Crossing those green ocean squares

[RO]

Hi,

I cannot figure out how to cross the green ocean squares in the underworld. How is that done?

The port cities do not seem to be able to build boats (at least not longboats) and the bats (whom I suppose are flying creatures) cannot fly across.

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Enjoy,

Robert

[RO]

Hmm, still no reply . Last night I managed to fly a Thundebolt(?) across. Not much use, as it dies at the end of the turn, but better than nothing.

Doesn't anybody know how to cross these?

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Enjoy,

Robert

[Cam]

OK - here's a quick answer that 'might' even be right!

The Longboats one is less difficult - they're only allowed on the surface world map, and can't exist on any of the other maps. See Column 'B' in @UNITS_ADVANCED in the rules.txt file.

The Giant Bats matter I suspect is caused by the fact they've got 'Alpine' ability. It 'could' be a matter that even though they're flying units, the flag means that they can't cross ocean. It's true for that unit on the surface map too.

I believe one thing you might be able to do if you're playing the Elves is use the (E) Changeling unit to paradrop across(?). I've not tested this in normal gameplay circumstances admittedly, but in a manuafactured game it indicated that the paradrop was not allowed onto an island surrounded by vaulted ocean, however upon pressing the left-mouse button, the paradrop worked nonetheless.

Your Thunderbolts can be used as scouts if they move half their range and return to the city.

Hope that helps.


[This message has been edited by Cam (edited January 05, 2001).]

[RO]

Thanks, Cam, that does help.

I'm still curious as to how to get my settlers across. Perhaps there is a boat somewhere along the research tree that can be built in the underworld, or perhaps this was simply overlooked in game production.

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Enjoy,

Robert

[Cam]

RO

Hmmm... I've gotta confess that I rarely play the Fantasy Game (although I'm still trying to win Midgard without racing to a 'spaceship' victory as I always seem to do)...

As such, it is without any great authority that I suggest using the map-to-map transporters by having settler units build them on the surface map, and sending both military and settler-type units down underground into your previously unaccessable areas. Once you get a few Astral Portals built and/or use the transport sites, you should be able to get more units and caravans down there, and start moving things along.

As for using boats - glancing at the rules there are only three boat types that can carry units - Longboats, Dragon Boats, and Shield Boats. Of these, only one may appear on any other than the surface world, being the Shield Boat which is built by the Elves and may be constructed and used only in the surface and underwater maps. As such, the chance of boat transport along the vaulted ocean in the underworld looks pretty well a non-event.

'John P', 'Toby R' - any advice?
[This message has been edited by Cam (edited January 05, 2001).]

[RO]

Thanks, Cam.

It's strange that there is no underworld boat.

I haven't really paid too much attention to the map-to-map movement stuff. Some units can do that on its own, but I don't think a Settler can do that.

In Midgard it seems that the Siege Engine tech is available somewhat sooner than in the Fantasy game. It's hard to be sure, though, as the timelime is different. It would have been a better scenario without the Siege Engine, as the SE effectively stops the game before you have a chance to complete very many of the "quests". Anybody know how to disable that in the scenario?


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Enjoy,

Robert

[Cam]

quote: Originally posted by RO on 01-06-2001 04:48 AM I haven't really paid too much attention to the map-to-map movement stuff. Some units can do that on its own, but I don't think a Settler can do that.

I believe most settler-type units can go from the surface world to the underworld through a transport site, although this 'might' not be the case for Buteo Settlers. It would appear that some settlers (Stygian, Buteo, and Merfolk) have natural transport abilities between select maps, but not all.

quote: Originally posted by RO on 01-06-2001 04:48 AM In Midgard it seems that the Siege Engine tech is available somewhat sooner than in the Fantasy game. It's hard to be sure, though, as the timelime is different. It would have been a better scenario without the Siege Engine, as the SE effectively stops the game before you have a chance to complete very many of the "quests". Anybody know how to disable that in the scenario?

I would disable the Deus Ex Machina wonder (by changing its prerequisite to 'no'), or remove the lines;

ENABLETECHNOLOGY
whom=Triggerreceiver
technology=76
value=0

from the event titled Brian's Expedition (having copied and renamed the original events.txt for later restoration).

I assume you mean the 'seige engine' victory, not the unit.

[This message has been edited by Cam (edited January 06, 2001).]

[The Mad Monk]

I decided that there wasn't any good reason that there shouldn't be a boat unit in the underworld, either realism-wise (as if that counted for anything), or balance-wise. Since there weren't any open slots for new units, I modified the longboat so it can be built in the underworld, but didn't add any kind of transport ability, so that any longboat remians on the map where it's built.

Hope this helps!

[Miner]

quote: Originally posted by RO on 01-04-2001 09:45 AM ...and the bats (whom I suppose are flying creatures) cannot fly across.

You suppose wrong! The bats are land units, check out their domain in rules.txt:

Great Bats, nil, 0, 1.,0, 5a,4d, 1h,2f, 5,0, 3, Fli, 000001000000000

They might have an icon that implies they fly, but they are thoroughly grounded!

Cam, I'm suprised you didn't spot that!

[Cam]

Errr... Ummm.... (Panic)....

Yeah - but their 'role' is air superiority - their 'domain' just happens to be land.

Miner, you're quite right - I was focussed on that '3' down the other end of the stats. Where's that embarassed smiley?...

[RO]

Mad Monk,

Your suggestion is good, but I checked in rules.txt and got confused.

The advanced Longboat setting is:

Longboat
11011111, 00001110, 0, 0000000000000000,0000000000000000,0000000000000000 , 00000000 ;

This tells me that it can be built on all maps excpet map 0 (sky?) and by all tribes except Merfolk. Just for reference, here is the explanation from rules.txt:

; Advanced unit fields

; A) 'tribe may build' mask: 0 - can't; 1 - can
; bit order from right to left - barbarian, infidel, human, goblin, stygian, merfolk, elvish, buteo
;
; B) 'not allowed on map' mask: 1 - not allowed on map
; bit order from right to left - map 0, map 1, map 2, map 3. The remaining four bits currently aren't used
;

This does not match the finding I had where the Stygians could not build longboats in the underworld

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Enjoy,

Robert
[This message has been edited by RO (edited January 08, 2001).]

[Cam]

In the second batch of figures, 00001110, read right to left. The most right hand side figure is the surface world (map 0), then undersea world (map 1), underworld (map 2), and cloud world (map 3). The four figures to the left are superfluous.

1 = "Not allowed on map" - therefore the Longboat is not allowed on any map other than the surface world (being the zero at the extreme right).

You're right about the Merfolk - they can't build the Longboat unit. I guess they have the Porpoise unit which is not quite as good in some respects (hit points, carries only one) but better in others (can move into the undersea world, doesn't sink off-shore, can't be seen by most units, i.z.c., cheaper to produce).

[This message has been edited by Cam (edited January 08, 2001).]

[RO]

Oh, thanks, I must have been sleepy or something (it was just before I went to work).

Thanks a lot to all of you

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Enjoy,

Robert