HOTW4.0 Out of Charcter Thread part III

[deity]

Originally posted by OzzyKP
It seemed like everyone was interested in the alien ending. Who isn't?

We all agreed on the alien ending and to introduce those elements when Apollo is built.

In the mean time we agreed to play out the known situation.

I don't think we were all just meant to make peace and wait for the aliens.

[OzzyKP]

No, not just make peace and wait, but not eliminate someone too. By all means attack, by all means conquer, but hopefully all 6 of us can be around to see the end of the game.

[Berzerker]

That's what Raz did to India and then lost half his civ.

Oh geez, I took maybe 6 cities from him and destroyed 2 others. He has something like 40+ cities and most of the cities I attacked were little hamlets and used to be Tartar lands.

[deity]

But the point being that anyone who attacks in a limited way can't be protected from a major counter attack. So who's going to attack me in a limited way? If I get attacked you'd have to take out half my civ to stop a counter attack that might wipe the attacking civ out.

It's a weakness in the game, diplo or otherwise and the discussions on limiting howies is useful.

War4 suggested howies be reduced in attack to 10 or less and movement limited to one ages ago in Rah Rules but it wasn't adopted. Maybe it should be.

[Rasputin]

Originally posted by Berzerker


Oh geez, I took maybe 6 cities from him and destroyed 2 others. He has something like 40+ cities and most of the cities I attacked were little hamlets and used to be Tartar lands.

they were some of my largest citys .....

provided a alrge s**** of my income and production..

My desert ones were very limited

[OzzyKP]

Lets get a vote right here. Who wants an alien invasion ending that begins with the building of Apollo. Something to avoid bad feelings and a potential destruction of the game.

Ozzy: Yes.
Deity: Yes.
Raz: Yes.
Frank:
Berz:
Ljube:

[deity]

I support alien ending but that doesn't solve the problem of major late game wars.

I've had a think. We are at a defining moment in fine-tuning the diplo game paradigm. Alien invasdion aside we need some rules and settings so that massive civ-killing pre-emptive strikes and/or counter-strikes are more realistic and balanced. I think Frank is right when he said a lot of us were playing a diferent game! We were when you think about it! It's useless leaving this sort of stuff to"judgement" and "common sense". Unless it's cast iron there will always be bad feelings and misunderstandings.

Friendships and Fun.

OK, we change the rules right now!

SUGGEST:
* Howies attack at 10 with 1 movement only
* Get a pike flag that works against howies for something earlier than modern infrantry - say a standard unit like Alpines or even rifes!
* limit cities taken to THREE in any one turn followed by mandatory negotiations and the ceding of two cities back (maybe use a 50% world opinion to enforce the peace treaty if the victim doesn't accept a reasonable deal)
* limit nukes in some way?
range?
if you use a nuke you can only take ONE city in a turn and same deal applies as above

Let's sort this out and get it into the dipo FAQ for all time otherwise HOTW2 and HOTW4 will keep repeating themselves.

[deity]

I'll post a new save I'm doing on my own with some one else on my home network to replicate the first part of my move where I buld the rail and get troops to Urumqi. But I won't attack it and I only plan on a pre-emptive strike of just taking Urumqi only... then the new demand follows....

I'll post a new demand in the story thread and we'll scrap the other one.

We should play with the NEW RULES we agree on before the start of session.

If everyone agrees to this approach or something like it we may make diplo gaming HISTORY OF THE WORLD!!

[deity]

HOTW4_ALTERNATE_REALITY_a1690.net

I set up this save. I played my turn part the way through. 'Raz' was upstairs in my wifes bedroom on the other networked PC and ceded me those four cities and we made a temporary alliance So, no guiding issues

I built the rail, and moved a part of my attack force to Urumqi anticipating the new rules.

I think this will be much better, more realistic and no hard feelings! Some of the venom may go out of the game which might be a shame but let's steer this toward the alien ending, but in a way that is true to the original intentions of the civs ignorant of such future prospects.

[Frank Johnson]

You don't have to be a sore winner deity. Shut up already.

[Berzerker]

That does it, find me a permanent replacement

[Berzerker]

[Rasputin]

alien ending ok by me...

or conquest ok by me

[deity]

Originally posted by Frank Johnson
You don't have to be a sore winner deity. Shut up already.

LMAO

[deity]

I just tested the howies at 10/2 mvt 1

Didn't notice any difference in the attack but mvt 1 really makes a difference.

Something I depended on with massive attacks generally is the ability to replenish half spent howies by taking emptied cities. With mvt 1 you can't do this.