically since this time and in the modern era appears to have limited military applications from a gaming point of view.

I have changed zinc to Lead-Zinc as the two metals occur so frequently together in reality. Lead zinc becomes available on the discovery of invention and is a requirement for many middle age gunpowder units and modern era units. Once I update the graphic I will post it here.

I will increase the abundance of oil and coal, coal was two low anyway and so was oil 120 or two resources per player, when in reality either coal and/or oil occur in many countries to some extent, whether it is economical to extract them is an entirely different question.

I will also update the civilopedia files accordingly, there are some errors at present. Comments regarding nickel, please see the civilopedia file or inspect the US Geological Survey's desription of nickel, its occurrence and applications.

I think that there is a timber resource in the resource.pcx file I know someone mentioned it, but until I find out what is stopping more certain graphics appearing on the map it is fairly pointless adding it and also I think its relevance is limited.

The English Cossack

[LouLong]

New Ressources

Thanks a lot for your job.

I appreciate Civ mods a lot, for the freedom you have to use them or not.

I agree nevertheless about the fact that playability can be hampered by early needed ressources.

On the other hand, I will definitely use bronze, timber (cedar), papyrus... for ancient scenarii or modpacks. So it is a good move.

Thanks for the initiation...

Regards,

[Ian_Notter]

At present tin is near essential to the electronics industry as it is used to make solder. For many years the US kept vast quantities of tin in its strategic materials reserve because of the problems encountered during WWII when the Japanese captured nearly all the worlds main tin producing areas.

Ian

[Kc7mxo]

If you want oil in the ocean, just let it appear on any beach square. This will represent how its in the ocean, and can be accesed from this area of beach. but its still kinda pointless.

and adding too many strategic resources will just bog down the game. unless you add lots of units as well. which will be . . . . confusing.

[ahenobarb]

Hey, Cossack -- let me know what you and Plutarck figure out about the graphics problem. I too have been trying to add resources (a few of them slightly different from yours), but I am running into the same problem, i.e. the game recognizes the resources, but does not make them visible. I went through last night (after beating my head against the wall for the last 2 weeks) and just put colored blotches in the second to last and last row of resources (the empty ones). Nothing, man. Nothing.

I don't think the game is programmed to look in those squares, I think they might be blanks used by the graphics team similar to the last row of units in civ II (although eventually, a version of civ II came out that allowed you to use those squares).

At any rate, dfm3013@aol.com if you wanna co-miserate.

You are right about the "and/or" function, I wish there was a way to implement that!!

[Alexandre Madeira]

Having this problem too.
Thing is, you can see the graphic in the Editor, and not just the rules editor, you can see it on the map editor too. But not in the game, weird.

[Goth]

How about silicon???

I think I'll try adding silicon as a required resource (since there are not enough late in the game). I figure it could be enabled with the discovery of computers and would be required to build the following units:

Modern Armor
Aegis Cruiser
Stealth Bomber
Stealth Fighter

That way (except maybe for the bomber) it would not cause a serious balance issue. If anyone is interested, please note it here and I'll post the files.

[taffarel]

As long as we're talking about resources....

How about either adding or changing the luxuries. I saw someone mention this earlier in the thread. Some luxuries seem to have been forgotten.

Two of the main ones are Tea and Sugar. Especially Tea. There was a whole period in the history of the UK where clippers were sent ridculous distances to obtain it. Sugar is the basis of some counties whole economies.

How about Tobacco, coffee (already mentioned I think), and cocoa. If I recall correctly, there was a big thing in the news a while back saying that there might be a world cocoa shortage some time in the near future because supply can not keep up with demand due to the growing conditions of the plant.

Salt, maybe? Some places in the world make money from their salt-flats. It could be added as a desert resource.

I do think that Timber would make a good strategic resource as without it we dont have paper, which lets face it, is fairly important.

Someone mentioned Silicon as a Strategic Resource, but I'm not sure about this one as it can be restricting to some Civs. The reason is that Silicon is the most abundant resource in the natural world, so everyone already has it, so no-one today has to get it from anyone.

I like civ 3, but I do feel that some resources, strategic or luxury, are a little too rare. In my last game Rubber and Saltpeter were a bit of a nightmare as I recall.

[MrWhereItsAt]

Generalizations aside, my own opinion of the mod

I'm not going to make any broad conclusions about mods or extra resources "breaking" the game or whatnot, just say what I think about THIS mod.

I liked the idea of extra resources (this is the first mod I felt was worthy of any attention!), yet I have found that having copper needed for such crucial early units as spearmen is very painful. I have not (in the two games using this mod to date) been without copper, but it has been distanced enough from my cities as to be a major issue slowing down my early development. Also, those new cities in crucial spots, where you need a city before even building a road to your capital from there, can no longer build any adequate defense for ages. I've had some hairy encounters with the conveniently copper rich English as a result of this.

I do suggest ppl try this (NB watch out for the zinc picture - it is misrepresented on the map with the horse icon - is easy to fix in the editor), BUT be warned, you may be without decent units until iron or even much later in the game if your cities aren't all connected..

[Venger]

Originally posted by taffarel
As long as we're talking about resources....

How about either adding or changing the luxuries.

Two of the main ones are Tea and Sugar. Especially Tea. There was a whole period in the history of the UK where clippers were sent ridculous distances to obtain it. Sugar is the basis of some counties whole economies.

How about Tobacco, coffee (already mentioned I think), and cocoa.

Hey you ripped off my old luxuries thread almost verbatim! I posted a thread many days ago about new luxuries, and I mentioned specifically sugar, tobacco, and coffee...

Great minds think alike...I'd like to see more, but rarer, luxuries. Maybe only a clump of 2 or 3 max...instead of the huge clumps of 4 you can find now. And much fewer of them. This will emphasize trade and encourage friendly networks...

Venger

[Cossack]

O.K. after alot of testing here is an updated resources mod, with some changes to naval movement as well, hope this addresses some of the problems people noted earlier about copper, oil etc.

Firstly copper is only a requirement in order to build the Colossus in the ancient era.

Zinc has now become Lead-Zinc as the lead mineral galena and the zinc mineral sphalerite occur together frequently in real life ore deposits/concentrations plus the graphic has altered slightly.

Due to graphical problems I have had to delete incense and replaced it with nickel (blue ore graphic).

Changed oil back to only occuring on land and increased its appearance ratio to 160 (originally 120) and decreased its disappearance probability to 1 chance in 100 every turn).

Tundra now can have iron, gold, copper, lead-zinc, gems and nickel deposits to reflect the presence of these deposits in northern regions of Russia and Canada in addition to the previous resources.

Desert now can have gold, oil and nickel (Australian nickel-laterite deposits)

Aluminium in plains, forest and jungles to relect the need for flat or more importantly a recent tropical weathering environment.

Hills and mountains hold copper, nickel and lead-zinc deposits.

Updated the civilopedia for unit requirements, in general no ancient civilization units require copper

Middle ages' units with saltpetre require lead-zinc e.g. musketmen, cannon, privateer etc.

Riflemen and infantry units require nickel and lead-zinc.

Ironclad now requires lead-zinc as well.

Most modern naval units require lead-zinc and copper except aegis cruiser that requires uranium and lead zinc as does the nuclear submarine.

All modern army units from riflemen onwards require nickel except radar artillery.

All aircraft units require copper.

Naval Movement, most units doubled
Exceptions:
Frigate and Man O'war movement 5
Ironclad movement 6
Transport movement 8

Destroyers can now see submarines

Submarine (both) attack doubled
Submarine (both) Movement 6

Detailed changes to natural resources

Coal
Appearance Probability: 240
(coal deposits are numerous throughout the world)

Disappearance Probability: 400
(most coal seams/ deposits are extremely large and if coal occurs in an area then there are generally a large number of similar deposits in the same area)

Terrain
Hills
Mountains (although coal shouldn't really occur in mountains as the tectonic temperatures and pressures converts the minerals into different forms)
Jungle

Oil
Appearance Probability: 160 (increased to 160 as there are numerous oil occurences throughout the world)

Disappearance Probability: 100 (most oil deposits/basins are extracted over a 10 to 30 year basis therefore deposits would appear to have less than 100 year lives)

Rubber - Same

Aluminium
2 Shields
2 Commerce

Appearance Probability: 120
Disappearance Probability: 400

Uranium
1 Shields
1 Commerce (Previously 3) as it does not have a large commercial market in comparison with other metals and large quantities are not required.

Appearance Probability: 100
Disappearance Probability: 100

Copper
1 Shields
2 Commerce

Appearance Probability: 160
Disappearance Probability: 200
Requires (Bronze-working)

Lead-Zinc
1 Shields
1 Commerce

Appearance Probability: 160
Disappearance Probability: 200
Requires (Invention)

Nickel
1 Shields
1 Commerce

Appearance Probability: 120
Disappearance Probability: 200
Requirements (Metallurgy)

[Malleus]

Could someone explain (or ICQ) me with how you can add new resources? I would like to add a select group of resources:
Copper
Tin
Salt
Sugar
Coffee
Tea
Tobacco
I have not seen a mod to deal with all of these. I guess I am hoiping someone will take me aside and help me get going with these.

K

[squeeze truck]

My Review (played mod to modern age)

Frankly, I like the mod. Good work Cossack. Rather than tell you what I think needs to be changed, let me tell you how the changes played out in the 20+ games I played with your mod installed.

I don't recall ever being seriously hampered by a lack of copper. In fact it seems to me that copper is now the most abundant resource in the game. In one game as the Russians, my second city had seven copper deposits within its radius. My only beef about copper availability is that it seems that you increased the rate at which deposits dissappear and reappear. Over half of the time immediately after building a road to my first (and sometimes only) copper deposit, it would disappear on the very same turn. Very annoying.

The AI acts strangely when it does not have copper. Playing the Egyptians, the Romans right next to me had iron but no copper. Meaning they had many legions but no spearmen. Even though legions have a defense of 3, Rome chose to garrison all its cities with barbarians who have a defense of 1. This is because the game does not flag legions as being defensive units. The numerically superior Romans were wiped out with bright yellow charriots with only a 2 attack strength.

In the same game, I had no access to nickel. I fought a huge war with China to obtain saltpeter, only to discover that I could not build riflemen or infantry in the next age. My musketmen fell like field mice under a rotary mower to angry Babylonian infanry. (I say keep it this way!)

Current game, playing as India. I have discovered refining, and to my great dismay ALL of the oil resources but one are in the ocean (!!!). The one land-based oil deposit is in Northern Germany, on the exact opposite side of the globe.
I am piling infantry and marines on galleons and sending them halfway 'round the world to take the one city with the oil. I expect to be met by battleships, fighters, and panzers by the time I get there. Wish me luck.