WWII 1938

[McMonkey]

While I finish off the Balkan Wars I have been playing with a new scenario idea designed for PBEM. I am using WWII Europa as the basis for a seven player game starting at the time of the Munich Crisis in 1938.

The nations are: Germany, Italy, Russia, France, Britain, America and the Axis, consisting of Finland, Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria. If anyone can think of a more appropriate name I am all ears. All other nations are barbarians.

I hope to make this a war game based on a clear set of objectives which will motivate the players to fight rather than build and trade in peace!
I also hope to keep some historical accuracy through house rules while leaving the players enough flexibility to change history. At the moment I am working through my concept to see if it would work. I hope we can have some fun discussing the house rules and objectives.

I will post my initial ideas below

[McMonkey]

HOUSE RULES

ALLIANCES:
1 - Germany may only ally with the Axis and Italy
2 - Italy may only ally wit Germany or the Axis
3 - Switzerland and Sweden are strictly neutral
4 - Britain, France and America may not attack Independent cities
5 - If Paris is captured France must become a German vassal

PRETEXTS FOR WAR:
6 - America must stay neutral until Pearl Harbour unless attacked. After Pearl Harbour America may then declare war if Britain is fighting Germany or if any nation attacks it.
7 - The Allies (Britain, France, America) can only declare war with a valid casus beli.
8 - If the Axis (Germany, Italy and Axis) attack any Independent city the Allies have a valid casus beli.
9 - The Axis (G/I/A) do not need a casus beli to attack Russia.

SPECIAL RULES:
a - A German invasion of Britain can only be carried out using Landing craft (1 Movement), Paratroopers, the Luftwaffe and the Kriegsmarine. No ship chaining allowed. Elsewhere Transports can be used to launch invasion.
This rule is designed to represent the difficulties the Germans would have faced launching an invasion of Britain against the RAF and Royal Navy. German Landing Craft will need to spend one turn at sea if it attacks between Calais or Dover!

I am sure this is a far from complete set of rules and I look forward to discussing what else is needed.

[McMonkey]

AXIS OBJECTIVES

- Pilsen (Skoda Works wonder) + repeating event creating German units once captured.
- Prague. Another repeating unit creation event.
- Warsaw (Sun Tzu wonder)
- Rotterdam
- Antwerp
- Paris (French capitulation - See House Rules)
- Bergen (Swedish Iron Ore shipment wonder)
- Tunis
- Belgrade
- Athens
- Iraklion
- Suez (Suez canal wonder)
- Mosul (Miiddle East oil wonder)
- Sevastopol
- Grozny (Caucasus oil wonder)
- Stalingrad
- Moscow
- Leningrad
- London
- Kuybyshev (Urals Industrial complex wonder)

[Case]

Re: HOUSE RULES

Those house rules seem much too restrictive, especially for a PBEM scenario. For instance

Originally posted by Werd100
2 - Italy may only ally wit Germany or the Axis

Historically, Italy could have stayed out of the war or sided with the Allies. Britain was pretty keen to stay on good terms with Italy and the Italian entry into the war in June 1940 didn't make any sense.

5 - If Paris is captured France must become a German vassal

Why? France *could* have fought on after the fall of Paris and in the context of a scenario it's possible that the French player could still possess a powerful military after Paris falls.

6 - America must stay neutral until Pearl Harbour unless attacked. After Pearl Harbour America may then declare war if Britain is fighting Germany or if any nation attacks it.

That doesn't make sense. By mid-1941 the US Navy was fighting an undecleared war with Germany and its quite feasible for the US to have entered the war if Britain had been invaded.

I really like the rule about the invasion of Britain though!

[McMonkey]

Thanks for the reply.

Re: Italy
The Italians do not have to ally with Germany or go to war. If they wish they can stay neutral. However I think it is highly unlikely that Mussolini would have allied with Britain or gone to war with Germany.

Re: France
Good point. Especially in the context of a PBEM. Historically they did capitulate and I would like to see this represented in the game. In effect the French would become Vichy France. I am more than willing to discuss alternative solutions though.

Re: USA
Very true. I do not want to completely dictate the course of events. However I think the American people were reluctant to get involved in another European war. What I do not want is the powerful US military intervening in 1938 over the Sudaten crisis. I would be willing to add a rule that America can declare war on Germany if Britain is invaded.

I am sure that there are lots of loopholes to find and anomalies to solve. Keep the feedback coming

[Varwnos]

You could give Greece and Serbia to Britain/France, since they were active parts of the allies

Also, if Italy does not have to be on its own, you could give it to Germany, naming the civ Germany/Italy, or Major Axis, then keeping the minor axis, and having a minor allies civ too (Greece and Serbia). Then you would have two minor blocks as well as two main ones.

Unless you can lose Usa and keep it as a set of events for Britain, then you can have:

-Major Axis
1.Italy
2.Germany

-Minor Axis
3.
Romania
Bulgaria
Finland

-Major Allies
4.Britain (+ Netherlands)
5.France
6.Russia

-Minor Allies
7.
Greece
Serbia

8. Independants

[McMonkey]

I definitely want to keep Italy and Germany separate. The map should be big enough for them to co-operate if they are allied. Together they would be too powerful. Also Italy may wish to stay neutral and wait for events to develop. That is historically feasible. Germany only got involved in Greece and North Africa to bail out the Italians. If Italy stays neutral the Mediterranean may stay unaffected by the war.

If Britain wants to intervene in Greece it can send troops from the middle east. Most of the Independents will be immobile so Axis or Allied armies can move about unhindered. I do not want the player to be attacked by their own allies.

I may return Belgium to the Independents as Britain can still send the BEF and fight in Belgium. Although the Allies cannot attack an Independent city they can liberate it from the Germans.

One thing I enjoy about PBEM games is the chance to form alliances and co-operate in a way that is very difficult in single player games. The USA could build bases in Britain. Britain could move their troops through French territory and so on.

As ever, if there were more playable Civs then things would be a lot easier. Saying that, I am not sure how a thirty player PBEM would work

[techumseh]

I was not going to announce this for a while, but in fairness to Werd 100 and his project, I think I should. Fairline and I have started work on a similar project, being the European theatre of WWII from 1938 onwards. Unlike Werd 100's scenario, ours will be strictly single player (German).

Great minds think alike, I guess.

[McMonkey]

Excellent news Tech! Look forward to hearing more.

This project is strictly multiplayer and hopefully it will be finished quite quickly as the map and a lot of the units are the same or similar as WWII Europa and the tech tree will be adapted from the one I have created for Fortress Europe.

Making a PBEM game is a lot quicker and easier than single player due to the lack of AI players. I will need to consider all the tricks people use to speed along trade and unit production but a lot of it takes care of itself when you have intelligent players.

My Fortress Europe project is on hold at the moment but will probably not take too long to finish once I can work up the enthusiasm to do the required testing, which is my least favourite part of construction!

I tend to get my fingers in a lot of pies but I hope to get them all finished at some point. My current projects status:

The Balkan Wars (MGE) - Not too far of completion. In the initial testing phase and looking good so far.

WWII 1938 (MGE) - As above!

WWII Europa (MGE) - Finished though I may fix all the bugs at some point.

Aeterna Civitas (MGE) - First version finished. Has a few minor bugs but it is playing well as a PBEM at Civ Webring. An improved PBEM version will commence when the current PBEM has finished.

Aeterna Civitas (ToT) - The single player Roman version is a future project. I have not started any work on this but I am gathering ideas.

Fortress Europe (ToT) - Close to completion once testing and tweaks are completed. Currently on hold!

The Vietnam War (ToT) - Work has stopped. There is still a lot of work to do, including a brand new map. I am sure I will go back to it one day, but at the moment it is too daunting.

I also have a couple of other PBEM ideas but I will try to finish at least the Balkan Wars and WWII 1938 before I start seriously. The two main ones are basically upgraded versions of two of John Ellis classics. Bonaparte II will use almost everything as it is on my well used Europe map. Hellas II will again use mostly the same units and tech tree but with a larger map and the Other Greeks replaced by the Carthaginians. Maybe a case of reinventing the wheel but these two will be tailored specifically for PBEM.

I find after several hours of work on a game I need a break and having several projects on the go allows me to stay creative. Finishing projects seems to be the bane of a lot of scenario creators though, something I am well aware of

[McMonkey]

Arctic Convoys

I need advice about a slightly unusual idea I have had

It has come about due to the nature of the map I am using. I want the Allies to be able to trade with Russia, even during wartime. Historically this was achieved through the Arctic convoys. As there is no room on my map for the arctic I have created a new city called Arctic Ports in the far north of Norway.

The idea is to have a valuable trade destination for the Allies to send their trade units to. During a war they will lack outlets other than the USA to Britain. What I need to know is how to make this city worth sending trade to and from. Do I add a Market Place, stock exchange and Colossus? What makes a city worth trading with.

I think this concept can only really work in a PBEM as the Russian player will need to follow some house rules. The city will be set up so that it does not grow. The Russian player will only be allowed to build Trade units and Freighters there. The German player may not attack the city directly but once it has bases in Norway it may attack the convoys with aircraft and of course it can attack any enemy convoy with its naval units.

I know this may be a dead end but if I can find a way of making it a really juicy destination for trade it may just work.

If anyone would care to enlighten me on the finer points of trade revenue I would be very grateful

EDIT: And Norway/Sweden is in effect an island on this particular map as it is not linked to Finland!

[McMonkey]

Think I have worked it out. Gave Arctic Ports the Colossus and Stock exchange etc plus some good trade resources. Trade from America now gets about 200 Gold extra compared with trading with London.

What I need to do is find a better name for the Axis (Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria and Finland). Calling them the 'Axis' is not satisfactory as it is innacurate and puts them in the German camp. I want the player to have a choice about which way they side.

Any better suggestions would be welcome!

[Tigey]

Interesting approach. Is the local terrain high in trade value? Airports + superhighways would help beef it up a bit. Assuming you haven't banned airports. If the Soviet Government type is one with corruption (ie: despotism, monarchy, republic or communism), then a courthouse would help too.


The downside, of course, is that the monetary/research benefits of the caravans go to the Western Allies, rather than to the Rodina.

[McMonkey]

Thanks

It is an approach forced by the constraints of the map. If I could have included the Arctic I would have. I wanted Norway to be an important theatre and not just a backwater, hence Arctic Ports and the Swedish Iron Ore wonder (Hoover Dam) in Oslo.

I did not realise Airports raised trade. With that and some routes I have managed to boost trade up to a healthy 66. Russia can use the Arctic Ports to produce trade units and send them to Britain and the US. During war this will be their only outlet other than to the Middle East.

I remember seeing an idea for Lend Lease, possibly in Eivinds Blitzkrieg 1936, where Russia gets allied units created through events when it destroys them. This seems like a good addition though I am not sure if the Allies will be that willing to give up their precious units. Could be a fun addition though!

[McMonkey]

Latest MGE map with corrections since the original. Had to squish the screenshot to fit the 800 pixel limit!

[curtsibling]

Nice European map -
Plenty of room to fight it out!

I am working on a Euro map too, though my own has a giant crater in Siberia!