The Vietnam War development thread

[fairline]

One approach with fire-bases would be to do what Exile did in his Cher scenario; fixed-position artillery with supplies of projectiles located in historical positions like Khe Sanh. The player would need to replenish artillery ammo through regular airlifts in order to keep the VC at bay. This would kinda limit the player through his inability to establish new fire-bases though....

@Werd: will this be playable as the US only? It'd be nice to have the option to be Giap and whup some yankee ass

[Cyrion]

Originally posted by Werd100
-Transport Helicopters. Flying settlers with a range of 12 that and build LZs (airbases) and Fire Bases (size 1 cities).

Can you make flying settlers? I had the feeling that settlers could only be land unit (like trade units) ??

[Michael Daumen]

They can fly; the problem might be paratrooping. At least back where they came from.

[battosai]

Wow, great Werd! You realize something i dreamed of since I bought my Apocalypse Now - DVD. A scenario of the ietnam war whose athmosphere comes close to the athmosphere of Martin Sheens gunboat odysse. Deep strategic and tactical thoughts over here, too. Those I like.

Will you either use bridges? On this map the Mekong could even be up to two squares wide or am I foolish?

[McMonkey]

@Fairline
I had already planned several (static) battleships at strategic locations off the coast with events creating shells on their grid ref. I guess it would make sense to have a few fixed land firebases but I do not think it would solve the problem entirely.
With city type fire bases the player can build cheap artillery shell to fire but there is no way of resupplying them from the main bases as you cannot airlift an air unit! It it possible to use the Ju52 trick with carriers? I will try it out. If it is possible then you could fly in extra ammo.

Version 1 will be designed for the US only. I intend to use the same map and graphics for version 2 which will be designed to play as the Communists only. By having two versions I can use the events, rules and tech tree to their full potential to make the game a challenge for the player!

@Michael Daumen
The Transport Helicopters (air settlers) can fly but not parachute! The idea is for them to fly in and build LZs and Fire Bases for other units to parachute into and back out of.
Redundant LZs can be pillaged and when the player decides to pull out of a size 1 Fire base he just builds another air settler. The city disbands on the next turn and the player is left with a Transport chopper that can simply dustoff to the next hot LZ!

At the moment I am having a problem with the A) 'tribe may build' mask in the advanced units fields. The ARVN and Thai units seem to be swapped over. I have thoroughly checked and cannot understand why. I can remedy it by simply swapping them over but it is bugging me! Has anyone else ever had problems with this?

[McMonkey]

@battosai

I'm glad you are digging the vibe man!

The mekong delta region is pretty huge and areas of it are pretty remote. The only way to get around will be along the roads or by boat and Charlie has got you by the balls either way. The solution will be Airmobility and the MRF or the brown water navy (see p1 of this thread). Up until the time you develop the Mobile Riverine Force the delta will be Charlies back yard.

You will glad to hear that there will be a River Patrol Boat, as seen in Apocalypse now,in this game and I may be persuaded to make a little mission to sail up into Cambodia and terminate Colonel Kurtz (as suggested by Von Bert!), we shall see

I would just like to say I am very much looking forward to your 30 years war scenario. Have you ever read a book called 'The War Hound and the Worlds pain' by Michael Moorcock, it got me interested in the era years ago and I can still remember burning of Magdeberg today!

[battosai]

To make it short and not regarding if anyone has mentioned this yet in the thread i haven't read throughout.

ToT - multiplains!! A second for an underworld,w hich be the realm of the Vietcong: the Ho-Chi-Minh-patch will lead thorugh the underground tunnels, totally invisible and unattackable by airforce. Maybe a third for air, making it possible for planes to fly over the borders and stuff.

[McMonkey]

@battosai

Stunning idea mate!

Earlier in this thread there was a discussion about the possibilities for civil unrest, protesters in the USA and the like. At the time I was tryingto gather ideas and see what would work. A friend at work who has played ToT mentioned the multiple maps and said I could use one for the USA. I thought this would be an excellent idea but as it was my first attempt at a ToT scenario is decided against trying it.

I love the idea of having the VC in an underworld of tunnels, out of the reach from the Americans. What I think I will do is make Version one for the USA to learn my stuff with ToT and then make the VC version on tow maps or possibly three (Tunnels/Vietnam/USA)!!!

Wow. I feel quite emotional now thinking of those tunnels. I think I need a stiff drink to calm my nerves. Thanks

P.s. I have just tested the concept of a Parachute Carrier and to my amazemant it works!!!
Now I can have one heavy lift helicopter to transport land units (Chinook) and another to transport artillery shells (Sky Crane)! The fire base concept is GO!

[Cyrion]

Originally posted by battosai
Have you ever read a book called 'The War Hound and the Worlds pain' by Michael Moorcock, it got me interested in the era years ago and I can still remember burning of Magdeberg today!

Followed by "the City in the Autumn Stars"!

I just started to reread all my Moorcock books, and was already thinking about doing an Hawkmoon scenario one day...

Originally posted by Werd100
A second for an underworld,w hich be the realm of the Vietcong

Now that is an amazing idea idea!!
Brilliant!

And Werd: I'm really surprised a parachuting carrier works! That will prove useful for me too, someday!

[Boco]

Originally posted by battosai
ToT - multiplains!! A second for an underworld,w hich be the realm of the Vietcong: the Ho-Chi-Minh-patch will lead thorugh the underground tunnels, totally invisible and unattackable by airforce. Maybe a third for air, making it possible for planes to fly over the borders and stuff.

Unfortunately, the AI is not so cooperative. There is no event to make a unit move between maps. You may end up with masses of VC collecting in a tunnel but unwilling to venture into daylight. It might work if you can set up a situation where the AI wants to move units from a tunnel to a valued objective, but it will take a lot of testing. Catfish, who has spent years setting up a situation where he can get orcs to flood Middle Earth from orc warrens, noted that units on secondary maps tend to sleep if they are located on small continents.

Perhaps you could give the VC intrinsic map-hopping talent, and then create patches of land on the tunnel "under" areas that you want them to appear. I use this approach for U-Boats in EA, which makes them very elusive. You can always sink 1-2 U-Boats, but never be sure there isn't another ready to counterattack.

One idea (which can be adopted for SciFi scens) that I've been playing with for another scenario is to have carriers serve as air units on the "air map". Although they cannot hop between maps, their ordnance can. That way they could drop bombs or fire missiles at units on the primary map. Enemy SAM's could then be represented by missiles on the "air" map. If the human's "aircraft" (carriers) cost enough, they will be a magnet for AI missile units. There's also a way to design combat factors on the "air" map to reflect the hit (and destroy) or miss nature of SAM's.

[battosai]

Damn the AI, i want to play a ****ing PBEM on this -NOW!

Soory - i ought to have closed my eyes yet.

[McMonkey]

Not being able to to put tunnels in the US version is not a big problem but I think it would be an excelent idea still for the communist version where the player could decide when to emerge from the tunnels and attack the imperialist pigs!

As I have not played any games on a multi map I think I should have a go at one before I start on the Communist version. What would be a good example of a multi map scenario?

[McMonkey]

Quick question. Where do you put the blue dots to hide the strength bar? I have tried all the combos but it will not budge!

[Patine]

A question. Will there be a house rule preventing smart-ass players from plowing roads through the jungle with their Transport Helicopters?

[AGRICOLA]

What would be a good example of a multi map scenario?

Curtsibling's Dalek Tyranny and the Midgard scen that comes with TOT are the only ones I know of.