Is there any way to fix Corruption???

[drspock]

I'm playing the original Civ III with no expansions and one of the patches from Firaxis and I am, like I see a lot of people are/have been, frustrated with the overwhelming amount of corruption in my cities. I'm playing with one super-continent in a huge world, and my empire is huge, well over the "suggested" maximum.

My cities are plagued by corruption, with cities of all sizes producing just a single shield. I have read some of the threads on this site pertaining to the matter and I understand how it is calculated, and I also understand no matter how many improvements I build it will do nothing. Worst of all, I build my Forbidden Palace early on, so it is located close to my regular Palace, so it does little to aleviate the situation.

I am wondering if anyone has made a Mod or there is any way this game can possibely be changed so that it can be, in my opinion, playable again. I just want to be able to elimante corruption like was possible in Civ 2.

I think the ridiculous way in which Civ III calculated corruption is absolutely awful, I think the courthouse should completely nullify, or at least DRASTICALLY reduce corruption, and that in the modern era, corruption based on distance should not be a factor. Modern empires are bound by technology and no matter how far away a city is it is only a plane flight away, and corruption shouldnt be effecting this.

I really hope there is some solution to this, because if there isn't, Civ 3 is really a flawed game. How can they possibely offer conquest as a victory condition in a huge world if after a certain point, any new city you gain is about as useful as the dirt its built on?

Please somebody tell me about a Mod that can fix this!!!

[Kloreep]

Re: Is there any way to fix Corruption???

Originally posted by drspock
I really hope there is some solution to this, because if there isn't, Civ 3 is really a flawed game. How can they possibely offer conquest as a victory condition in a huge world if after a certain point, any new city you gain is about as useful as the dirt its built on?

I'm sure alexman will pop in here to say the same thing, but corruption gives the underdog a chance rather than making land=victory. By limiting the amount of conquered land that can be useful, it weakens conquest and thereby makes building a more viable method of play. But that's just my opinion.

Originally posted by drspock
Please somebody tell me about a Mod that can fix this!!!

You should be able to create one yourself; IIRC the corruption slider in the Difficulty Levels tab was added in vanilla civ. Just go in to the editor, enable custom rules, go to the difficulty levels tab, and drag the slider down to whatever % you desire for each level you may be playing it. Then save your mod and use it to start new games.

[alexman]

Re: Re: Is there any way to fix Corruption???

Originally posted by Kloreep

I'm sure alexman will pop in here to say the same thing,

Seriously, here's what I wrote in another such thread, just two days ago:

[corruption nazi mode]

Booo! Learn to play with corruption!

Corruption makes sure that the first civilization to win a war doesn't run away with the game.

Corruption gives the underdog a chance to win.

Corruption gives the builder more gratification for overcoming it, and the warmonger more challenge to succeed.

The game has been balanced for corruption. Remove it (or reduce it) and you have an unbalanced game.

[/corruption nazi mode]

I should just put this in my signature.

[alva]

Hmmm, exactly how often do you scan Poly for the word ''corruption' ???

[Theseus]

Go Commie, build Courthouses and Police Stations *everywhere* (including in your core and capitol), and build the Secret Police.

Problem solved.

Learn to love it, baby!!

[drspock]

I don't think it balances the game but rather the opposite. In the real world larger countries almost always have an advantage, and I do not believe that a smaller country and a larger country should be balanced, building could be a viable option if it were possible to focus on it, but another critique I have of the game is that there aren't enough improvements and every nation can fairly easily build them all. If there were more, then a smaller one might be able to focus on it and then it would be balanced with a larger one, but having a larger nation plagued by corruption like that just isn't fair, or accurate in my view.

[alexman]

Originally posted by drspock
I don't think it balances the game but rather the opposite. In the real world larger countries...

In the real world there are other factors that limit large countries. These factors are not present in the game.

Realism and game balance are two very different issues, often at odds with each other. Civ3 might be a game based on history, but it's not a simulation. When having to choose between realism and gameplay, the designers have consitently chosen the latter.

[Theseus]

Real world versus gameplay debate:

Go Commie!!

[Republic sucks]

[Nor Me]

Re: Is there any way to fix Corruption???

Originally posted by drspock
Worst of all, I build my Forbidden Palace early on, so it is located close to my regular Palace, so it does little to aleviate the situation.

Then move your palace; all it needs is a leader. As this is the original civ3, there is a bug which would allow you to have a large empire with minimal corruption, provided that there are few cities close to the palace. The rank corruption of a city close to the FP depends on the number of cities closer to the palace than the city is to the FP.

With a completely isolated palace, many cities will be on vurtually no corruption. I've seen this abused very well but I can't give you a link as CFC seems to be down.

[Dry]

Re: Is there any way to fix Corruption???

Other possible mods (for vanilla):
- Give all small wonders the Forbidden Palace 'reduce corruption' ability.
- Multiply the number of Forbidden Palaces. Make Winter, Summer, Spring and Autumn Palaces.

[Whoha]

Mark every building as "reduces corruption".

[drspock]

I'm not sure what mod you two are referring too, but even so, that would be a lot more like cheating just to help my own empire, rather then making something like the courthouse eliminate corruption (as it should) and have the same effect for any civilization.

*Sigh* I guess Civ II: Test of Time is the best Civilization I'll have unless the 4th one is hopefully better.

Oh and by the way, I don't know about the expansions but at least in the original game of Civ III, balance is not at all accomplished in my opinion. There are "other" ways to win besides complete domination, but for any of them your empire basically has to be biggest/one of the biggest anyway. The game is almost entirely geared towards military combat and expansion as the only method of moving up. In any city at any point in the game, it is much much easier to simply pump out hordes of soldiers then bother building the very time consuming and sparse city improvements.

If they wanted the game to be balanced so it wouldnt be, build the biggest army and win the most territory, then they would have designed it originally with many many more improvements, ex. lots of improvements that will improve your research or money or production, each more difficult to build then the last. This would offer the oppurtunity for a non warlike nation to focus on this rather then conquest, while a more militaristic civilization wouldn't have the time to build all those improvements because they were building units, and they would be more equal to the industrious nation.

This was not the case, clearly. I suppose such rampant and unrealistic corruption was a cheap and easy way to try and curb the conquest of empires which they encourage through just about every other feature of the game. This most definitely is a design flaw in my opinion and severely hampers this game from being great. If you still disagree then just try playing a game like MoO2 and the basically being told once you've conquered a good portion of the galaxy, "oh by the way, now any new colonies you get will produce nilch, its to balance the game, you know." It would have ruined that game as I feel it ruins this one.

[Antrine]

Epitaph

Sharpening up my marble chisels just now, what would you have put on your headstone, drspock?

‘drspock’ he was here
Less than a flash
First fire sad smashed
By corruption lain waste

[Whoha]

Originally posted by drspock
I'm not sure what mod you two are referring too, but even so, that would be a lot more like cheating just to help my own empire, rather then making something like the courthouse eliminate corruption (as it should) and have the same effect for any civilization.

*Sigh* I guess Civ II: Test of Time is the best Civilization I'll have unless the 4th one is hopefully better.

Oh and by the way, I don't know about the expansions but at least in the original game of Civ III, balance is not at all accomplished in my opinion. There are "other" ways to win besides complete domination, but for any of them your empire basically has to be biggest/one of the biggest anyway. The game is almost entirely geared towards military combat and expansion as the only method of moving up. In any city at any point in the game, it is much much easier to simply pump out hordes of soldiers then bother building the very time consuming and sparse city improvements.

If they wanted the game to be balanced so it wouldnt be, build the biggest army and win the most territory, then they would have designed it originally with many many more improvements, ex. lots of improvements that will improve your research or money or production, each more difficult to build then the last. This would offer the oppurtunity for a non warlike nation to focus on this rather then conquest, while a more militaristic civilization wouldn't have the time to build all those improvements because they were building units, and they would be more equal to the industrious nation.

This was not the case, clearly. I suppose such rampant and unrealistic corruption was a cheap and easy way to try and curb the conquest of empires which they encourage through just about every other feature of the game. This most definitely is a design flaw in my opinion and severely hampers this game from being great. If you still disagree then just try playing a game like MoO2 and the basically being told once you've conquered a good portion of the galaxy, "oh by the way, now any new colonies you get will produce nilch, its to balance the game, you know." It would have ruined that game as I feel it ruins this one.

We are talking about modifying the rules in the civ3mod.bic file. double click on it and explore stuff.

[Konquest02]

Originally posted by Theseus
Real world versus gameplay debate:

Go Commie!!

[Republic sucks]

He's playing Vanilla Civ III, Theseus... Want to change your opinion...?

--Kon--