Spearman Upgrade to Numidian Mercenaries instead of PikeMen?

[Gray_Lensman]

My vanilla version of Conquests after the version 1.22 upgrade, has my Spearmen set to upgrade to Pikemen in the default "conquests.biq" file.

Of course, there is no upgrade available unless you are the Carthagians and their default Spearman units are the race specific Numidian Mercenaries, obviously a MAJOR bug. This bug is definitely 'squashable', however, but it means that ALL owners will have to acquaint themselves with the use of the editor and make a permanent change to the operating "Conquest.biq" file.

Could anyone tell me if they observed this bug in the original Conquests before the 1.22 upgrade?

[Solomwi]

Mine shows the spearman set to upgrade to NM, so I'm assuming that's what you mean, since I can't fathom how spear set to upgrade to pike would be a major bug.

I'm still not sure how this is a bug, though, since the NM is set to upgrade to Pikeman, meaning that when a civ to whom the NM is not available upgrades a spear, it passes right over the NM to pike.

[Gray_Lensman]

The Numidian Mercenary is a race specific unit replacing the Spearman in the Carthagian civilization. It is not a unit for other races such as the American race to have access to in normal games. Also it is not as strong as a Pikeman, but then again it is not meant to be, since it replaces the Spearman as mentioned above and since it is a race specific unit, it does not have an upgrade. Also, note the Civilopedia still says that the Spearman upgrades to Pikeman, whereas the Numidian Mercenary has no upgrade.

Also, did some other checking and 1 of the Conquest scenarios is probably flawed too

Intro3 New Alliances (This one probably does not matter since it is limited to 100 turns, however if a person changes the number of turns at the start...)

At least this bug can be edited out.

[Solomwi]

1. The NM is stronger than the pikeman (2/3/1/BW compared to 1/3/1/F, and both at 30 shields).

2. You still haven't shown how the upgrade designation is a bug, only an ignorance of the way upgrade paths work in the editor.

3. Again, since the NM is civ specific, when a non-Carthage civ goes to upgrade spearmen, it skips past the NM in the upgrade path and goes straight to the NM's designated upgrade... the pikeman.

4. Since the pikeman is likewise unavailable to Carthage, when it comes time to upgrade the NM, it skips up the upgrade path to the next available unit... the musketman.

5. It works in all cases, ergo, it's not a bug.

[Gray_Lensman]

I stand corrected on the strength comparisons.

However, if you check the the other race specific units, in the editor, none of them none of them are upgradeable, and most of them are only available to one, possibly two other civilizations. (not sure)

Also, since the Numidian Mercenary is set to only be available to the Carthagian group, it cannot be an upgrade to the other civilizations, hence the bug.

I have a current game as the Americans, that has the Spearmen upgrade set to Numidian Infantry, and my Spearmen cannot be upgraded. This is why I found and checked out the bug in the first place.

[Solomwi]

I've played 1.22 with several different civs, and not had a problem upgrading spears in any of the games. My guess is that you either lack iron, lack barracks where you're trying to upgrade or lack the cash to upgrade. Again, if a unit not available to a particular civ is in the upgrade path, it is simply skipped over, hence no bug.

Every other unique unit is upgradeable (except the F-15, which is at the end of the upgrade chain anyway), and none are available to more than one civilization, so I'm not really sure what you're talking about with that part.

Check the three things I mentioned, or post a save, and see if that doesn't fix your problem.

[Gray_Lensman]

Let's see:

I'm playing Americans
I have Iron, I'm building Medieval Infantry.
I have a barracks in every city, (probably overkill)
I have 100 credits
plus, the unit has not moved yet... (not sure if that matters|)

so.... barring a bad install/upgrade. I'd say there is a problem.

ps. I'm going to rule out a bad install, because more than one BIQ has this set this way.

[Solomwi]

Post a save, please. I've yet to encounter this problem with any of the civs I've played in 1.22, or in the previous incarnations, where the same upgrading through a unique unit technique was used.

[Gray_Lensman]

Before I post a save, I'm going to do a reinstall, just to be sure it was not induced by me in my editing trials.

This particular save is part of an edited BIQ file, so I can't rule that possibility out, although the original BIQs that I have never touched (they were backed up), have the Spearman upgrade set to Numidian Infantry.

[Solomwi]

Ahhh, I think we're getting somewhere now. I can assure you that the spearman being set to upgrade to NM isn't, in and of itself, a problem, as long as the NM is still set to upgrade to pikeman. First thing I'd check is the NM upgrade path.

[vmxa1]

I am guessing that you do not have th ecash to upgrade a spear to a Musket. It cost what 120 to upgrade from spear to Musket?

Most all UU can upgrade, except for things that end the line such as Ottomans UU and USA.

You won't be able to upgrade just to pike from spear, since you have Musket, pikes are no longer available.

You will now have to have saltpetter.

[Gray_Lensman]

I'm not trying to upgrade to Musket...

I'm trying to upgrade Spearman to Pikeman, which I believe is 20 credits.

besides the point is moot. The upgrade path for most units in the game (Spearman) is supposed to be Pikeman, not Numidian Infantry. And I am guessing since the Numidian Infantry is set to be only available to the Carthagian player, that is the reason as an American player, that I can't upgrade the Spearman I have, all other criteria being meant.

[Solomwi]

Vmxa, if you're thinking of muskets from my post, that was just to carry the idea through. I don't think he has GP yet. Even if he did, wouldn't pikes still be available if he didn't have saltpeter?

I'm betting the upgrade for NM got changed to either musket or none in the editor.

[Gray_Lensman]

I'm building Pikeman, it's just that I have a bunch of garrisoned Spearman that would be better utilized as upgraded Pikeman...

[Gray_Lensman]

Well, in my haste to uninstall/reinstall, I saved my edited BIQ files, but forgot to save the actual game in another location... Doh! Damn, I had hours in that puppy...

I'll have to reproduce the error after the install, it'll take me a while. Probably use the debug mode of the editor to save time.