A Strategic Analysis of the Special Units (LONG)

[BigFurryMonster]

Actually, mobile units like horsemen now have to "make a die roll" (civ3.com) to see if they withdraw. I suppose this means that a random number is drawn (they're probably not using real dice )

The advantage of horsemen compared to stronger but slower attack units is now smaller. It is not mentioned what the chance of withdrawal/death is, unfortunately. It is mentioned, however, that this chance becomes more favourable with the unit's experience.

[Ossi]

Upgrade Horseman to Chinese Riders?

Does anybody know if it is possible to upgrade Horseman to Chinese Riders? And if not, are they directly upgradable to Cavalry?

Ossi

[Hurricane]

Re: Upgrade Horseman to Chinese Riders?

Originally posted by Ossi
Does anybody know if it is possible to upgrade Horseman to Chinese Riders? And if not, are they directly upgradable to Cavalry?

Yes. Chinese Riders then upgrade to Cavalry.

[Ossi]

Re: Re: Upgrade Horseman to Chinese Riders?

Originally posted by Hurricane


Yes. Chinese Riders then upgrade to Cavalry.

And Horseman to Riders?

[Arrian]

Yes, and horsemen to Riders, provided you have the proper resources.

-Arrian

[King of Rasslin]

Riders don't require iron

[player1]

Riders don't require horses

[King of Rasslin]

Wrong. Samurai don't require horses, Riders don't require iron.

[player1]

Rasslin,
That was a JOKE.


But,

Riders need BOTH Iron & Horses.
I checked in editor just to be sure.

[Austin]

Two points:

(1) Horse mounted units are way out of wack in this game. The domination of cavalry on the battlefield ended with gunpowder, period, full stop. The primary gunpowder era attack unit should NOT be frigging cavalry! Riflemen should be 6-6, and musketeers should be 4-4.

(2) This is why the French musketeer is so out of wack as a UU. I am assuming that the musket units represent the 1750~1850 or so era of firearms, which would dovetail nicely with France's "historical" golden age.

The big advantage that the armies of Napoleon had over his opponents was that they were very fast moving.

So the French musketeer would be better represented as a two move musket.

Austin

[dawidge]

Mounted warfare has died and been reborn so many times that the phoenix is green from envy. You seem to have interpreted "cavalry" to mean "mounted troops". This is far from the truth. Capital-C-Cavalry is a family of tactics which rely on mobility. Invented during the American War of Independance by Casimir Pulaski, it didn't even come along until long after gunpowder had been established as the dominant battlefield armament. CP used mounted "regular" musketmen to harass "veteran" and "elite" British musketmen using hit-and-fade methods on terrain of his choosing. Cavalry really came into its own with repeating firearms during the American Civil War (and some really amazing mobile artillery work (by Phil Sheridan?)). Cavalry-as-represented-by-riflemen-on-horseback died in the opening days of WW2 under the hobnailed boots of Guderian's cavalry-in-armor-with-a-really-really-big-gun (and even then the Poles took out an awful lot of tanks thanks to the maneuverability of horse-cavalry). It has since died and been reborn as modern armor, airmobile infantry, and helicopter gunships. Cavalry as a tactic will live forever, but it may not necessarily be recognized as having evolved from sabres and muskets on horseback.

If you want to get down to it, gunpowder didn't kill any existing form of mounted troop when it burst (heh) on the scene. The armored knight/cavalier was taken down by the crossbow at a time when "handgunners" were so horribly inaccurate that they were only useful in massed formations against massed formations. The musket spelled the death of all preexisting armaments not from its inherent superiority, but by the virtue that anybody could be trained to use it in a very short timeframe and it was easy to manufacture. A crossbow had longer range, greater accuracy, and faster reload time, but required more careful craftsmanship in construction and skill in use. The age-old sword rush was the prime victim of gunpowder.

Napolean's "fast-moving" armies were only fast when going through France. They didn't do well at all in Russia and they didn't save him at Waterloo.

The French "Musketeer " were highly skilled musketmen and fencers, accurately represented in the game, and disappeared along with the Royalists when Napolean came to power.

Since before recorded time, the most effective offensive unit, is a very fast form of the most effective ground unit. They sacrifice a little defense for mobility and gain a stronger attack. If anything "killed" cavalry, it was the industrial revolution, but it didn't kill it, it transformed it. From 1800 until 1930, Cavalry represented the sharp end of the stick for the world's premier armies.

[Pythagoras]

For me the babylonian bowman is so much cooler because it doesnt require any resources and only an easy to get tech. I have been backed into a corner due to building temples early ignoring military, I just set every city to pump out bowman which can both defend AND attack and at the least be able to have something at the border to meet the incoming hordes. Units that can take and give at some punishment. Then with temples in every city, if I DO geta city captured they have a good chance of coming back to me (the AI never builds temples right off).

[punkbass2000]

The drawback to Bowmen, IMO, is their upgrade path. I typically build spearmen for defensive positions instead of bowmen because they will be usefully upgraded throughout the game.

[Pythagoras]

Originally posted by punkbass2000
The drawback to Bowmen, IMO, is their upgrade path. I typically build spearmen for defensive positions instead of bowmen because they will be usefully upgraded throughout the game.

Yeah I avoid building bowman for typical city defense, but they still come in handy when you need to bolster a city under attack.

They do upgrade to longbowman, which have a 1 defense, so I typically dont upgrade them :-/. Once the middle ages comes around, or once I have time to get a sufficient swordsman force, I disband them to make libraries.

[vmxa1]

Not saying that you are wrong, but in the US Calv they had guns and were effective until machine guns and air planes. After the civil war Calv use rifles on ghorseback and dismounted in Indian battles (please no PC). Large part of Asia used Cal well into the 20th Century. I too think the musket is too weak. In the game they end to not beat armour.