why do i suck?

[cemcnulty]

I've been playing Civ Test of Time for a long time, and typically, I can clean the floor with the AI at Prince level, but have a lot of trouble at King and anything higher is impossible.

From stories I've read and heard of people mastering the game, I've come to the assumption that my basic strategy must be for crap.

One strategy that I've always followed but am beginning to question is that of build cities early, build them fast, and keep building them.

As a rule, the first thing my cities build is one defensive unit (phalanx) followed immediately by one settler, unless a temple is needed to keep the peace. Depending on the size of the continent, I usually just keep doing this (with maybe one or two units out exploring) until I find another civilization. At that point, the nearest half of my civilization will try to take out the new civilization, while my cities further back are pouring out more settlers, wonders, barracks, etc.

Especially at the King level, I usually make a mad dash for the Great Library because otherwise I fall hopelessly behind. After that, I make Leonardo's Workshop my next big priority.

My big question is, what are the fundamental strategies that work extremely well in the game, and why doesn't amassing huge amounts of cities work very well?

[Lews Therìn]

At some point, you need to switch over from building settlers and founding cities to having one active settler per city busy improving that city. This will give you the population and trade needed to research technologies faster than the AI.

[Cam]

cemcnulty,

It seems like you're attempting ICS. Rather than write a thesis on Civ Strategy, try these links and read the Civ2 Strategy forum as a start. ICS is not the only way to go (thank goodness), but it would seem to match your current style;

Dave V's ICS Strategy as a PDF
or
Dave V's ICS Strategy as a web page

... although Father Beast has amassed a pretty wide collection of both threads and papers that you can access from this thread.

This all pertains to the 'original' game, and may not make such a precise fitting for Lalande (sci-fi), or the fantasy game, although could easily be adopted for the extended game.

[This message has been edited by Cam (edited November 13, 2000).]

[KhanMan]

One alternative to ICS or city-hordes (which used to be my main strategy) is building one super trade/science city. The city should be fairly large, and, if possible, have rivers and/or terrain specials near it.

Once you have a stable empire, say, between 6 and 10 nice cities, switch production in all cities that can spare to caravans, and have your super city build Collosus, Hanging Gardens, then Copernicus' Observatory.

All the while, use send all caravans to the super city, and use them to rush build wonders. Once you have the big three built, switch production in the super city to marketplace, temple, library. Use caravans to set up 3 trade routes from each city with your super city, and rush by the city improvements.

After that, you should be set. Build wonders, caravans, and your science rate will skyrocket.

Just so you know, when you start a trade route, the bonus in gold you get also has an equal bonus in science beakers...which gives this strategy it's strength...

Just some tips, of course.

-Khan

[Cam]

quote: Originally posted by cemcnulty on 11-14-2000 12:27 PM Any suggestions about when in the game caravans should start to be deployed?

Not wishing to sound 'clever clever' - but as soon as possible, bang out three caravans in each city and trade away! Exceptions always exist - don't throw 150 shields away if you've half built a Wonder, not if your city is likely to be attacked within a few turns (or under attack now), or you're really going the purist ICS approach. Early trade is one of those 'upper level' keys that you've been searching for.
[This message has been edited by Cam (edited November 14, 2000).]

[SandMonkey]

If you really love ICS, maybe you could take a crack at my strategy. I call it the ICS - Adam Smith variant. I get into monarchy ASAP (standard ICS), and build the Hanging Gardens (also standard ICS). Then I expand until the unhappiness is just too much to handle. I then try my hardest to get Mike's Chapel, Bach's Cathedral, or both. It's also a good idea to build the Statue of Liberty, as you can switch into communism MUCH earlier, which gives you an all-around strong government nearly perfect for ICS (Plus the happiness is MUCH better than in Monarchy). With this completed, build Adam Smith's Trading Company, which will make temples, libraries, marketplaces, and harbors all free of cost. With all those cities and virtually no expenses, you should have no problem keeping the taxes low and the science high.

I just used this strategy in my last game, and I was easily getting advances every 3 turns, and making 110 gold profit per turn (140 income, 30 cost!!).

One more add-on. This strategy works best with a Super Science City. That's where you build Colossus, Copes observitory, Isaac's College, a library and a university all in one city. When you get three trade routes from here... your science should be booming. I usually use this as my wonder city until I get ASTC, for no other reason that the next largest city n my entire empire is no larger than a size 3 or 4.

Ahh, yet another thing I thought of If you want to go the war route, make sure you get Sun Tzu's War Academy and Chivalry. Vet Knights are virtually unstopable when used in mass numbers. I like to build half knights half diplomats and destroy the city walls to ensure a victory for my army. When you're in peacetime, build caravans to either use for wonders, or just to pick up extra gold and science (Remember, for every traderoute, you get the amount of gold the window on screen tells you, but you also get thgat much in science beakers! So those 500 gold trade routes also give you 500 beakers, and can cut many turns off of your research time!)

I hope that's all... I hope that helped, as well I know those are a lot of wonders to get, but with tons of caravans and decent science, you should be able to get all of then. And for those you don't get... go take that city from the AI

Good luck!

P.S. I have used this strat to easily win on Emperor as well as King.

[cemcnulty]

I think I've been having a couple of problems. One is that I build cities like I'm following ICS, but after a city has a settler, I start building improvements. Looking back at old games, almost all of my cities were losing money, causing me to raise tax rates, slow science, etc.

I also grossly under use caravans. It's just this hang-up I have that I need to get over. The problem with caravans is they're just boring and tedious. a nice feature of Civ III would be an automation or at least a recommendation for establishing trade routes.

Any suggestions about when in the game caravans should start to be deployed?

I've started a new game at King level but with only three civs, one of whom I've already dispatched. Rather than just jumping in to King with 7 civs, I'm going to work my way up to it.

-Chuck